Independent Lens

-Musician Daryl Davis is on an unusual mission. -Hey, Gary. How you doing, man? -He meets and befriends members of the KKK. -I never set out to convert anybody. Some of them ended up converting themselves. -Now he owns their robes and hoods. -This is the robe of an Imperial Wizard. This is the hood. It's often called a helmet. As shameful as it is, the Ku Klux Klan is as American as baseball, apple pie, and Chevrolet. -Filmmaker Matt Ornstein follows one man's unorthodox relationship with the far right. -My people are being squeezed out of existence. We would fight to the last bullet. -When two enemies are talking, they're not fighting. I consider Frank to be my friend. -I consider Daryl to be my friend, as well. -How can you hate me when you don't even know me? These are my fellow Americans. -"Accidental Courtesy" now only on "Independent Lens." -Move out of the street!

Indistinct shouting

Move out of the street now!

Indistinct shouting

-I want to show you something that a lot of people walk by obliviously, even step on every day, and don't even realize it. -So, what are we looking at here, Daryl? -Okay, well, we're on the porch where Lincoln is sitting in his big chair. So you know, two of the greatest speeches ever given in this country were the Gettysburg Address by Abraham Lincoln and the "I Have a Dream" speech by Martin Luther King. Take a look right over here. In fact, somebody's standing on it right now. Excuse me a minute. This right here -- This is where he stood and gave that famous speech. -We will be able to speed up that day when all of God's children, black men and white men, Jews and gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, "Free at last. Free at last. Thank God almighty. We are free at last." -All you have is an etching in the concrete. There's no plaque, no sign. Millions of people trample all over that not even realizing how important that spot is. He says, "I have a dream." I call this stepping on the dream.

Indistinct conversations

Excuse me. -We don't have the concentration of the African-American businesses that we used to have. You know how you can go to almost any city and find Chinatown? We had our Soul Town. We had our soul-food places. We had jazz clubs in a concentrated community. We don't have that anymore. I miss that. -I'm used to being out at nighttime. So I'm always being stopped. My father was always being stopped. But on the night of 9/11, every street leading into Washington, DC, was road-blocked, and I had to get in line to be checked. It was my turn, and as I pulled up, the white officer looked at me and said, "Go ahead, sir." -Really? -And I thought, "Oh, my goodness. I've arrived." Because that night... the cops were not looking for black people. I haven't been here for a number of years. Suburban DC is where I live, in Maryland, right across the line. We're headed into the music store here at Chuck Levin's Washington Music Center. Bought my first keyboard from here. -I wanted to say I remember when you came to my middle school, Green Acres, when I was like sixth or seventh grade. -Professor Steckel. -Yep, yep, yep. And you talked about the Klan and that whole thing, and that, like, rocked my world then. And then I started working here, and you came in here. And then you're, like, in, you know, both sides of the world. And I see Daryl Davis in all worlds. -This is my teacher. How you doing? -How are you? -Good to see you. -He was very popular and a class leader. I do remember that. Otherwise, how would I remember your name from 1970? I do remember your name. -Back when my mom was sick with cancer, I would bring her down here for treatment. And so during that time, you know, I'd park the car, and I'd wander around Howard University campus. I'm glad that I came here to Howard. Musicians that I worked with, that I graduated with were some of the most talented individuals that I've ever seen. How you doing, man? Good to see you. How you doing? -Good, man. I read your book. -Oh, you did? -Yes, sir, when it first came out. -Oh, I appreciate that, man. Thank you. -It took a lot of heart and courage. I wanted to ask him, "Were you ever scared?" 'Cause I know I would have been scared. -Two men in Washington area are showing that even an African-American man and a member of the Ku Klux Klan can find common ground. CNN's Carl Rochelle reports. -Daryl Davis plays a hot piano. It's part of the show, and it makes him stand out. He also stands out here. Davis is one of the few African-Americans you will ever find attending a KKK rally. More than attending, he is welcome. -I got more respect for that black man than I do you white niggers out there.

Cheers and applause

-Let's say you and 20 other people have this group that is anti-racist. And all you do is talk about how bad racism is. Well, what good is that group doing? All you're doing is preaching to the choir. If you and I agree, I'm not accomplishing anything by trying to convince you of what you already know. The way you resolve that is you invite somebody to the table who disagrees with you so you can understand why they have that point of view. Then, perhaps, you will figure out a solution to dissuade their fears. -We believe that God has commanded us to separate ourselves from other races. The Klan is not beaten, and the white race is not beaten. -It'll be a matter of time. We're gonna take America back. It's gonna be the bloodiest war this country's ever seen. -And according to the Southern Poverty Law Center, there are currently 784 active hate groups operating across the country, a number that is growing. -Among the huge crowds that greet Donald Trump in city after city are members of the newly coined alt-right. -I would describe it in the terms that they don't like to use and they are redefining -- racist Klan members, Nazis, Neo-Nazis. -They had robo calls that flooded Iowa and New Hampshire voters. The message -- "We are white supremacists. Donald Trump is our man." -Do you think now the rest of the country is beginning to get it? -I hope so. It's been a threat the whole time. There's been a body toll the whole time. -There's a guy with a rifle here shooting at people. -Police say the suspect has ties to white supremacists. -But this is something that's a wake-up call really for everyone in the nation. -White power! -White power! -They're not human. There's nothing about these people that are human. -What we have seen in the last few years is really an explosion. When things really took off in the most dramatic way was in the fall of 2008, when we saw the beginning of an enormous expansion in the number of both so-called patriot groups, or what we all used to call militia groups, and hate groups like the Klan. Klan members are very much still involved in racial violence, and they essentially live on hatred. -White power! -There was a Klan plot in Texas, northwest of Fort Worth, which involved blowing up a natural-gas refinery that was located right next to an elementary school. The idea was that all police and the authorities, EMTs, and so on would rush to the site of this disaster, and this little, tiny Klan group, meanwhile, would run across to the other end of the county and start robbing banks in order to fund the race war. Federal authorities announced that had these men and this one woman succeeded, they would have murdered more than 10 times the number of people killed on 9/11. -I do believe integration is wrong. -We are concerned about what we view to be a white genocide. -My people are being squeezed out of existence. We would fight to the last bullet for our people. -I have seen the future. I know what can be done. I know how people can get along. It bothers me that they can't see that when there are so many examples, or they're not willing to see it. DC is known pretty much for just about every musical style. Bo Diddley lived here for a while, Link Wray, the legendary Chuck Brown, Danny Gatton, Roberta Flack, the late, great Marvin Gaye, Duke Ellington, the King of Jazz. I thought of being a diplomat. I thought of being an espionage agent. I thought of being a computer programmer. But a funny thing happened on my way to being those things -- I saw a rock concert, a couple of rock concerts with Chuck Berry, with Elvis Presley. And I got sidetracked. So now I'm a musician.

Laughs

Today I'm a musician, actor, author, and a lecturer. I just arrived in Los Angeles, California. I'm here to give a lecture this evening at University of California, Irvine. It's a pleasure to be here at University of California, Irvine. Thank you all for having me. This lecture tonight is not so much about the Ku Klux Klan as it is about building relationships and understanding and embracing differences. Always keep the lines of communication open with your adversaries, regardless of what the topic is. When two enemies are talking, they're not fighting. They might be yelling and screaming and shouting and beating their fists on the table, but at least they're talking, and they're not fighting. -I believe in separation. We've had integration now for 50 years, and nobody seems to realize it don't work. -I mean, don't you have churches that only cater to blacks, though? -Yeah, because we couldn't get into the white churches.

Laughter

Y'all see this fine figure right here? Huh? I didn't put this on overnight. I want to lose it. I'm not gonna lose it by tomorrow, but if I work on it, over time, it will shrink down. When you're ingrained in this stuff, you're not gonna shut it off overnight.

Applause

Y'all know who Geraldo is? Okay, I was on his show with some Neo-Nazis and some Klan. -KKK kids, children too young to hate. Daryl, I want to ask you have they enacted children's movement? -The children's movement started with a fellow named Tony LaRicci in the state of Maryland, who formed the Klan Youth Corps. -Okay, Mike, why don't you lead out the various Klan families? And your name and age? -My name's Erin, and I'm 12. -So, what do you think about your parents belonging to these organizations? -I think it's fine. -Why, sweetie? -I mean, they're allowed to like their race. They're allowed to be proud of who they are, too. -Are you going to be a member of the group, also? -Yes. -So now both daughters are in the Klan. And their father -- He got sentenced to 10 years in a federal prison. So I thought, "You know what? I'm gonna call Tina, the mother." I tracked down her number. I called her. And when I said, "Tina, this is Daryl Davis," she hit the roof. She cursed me up one side and down the other. Wanted to know how did I get her phone number, what did I want, blah, blah, blah. I said, "Tina, shut up and listen to me for a second." I flew with them to Chicago and drove them out to Marion, Illinois, to the federal penitentiary, where their father was imprisoned so they could visit him. And nobody in the Klan had ever done that for them before. And then so they had a turnaround. -Well, my little girl came a long way, you know, no thanks to her father and I. We really did our best to destroy our kids. And I do believe God does work through people -- other human beings -- and he most certainly uses Daryl Davis as an instrument because that man has touched a lot of lives. -Me and my husband, Harley, would like to extend our best wishes to the city of Rockville, Maryland, as you celebrate the life and legacy of Dr. Martin Luther King. Neither me nor my family are members or are affiliated with the Ku Klux Klan anymore. -Last couple questions. Anybody else? -This man is an unwritten civil-rights hero. Before any other, it was his music. When Chuck Berry came out there playing that rock 'n' roll, white kids and black kids could not sit still. They bounced up out of their chairs, knocked over the ropes, and began boogieing and dancing in the aisles together for the first time in American history. - In the evenin' when the sun is sinkin' low -He'll play a lick, and then I'll imitate his lick. -And these are things that you don't plan. -Right. All spontaneous. That's rock 'n' roll, though.

Indistinct conversations

Where Do we go from here? Where -I'm standing on the property of Campovida in Hopland, California, where I've been invited to come and give a lecture for the Do Lecture Series.

Applause

Thank you, Peter, and good morning. -Good morning. -It's really an honor to be here. Thank you all very much for having me. How can you hate me when you don't even know me? Throughout my life, I've been looking for an answer to that. Well, who better to ask than someone who would join an organization whose whole premise is hating people who do not look like them? So I began seeking out members of the Ku Klux Klan. They're not hard to find. You know, they're -- Trust me. They're all over. Well, CNN got wind of this and wanted to do a story. I got the name of the head of the Klan in Maryland, and they said, "Do you think Mr. Kelly will even talk to us?" I said, "I'll do better than that. I'll get Mr. Kelly to come back to my house, and you can interview the head of the Ku Klux Klan inside a black man's house." -I believe in separation of the races. I believe that's in the best interest of all races. -Does he really? Or has friendship transcended the color barrier? Listen to Kelly at a Klan rally. -I will follow that man to hell and back 'cause I believe in what he stands for, and he believes in what I stand for. A lot of times, we don't agree with everything, but at least he respects me to sit down and listen to me. And I respect him to sit down and listen to him. -We're enemies. He's the head of the Klan. I'm a black guy. But he respected me to sit down and listen to him. And in exchange, he sat down and listened to me. I did not respect what he had to say. I respected his right to say it. -We get to know one another, and we do different things. You know, it hasn't changed my views about the Klan, you know, because my views on the Klan's been pretty much cemented in my mind for years. -We kept on doing that. He and I became the best of friends. And over a period of time, that cement that was in his mind, that held his ideas together began to crack. And then it crumbled. And then a few years later, Roger Kelly quit the Ku Klux Klan. Today he no longer believes in what he said on that video.

Applause

And when Roger Kelly quit the Ku Klux Klan, he gave me his robe and hood, okay? This is the robe of the Klan leader, the same one that you saw him wearing in the video. And of course... the hood. The hood and the mask. We are living in space-age times, but there are too many of us still thinking with stone-age minds. The way to solve this is you people. Let's talk to each other. Let's get the job done. Thank you all very much.

Applause

I enjoy sharing my story, especially when other people find it inspiring and influential on their own lives because then they in turn go and share that story with others. Ooh I know you never had money sense Make just enough to cover rent It's not the cash that's got you feeling... -In this bag, I have three of the robes of my collection. This first robe belonged to a Grand Dragon. Grand Dragon is the state leader, top man in the state. And "Grand" is signified by the green. This fellow wore a dragon patch. Under his green cape is another dragon patch. This Grand Dragon preferred the satin. This is the robe of an Imperial Wizard -- the top guy. This is a white cotton robe with blue adornments, blue stripes, blue sash, and blue cape. And of course, you see the Klan emblem, the MIOAK. This is the hood. It's often called a helmet. Members who want anonymity -- they don't want you to know who they are -- They wear this mask and peep at you through these eyelets. -How many robes like this do you think you have? -I don't know. It's hard to say. I've got a bunch of them. Couple dozen or more, you know? -And they each represent a different person who is no longer in the Klan. -Yes. That is correct. People always say to me, "Daryl, how can you have this stuff? Why don't you burn it?" Well, no, as shameful as it is, this is a part of American history. You don't burn our history, regardless of the good, the bad, and the ugly. And the Ku Klux Klan is as American as baseball, apple pie, and Chevrolet. The Klan was formed on Christmas Eve 1865 at the end of the Civil War by six Confederate generals. And it was more or less a social club where people have the same ideologies, same beliefs. They'd dress up in these sheets, pillowcases, or whatever, cover their faces, and they became the para-law enforcement, if you will. A lot of the freed black slaves at the time were superstitious. And they would come on horseback, with their horses draped in sheets, as well, and tell these black people that they were the ghosts of dead Confederate soldiers. And this would, of course, you know, scare them and keep them in line. "These people are free, but we can still control them."

Engine turns over

-Where are we headed today, Daryl? -We're headed up to a town in Washington County, Maryland, to visit a former Great Titan, which means a county leader. He still has some of those views, but slowly but surely, they are diminishing, as his group of friends begins to widen in diversity. Hey, Gary. How you doing, man? -How you doing? -Good to see you. -Here's my Great Titan robe here. Had the black sash, the stripes, and the belt. You want me to put it on? -Yeah. -I don't think it'll fit anymore. -Ideologically wise, or physical? -It won't. I'm a little buffed up now, you know? -But it still fits ideological, right? -Yeah. -Who's this to your right? -He's a friend of mine, Daryl Davis. He was taking a Grand Dragon of the Klan to do an interview at Howard University, and I was one of the bodyguards. And Daryl drove us down. He was our butler -- or, not butler. But a chauffeur. He was our chauffeur on the way down. What prompted me to join was I grew up in a neighborhood where, you know, it was mostly dominated by blacks, and, you know, we were kind of the minority. And, you know, if you got in a fight with one of them, then you had to fight them all. You were kind of by yourself. -Did you get into a lot of fights with black people or what? -Fighting a gang. Yeah, yeah, I got in a lot of fights. -What was your title then? -I think I was a Great Titan. -What does that mean? -He can explain more of that than I can. -Gary went from a rank-and-file member to Exalted Cyclops. He rose to the level of Great Titan, which means county leader. He didn't know what a Great Titan was supposed to do, and he was too embarrassed to ask his higher-ups what his new duties were 'cause he hadn't studied enough Klan craft. He called me. -All right, Daryl. -I was born in Chicago, Illinois, in 1958. My father started out being a Secret Service agent, and then he left the Secret Service and joined the Foreign Service. -How unusual was that for a black man in that era to have that job? -At the time, it was rather rare. This is a photo of my dad and I at the Acropolis. I first went overseas when I was 3 years old. It was great to see all these different things I'd never seen before, but I didn't reflect upon it as something that was special because I figured all kids did this. I didn't know any better. I lived in Guinea from age 10 thorough age 12. I learned to get along with anybody and everybody regardless of what they looked like, how they worshipped, what they believed. That was my experience as a young child. My school might as well have been the United Nations 'cause every embassy -- people who had kids in that country in that time, we all went to the same school together. That's how I grew up. This is my 4th-grade class photo from Payson Park Elementary School in Belmont, Massachusetts. As you can see, I am the only black kid in the class. In fact, I was one of two black kids in the entire school. Most of my friends were 4th and 5th graders. Consequently, they all were white. And a lot of my guy friends were members of the Cub Scouts. I'd only been in town a couple months in 1968, and they invited me to join the Cub Scouts. So, you know, that sounded like fun, you know, get to tie some knots, go camping. And I joined the Cub Scouts. On Scout Day, we had a march. I was the only black scout in that parade. And my den mother let me carry the American flag. So as I'm marching down this parade route with my fellow scouts, you know, the sidewalks are lined with people waving flags and cheering and carrying on. And somewhere down the parade route, I began getting hit with bottles and rocks, soda-pop cans. And me, being naive, having never experienced anything like this, my first inclination was, "Oh, that group of people over there on the sidewalk doesn't like the Scouts." Of course, you know, they were white people. It did not occur to me until my den mother, my troop leader, my pack leader, my Cubmaster, you know, all came back in the line and huddled over me with their bodies to shield me and protect me and escort me out of the danger, that I was the only target of these projectiles. So naturally, I said, "Well, why are they hitting me?" And all they would say is, "Shh, move along, Daryl. Hurry. Move along. Move along. It'll be okay." They never answered my question. And so when I got home, my mother and father, who were not at the march, were fixing me up and asking me, "How did you fall down and get all scraped up?" I told them, "I didn't fall down." I told them what happened. And for the first time in my life, my mom and dad sat me down and explained why I was being hit. I did not believe them. My mom and dad were lying to me. And my mom and dad had never lied to me. But they said something to the effect of, "There are people who simply do not like you for no other reason than the color of your skin." Having been all over the world by age 10, I saw all kinds of colors of people. My classes were filled with people from Nigeria, Japan, Russia, England, France, Germany, you know, China. So there were all hues, all colors. And we all got along. And so now you're gonna tell me somebody doesn't like somebody else's skin color and they're gonna throw things at you? It was incomprehensible to me. In 1983, I was three years graduated from college with my degree in music, and country music had made a resurgence in this country. A lot of clubs that were playing top 40 and whatever else had switched over to country. There had been this movie called "Urban Cowboy," and they had this mechanical bull. Everybody was doing these line dances and stuff. So a lot of the bars, you know, were now turning into country bars. And if you wanted to play music full-time, you know, you had to go with the flow. And so I joined a country band. - I'm the black sheep of the family -We played a truck stop up in a place called Frederick, Maryland, called the Silver Dollar Lounge. So here I was with this band -- only black person in the band or in the lounge. We finished the first set, and on the break, I came down off the bandstand. I'm walking across the dance floor, and this white gentleman in his 40s walks up behind me and puts his arm around my shoulder. And he says, "I really like your all's music." I said, "Thank you. I appreciate that." I shook his hand. And he says, "You know, this is the first time I ever heard a black man play piano like Jerry Lee Lewis." And I just said, "Where do you think Jerry Lee Lewis learned how to play? From black blues and boogie-woogie piano players." "Oh, no, no, no, no, no. Jerry Lee invented that." I said, "No, he didn't." We argued back and forth. But he wanted to buy me a drink. Now, I don't drink, but I agreed to go back to his table. So I go back there. He had a buddy sitting there at the table. He pulls a chair around the other side, sits next to his buddy, and I sit opposite both of them. And then he says, "You know, this is the first time I ever sat down and had a drink with a black man." I asked him why, and he didn't answer me. He stared down at the tabletop. His buddy said, "Tell him, tell him, tell him," elbowing him in the ribs. And I said, "Tell me. I mean, what's this big secret?" He looks at me just as plain as day, and he says, "I'm a member of the Ku Klux Klan."

Laughs

He gave me his phone number and wanted me to call him any time I was to come back to this bar with this band 'cause he wanted to bring his friends. You know, his friends. He'd come with these Klansmen and other Klanswomen, and they'd gather around and watch me play piano and then get on the dance floor and dance. Not in their robes and hoods. You know, they came in regular clothes, right? -One more time, Daryl? -Why do you prefer to meet Klan members face to face? -They can't know the real me through e-mail or through Facebook. Just sitting across from somebody, meeting somebody, getting that sense of them -- That's the key right there. If you have an adversary, someone with an opposing point of view, regardless of how extreme it may be -- and believe me, I've heard things that have cut me to the bone -- but give that person a platform. Allow them to air their views. And when you do things like that, there is an excellent chance that people will reciprocate. Jeff Schoep currently heads the National Socialist Movement. -The National Socialist Movement is the largest Neo-Nazi group in the United States. 40-year-old Jeff Schoep, who goes by the title "Commander," leads about 55 chapters of the NSM. -Jeff Schoep, National Socialist Movement. -Daryl Davis. -Nice to meet you. -My pleasure. I've heard a lot about you for years. -National Socialist Movement travels all over the country on behalf of white citizens, on behalf of white rights. You know, people ask me, "Are you a white supremacist?" No, I'm not a white supremacist. White separatist? White nationalist? Yeah, sure. Basically, when you have white people that are standing up in society today that are talking about white pride or white issues, they're often called racists or bigots or hatemongers. If you watch any of my speeches or things like that, I'm not out there saying, "nigger," "kike," or cuss words or things of that nature. And most of our leadership doesn't, either. You know, white people should be able to stand up for white issues, just as the other races have, without it being called hate. -Would you compare yourself to Martin Luther King? -In some ways. In some ways. -Which way? -He was campaigning for his causes in a peaceful manner, and that's what we're doing. A black gentleman came up and he says, "It's just black rage. It's just black rage. That's why they's doing that. It's just young black kids taking it out on whitey 'cause it's black rage." Well, guess what, black man. There's white rage, too! The American melting-pot experiment is something that we believe hasn't worked. History has proven that we can't all get along. I'm from Detroit, so my experience living amongst many black people is that a lot of them feel that white people have oppressed them and held them down. -Is there any truth to that at all? -I don't feel there is. -Really? -I don't feel there is. -When they were brought over here against their will, forced to work for nothing. Their women were raped by the slave masters. Their children were sold on the courthouse steps. -As far as slavery is concerned, it was a travesty -- a human travesty, and it was something that should've never happened and should've never taken place and it was very unfortunate, even though it's been hundreds of years, and some of the animosity I think is still there. -You can go back 50 years. We still had Jim Crow laws. This was, you know, 100 years after slavery. And we still see it lingering today. I'm not justifying hatred, but I'm just giving you a reason why there's some animosity there. -That's what I'm saying. It's better if we separate amongst the racial groups so we don't have these sorts of things. -Do you predict that there will be a race war, or do you think it will be averted? -To speak a little more frankly and a little bit more radically, we wouldn't like to see a race war, but if it comes, you know, we intend to finish it. What we'd like to see is a white nation state. We would like to see our country liberated from the Zionists, first and foremost, and then handle the racial issues from there. -So you consider Jews to be a race, as opposed to a religion? -Absolutely. And we feel that they're basically an enemy of the state. -Are you a big proponent of the ideology of Adolf Hitler? -We are inspired by the political ideology of Adolf Hitler, but I don't like to get into the Holocaust, or as we'd say, the so-called Holocaust, you know? -Do you believe that it did happen, didn't happen, or did not happen to the degree that we're taught it happened? -It did not happen to the degree that we're taught it happened. -Could I join the NSM? There are white people in the NAACP. -The membership is just open to white people. -So it's racist? -I wouldn't say it's racist. -Well, what is it? -It's geared towards white people. You men and women that are here today, if we are going to take back this nation, we have to stand in solidarity. White power. -White power. -What kind of music do you like, Jeff? -All kinds of music. -Yeah? -Rock, hard-core, Oi!, RAC, Rock Against Communism. -And do you realize that rock was invented by black musicians? -Oh, we're not gonna go there. -Oh, yes, we are. Oh, yes, we are. Yes, my brother. We're going there. Well, who invented rock, then? -Elvis Presley. -

Laughs

You're not being serious, right? -Why not? -I know a man as intelligent as you are, and trust me, I'm one of the biggest Elvis fans you'll ever meet, but Elvis Presley himself would say he did not invent rock 'n' roll. He attributed it to people like Chuck Berry and Fats Domino and the blues. -You're a musician, so you probably know some more things about music than I do as far as going back and all that, but I think it's irrelevant. You know, whoever created the music, if music is good, music is good. It doesn't matter who created it, does it? -Well, it matters that credit is given where credit is due 'cause, you know, you're trying to give credit to the white forefathers of this country. What difference does it make? I'm here now. Ben Franklin's not sitting here. -No. -Abraham Lincoln's not sitting here. I don't give a...about Abraham Lincoln or Ben Franklin. I'm just saying, like you're saying, "What difference does it make?" -I know black people invented peanut butter, and I like that. -

Laughs

-What was his name? Come on, come on, come on, come on. -Was it Carver? -First name? -George Washington Carver. -My man. My man! -My name is Mark Potok. I'm a senior fellow at the Southern Poverty Law Center in these offices. We are now in Montgomery, Alabama. The Center was formed in 1971, and essentially, the idea of the Center was that it would continue the work of the Civil Rights movement, which, in a kind of formal sense, ended with the assassination of Martin Luther King in '68. The center really is best known for its suits against Klan groups and other related hate groups. -I'm trying to get into the minds of people like that by actually not putting them, you know, on the spot following the research, but in social situations. Like, I am a professional musician. I would invite them to my gigs to see my band play, try to sit down, have dinner with people. And through that process, some of them have rethought their ideology. Of course, there will be those who will go to their graves being hateful and being violent and who will never leave, you know, that ideology. -Our intention is, if possible, to destroy these groups. If that's not possible, to marginalize them politically. -But I come from more of a thing of trying to understand and trying to set an example and trying to explain things and see if they can't take a stand themselves, to redirect their thinking and perhaps rehabilitate their own ideology. -We've helped a lot of people out of groups, but we don't go in and have coffee with a Klan leader at all. I mean, my experience has been that by and large, people come out of these groups when they're ready to.

Engine revs

-Frank Ancona is the president and Imperial Wizard of the True Invisible Empire Traditionalist American Knights of the KKK. -The Klan, being a Christian organization, our belief is that for America to survive, it needs to be under white Christian rule. -We're on our way right now to see Frank Ancona, who is the Imperial Wizard of the Traditionalist American Knights of the Ku Klux Klan, which is currently the largest Ku Klux Klan organization in our country. Hey, Frank. How you doing, man? Good to see you. -How are you? -All right. Great. Have a seat. -All right. -I've known Frank for a little over three years now. I consider Frank to be my friend. -I consider Daryl to be my friend, as well. We met through -- Someone was wanting to do an interview, so I think we talked for a few months even before the interview. -Yeah, we did. -Had a lot of good conversations with each other. I felt like, "Hey, this is somebody I can relate to." I joined because of the heritage, the history. I like the fraternal brotherhood aspect of it, you know, the mysteriousness of the Klan. We're called the Traditionalist American Knights because we are an American organization. We believe in traditional American values. -You made a statement to me -- "The crow and the eagle don't fly together, but yet they're both birds." How far does the TAK go? Where is the separation? We can go to school together. We can work jobs together. We can play together in the park. -As far as reproducing, we believe -- -Miscegenation. -Right. We don't believe in the mixing of the races. There's, you know, a story about the Tower of Babel, where God kind of spread them out, all each with their own tribe, culture, race. So, I mean, we believe there's a Biblical principle to it. I raise my children as far as Christian beliefs. I don't push Klan doctrine on them. You know, I don't -- That's -- That's their decision. You know, if they ask me a question about it, I'll answer it. I got a daughter that's 12 years old. She's got no interest in it. She's into playing her XBox and going shopping at the mall. -Now, explain why some Klan groups will accept Neo-Nazis into their group, and some Klan groups, you know, reject Neo-Nazis. -Really, we don't believe in the same thing. I mean, the Nazis basically want a white homeland. That's not the mission of the Klan. Nazism, socialism -- That's anti-American. We're supposed to support the US Constitution. We believe in the free exercise of our rights. Daryl had been interviewed by different media personalities. He actually came to the defense of Traditionalist American Knights on a couple things. So I wanted to present this Certificate of Friendship to Daryl. -Thank you very much. It says, "Traditionalist American Knights of the Ku Klux Klan Certificate of Friendship presented to Daryl Davis in recognition for his friendship and contributions to the Traditionalist American Knights in demonstrating true friendship." While I don't necessarily agree with his separatist ideology, I consider Frank Ancona to be a friend of mine. Actually, I consider him to be a very good friend of mine. I've been into his home. I've met his wife and daughter. And we've had great conversations for several years now. -Whatever the man may say at the dinner table, however nicely he treats his kids and his dog, the fact is he is pouring hatred out there into the public square, which goes way beyond Frank Ancona. -I don't know if my point's pointing. Don't want to be limp. Ah. The hood is supposed to symbolize the head of a dove. And then the cape symbolizes the wings. -I mean, you know, look, I think you're working on a retail strategy. We're working on the wholesale strategy. -Mm-hmm. -You know, we can't wait around. -I understand that. -And maybe Frank Ancona will find redemption, and good for him. I'm not motivated by personal hatred of Frank Ancona. There's a larger poison at work here than just the question of, "Is Frank Ancona personally a bad man?" This is the charter of the United Klans of America, which was one of the most dangerous Klan groups, most violent Klan groups during the Civil Rights movement between 1954 and 1968. This charter was surrendered to the Southern Poverty Law Center at the conclusion of our civil case against the UKA. -This went to become known as the Million Dollar Quartet -- Jerry Lee Lewis, Carl Perkins, Johnny Cash, and Elvis Presley. I've had the pleasure of meeting all four of these gentlemen. We're here in Sun Studios in Memphis, Tennessee, where a lot of famous people were put on the map right here in this studio. During the daytime, they have tourists here, but in the evenings, musicians come in and actually record here, so they can say they recorded in the same space as some of these great legends. -Ready? Well, that's all right, mama That's all right with you That's all right, mama Just any way you do That's all right That's all right That's all right, little mama Any way you do - Goodness, gracious, great balls of fire Kiss me, baby, ow Feels so good Hold me, darlin' Wanna love you like a lover should You're fine, so kind Gotta tell the world that you're mine, mine, mine, mine Chew my nails and I twiddle my thumbs Real nervous, but it sure is fun Come on, baby, drive me crazy Goodness, gracious, great balls of fire We're standing in front of the Lorraine Motel in Memphis, Tennessee, the site of the assassination of Martin Luther King Jr. -These cars were actually as they were, you know, when Dr. King was here. -Uh-huh. -We've kept the room exactly as it was -- both rooms, actually -- exactly as it was on April 4, 1968. -You know, I was 10 years old when the assassination took place. And I was watching "Bewitched." All of a sudden, in the middle of this program that I'm entranced in watching, "Beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep." And the words "Special Bulletin" appears. And this guy comes on saying, you know, "We are interrupting this program to bring you this special announcement." -Good evening. Dr. Martin Luther King, the apostle of nonviolence in the Civil Rights movement, has been shot to death in Memphis, Tennessee. -Initially, I could not understand, "Why

couldn't it wait until the 6

00 news, like everything else?" Maybe my father would know who he is. And I told him about this guy who came on TV and said that somebody named Martin Luther King had just been assassinated. And my father's head fell into his hands. And I'd seen my mom cry. I'd never seen my father cry, but he cried then. And I didn't get it. I didn't understand it. And then my father explained to me who Martin Luther King was and that my father had marched with Martin Luther King and all the great things that he had done. And so almost instantly, this guy became a hero to me. And I learned very quickly, you know, who he was, his significance, and his importance not just in my life but in a lot of people's lives and what he was trying to accomplish in bringing our society together. Because of the people like the ones who threw rocks at me, these same kinds of people threw bombs inside his house and his churches where he would preach. - He did not grant

Explosion

couldn't it wait until the 6

It's hard to think That this great man is dead Oh, yeah -Well, you know, it's really important that it not just be considered history. This is not a history museum, although we have history chronicled in it. -Right. -It is a museum that talks about what was going on during a period that was one of the most significant in American history and that it parallels what's going on today. We're still fighting to vote. -Yes, we are. -We're celebrating 50 years of Selma and passing of the Voting Rights Act, and we still have folks that cannot vote. That's why when we talk about the Civil Rights movement, we don't talk about it in the past. -So what's gonna happen when Obama gets out of office? Are we only gonna study Obama in the month of February because he's black? Put him in the February box? -The National Civil Rights Museum is 365, 24/7 black history, in the context of it being American history. This country is what it is, and it's been through a lot of growth. -But it can change, yes. -Yes. -It's come a long ways, but it still has a long ways to go. -An awful long way, as news will tell you. -Get back! Get back! Get back! Get back! -Hey! Hey!

Indistinct shouting

couldn't it wait until the 6

-What aspects of his dream would you say have become reality, and which ones still need to be realized? -Oh, wow. That's a huge question. -It is. -How long is this documentary? -It's a living documentary. -Right, it's got to be. It must be -- It's gonna be like "Roots." You can kill the dreamer, but you can't kill the dream. -Right. -And that's so true, if you understand what that dream was about. -Folks, you'd better stop and think 'Cause we're heading for the brink What will happen now that he is dead? Folks, you'd better stop and think -I'm standing here on the tomb of a murderer and a coward and a terrible general. He was also a slave trader who went on to murder his slaves instead of freeing them, like all other Confederate generals did at the end of the Civil War. His name was Nathan Bedford Forrest, who went on to become the first Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan. Now, is there a place for Nathan Bedford Forrest besides hell? Yes, there is. You know, perhaps in a museum or in the history books. But I don't think he should be somewhere, you know, where you honor somebody. I wouldn't have a problem leaving the name as Confederate Park and having all the Confederate stuff placed right here, you know, rather than scattered all over town. It's sort of like, you know, going to see an internment camp in Germany or something. -The director of the Ku Klux Klan is hoping the remains of a Confederate general will be relocated from Memphis to Arkansas. General Nathan Bedford Forrest is believed to have started the KKK. Now, in recent weeks, a statue that sits atop the remains of Forrest and his wife had "Black Lives Matter" spray-painted on it. The Memphis city council has voted to remove the remains and statue, but KKK director Tom Robb is concerned they could still be damaged if they stay in Tennessee. -We feel this would be a proper place, in a Christian setting. -Robb says the relocated remains could potentially end up just a few yards in front of the main office. But he says relocating those remains outside of the city, let alone the state, could be a long shot. -But then miracles do happen. -Thomas Robb has the oldest Klan group in the country currently. He believes in white supremacy. He also believes in white separatism. He knows the history of the Klan, which is why he's gotten his image away from them, but yet he still maintains the name Ku Klux Klan because it draws attention to him. -I'll defend my race, my faith, and my homeland, come what may. White people did dominate this country, control this country, created this country, were the architects of the country. They want to preserve their neighborhoods, their ethnic identity -- all those things that they can identify with as a people. -Now, I guess, in your opinion, you would call it being defiled if you were to have black blood in you, or if your daughter or one of your family members were to have some black blood in them. -I would consider it probably a further erosion of white people towards the ultimate conclusion of white genocide. -You know Daryl's wife is white? -I'm aware of that. -How do you feel about that? -I certainly find it reprehensible. -What is reprehensible about it? -Pardon? -What is reprehensible about it? She loves me. I love her. -Whatever. You know, I'm not gonna try to argue -- even discuss it, argue, but the point is, you know, you're a black man. You see the world from a different world view than I do. -But apparently, she and I see the same world view. -Well, I'm telling you the way I see it. -I've heard you use the term "genocide," but I understand you don't believe the Holocaust happened. -Are you talking about the Holocaust of the Russian people? -I just read that you -- -I mean, 63 million Russian Christian Ukrainians were killed and murdered by the Soviets in 1912. Are you talking about that Holocaust? -I read that you awakened to the myth of the Holocaust at like around age 13. -Oh, yeah, I don't think the Holocaust happened. -What would you say to people like me who will say to you that, yes, white people came here, they took over this land from the Native Americans, they built this country on the backs of my ancestors, on the backs of black slaves. So now where's my place in this country? -Well, first off, I would like to hear some words of appreciation. Think of the thousands of farm boys who died in some battlefield in the Civil War and spilled their blood that eventually purchased the freedom of the African slave. And I never heard anybody say thank you. I'd like to hear that to begin with. And then I would like to hear some appreciation for the millions of dollars that are spent every year on public housing, for healthcare, and for all the other things that the black community benefits from. What you benefit from here in this country is much better than what you'd be receiving if you lived in Kenya or Rwanda. -You came here voluntarily, okay? -Right. -I came here by force. -I can't help it if my ancestors could stand on the shoreline of England and envision ships and went back into the woods and cut down timber and made ships and sails and conquered a new land. I can't help it that my ancestors could visualize and see new lands beyond the horizon. The moment -- the very, very, very split second you become proud, you become a conqueror again!

Cheers and applause

couldn't it wait until the 6

-Sitting here next to me is Rachel Pendergraft, the daughter of Pastor Tom Robb. Rachel is the highest-ranking woman in what you would call the Ku Klux Klan out of all the factions. -Even though I have the position I do, I consider myself a stay-at-home mom. I home-schooled three children. I have six grandchildren. This is a situation -- white genocide -- that men and women both need to work on together and help protect our children, our families. -Have you seen the new Disney princess movie? -No. -It's called "The Princess and the Frog." The princess is a black, so that is good for all the black kids out there, but the prince is white. It is all about how race mixing is good. But race mixing is wrong. -If all the people mix all up, there won't be any more white kids. -So don't race-mix. Be white and proud and tune in next week. -Like Pastor Robb said, it's not all doom and gloom. We do have a powerful message for our people. I mean, who really cares about race mixing if we're not God's divinely appointed authority on Earth? I mean, who would really care? It's bringing like-minded people together. And so one of the ways that we do that is with billboards. -I have no problems with your billboard -- White Pride Radio. -Right. -And I've said that on national media before. -I can't have a community to my own. I can't have a church to my own. I can't have a club to my own. I can't have a golf course to my own. I can't have anything that I can say is mine -- my people -- without them saying, "You've got to accept me." -Okay, so what can we all do together as a nation -- all of us -- blacks and whites, to get your vision? -Help save the white race. -Help save the white race. -Absolutely. -Tom Robb will tell you that he's not my friend. He'll make that very clear to you. I am Tom Robb's friend. And I feel that one day he will come around.

Horn blares

couldn't it wait until the 6

-There is growing outrage tonight after an unarmed African-American teenager was shot and killed by police in the St. Louis suburb of Ferguson, Missouri. -Why can't we fix it and make a dialogue, instead of that happening? Why don't they come and walk with us? This is their everyday life, and they mad. They're mad. I'm mad. We should all be mad, man. We should all be angry because of what's going on right now. -We're standing here in Ferguson, Missouri, right in front of the Ferguson City Police Department. As we know, Ferguson was the center of the media controversy and violence here just a few months ago. A black man by the name of Michael Brown, who was unarmed, ended up being shot and dying right there on the street, and his body was left there for four hours. All of this was not about Michael Brown, or Darren Wilson, for that matter. It was about decades of police abuse. We've seen many of these incidents throughout the country. -321. We have shots fired. We have one suspect down. -I felt safer with the Klan.

Gunshots

couldn't it wait until the 6

When I see a Klansman walking towards me in a robe and hood, I know what he stands for. When I see a police officer in a uniform with a badge and gun, I know what they're supposed to stand for. There's certainly many, many honest, decent police officers throughout our country, but there is a percentage who are bad cops. Good cops need to stop obeying that code of silence. It says a lot to how far we have not come. -Is that a friend of yours? -That was my son. -It was your son? -This afternoon, we met Tracy Martin at the crime scene. He says his 17-year-old son, Trayvon Martin, was shot to death. -He walked out the house to go to the store. He was going to the store. -Police in South Carolina are looking for a gunman following a shooting at a church in downtown Charleston Wednesday night. The shooter walked into the Emanuel AME Church and opened fire. -Here is the situation in Dallas, Texas. We have had 11 police officers hit by gunfire during an otherwise peaceful protest. -We know that the overwhelming majority of police officers do an incredibly hard and dangerous job fairly and professionally. We also know that centuries of racial discrimination -- They didn't simply vanish with the end of lawful segregation. As a society, we choose to under-invest in decent schools. We allow poverty to fester so that entire neighborhoods offer no prospect for gainful employment. We refuse to fund drug treatment and mental-health programs. And if we cannot even talk about these things -- If we cannot talk honestly and openly not just in the comfort of our own circles, but with those who look different than us or bring a different perspective... then we will never break this dangerous cycle. -This is #LunchBagBmore, and we get solicitations from around the community. This is going on about seven months, and it just keeps getting bigger and bigger. Last time we did 700 lunches. -We're here at St. Vincent's Church in Baltimore right off of Lexington Street and Front Street. And we're handing out clothes and food to the homeless and to the needy. We've made several hundred lunches and gotten donations of clothes and different items -- toiletries, toys, et cetera. Want some lunch? Here, have a bag. -Thank you. -You're welcome. -It seems like the uprising really brought everyone together in Baltimore. -Mm-hmm. -So this is, like, an extension of that, how it continues on. -That's the last one I got there. -Aw! -But I'll get some more, though. Okay. Michael Wood is a very honest individual. He was not liked by the Baltimore City Police because he didn't play the good ol' boy network game. -I want police to actually find ways, when they see a drug dealer on the corner, to figure out what the root cause is. He doesn't want to be on that corner. Drug dealer's probably the worst job. Cops are looking for you. Robbers are looking for you. Other drug dealers are looking for you. So it's the worst job in the world. They don't want that job. So actively find a way to solve that problem. So if he can't get a job because he's got a felony conviction, we need to find a way -- an employer that will take him --- or we need to fight and say, "Look, we can't put felony convictions on applications because it's sowing the seeds of crime." -I think the story says you're, like, the only black Klansman. -No, that story's wrong. I'm not in the Klan. There are no black people in the Klan. If there were, there wouldn't be a Klan. Now, what I do is I meet with them, sit them down and talk with them and interview them and find out, you know, what's going on up here, and as a result, some of them have become friends of mine, good friends of mine, and some of them have ended up leaving the Klan and now I own their robes and hoods. -Oh, wow. -Yeah. -What do you do with them? -I have a collection of them. One day I'm gonna open up a museum. -Really? I think it's interesting and even provocative. I know a lot of people are mad that a black man has the Klan robes. -Yeah. Yeah. But you know what? It's better that I have them than they have them. -Yeah. -The police culture's amok. It's gone so far that the idea right now is that if an officer is afraid, then he can do whatever he wants. He can kill at that moment. -As long as he uses that phrase, "I feared for my life." -Right, and we have a society that has determined that we should fear the black man. -Where does that culture come from initially in the police department? -It's that us-versus-them. You are superior because you are that thin blue line. The legal system and the culture are designed that these people are never wrong. In Maryland, the literal perception is that the city police -- their purpose is to control the monkeys and keep them contained within the confines of Baltimore. That is how people in the suburbs see city residents. So how do I get a cop that comes from that environment to sit down and talk and to actually see that person as a human being? -First thing you would do is invite that person to the table and see what he or she would say. And say, "Look, if somebody is willing to talk to you and learn something from you, don't you think that you have a responsibility to reciprocate?" I've been in 53 different countries. I've been exposed to many, many different cultures, races, religions, socioeconomic statuses, et cetera. I looked at the Ku Klux Klan as simply just another culture. I didn't look at them the same way I might have looked at them had I grown up in this country and had to fight bigotry, you know, my whole life. Robert White got busted for assault with intent to murder two black men with a shotgun. He went on to become a very good friend of mine. -Will you come to my wedding? -Sure, I'll be at your wedding, if you want me there. -Why would you -- Why would you go to his wedding if you don't believe in the mixing of races? -Well, in terms of the wedding, if he wants me there, just because it's Daryl. -As a result of our friendship, he left the Klan. This is his Klan robe -- his Grand Dragon robe. His day job was this. This is his jacket. Baltimore City Police Officer. And I'm glad that I have this stuff because it shows that people can, indeed, change. It also shows what a lot of people don't believe. -Systemic racism in America invades hiring. It invades education. It invades policing. It invades residency. So every lane is important, and every lane needs to be fought. -We will fight for Freddie Gray all night, all day! -Take back... -Baltimore! -Take back... -Baltimore! -Daryl Davis. -Tariq Tour. -My pleasure. -Kwame Rose. -My pleasure. Daryl Davis. -I'm a 21-year-old college dropout. Most people know me from April. During the Baltimore uprising, I'm the guy that confronted Geraldo Rivera. Because you're not here reporting about the boarded-up homes and the homeless people under MLK. You're not reporting about the poverty levels up and down North Avenue. You're here for the black riots. -He got Geraldo on the run, y'all. -Since the death of Trayvon Martin, there's been a trending hashtag on social media #BlackLivesMatter. That's kind of put in the spotlight the fact that police have been killing unarmed black people. We got to talk about how we got to end white supremacy, how we got to build independent black institutions, and how we all relate to that. -This country is built off economics, so if we're not talking about getting our wealth back or building our wealth, then we really ain't talking about anything. We can go all through the rhetoric, all the history. It doesn't work for me. -Okay, so, in kind of a roundabout way, you're more into segregation than integration. -No, but do we need to separate our dollars and fund our own stuff and fund our own institutions and to fund our own businesses? Absolutely. Because so far, our dollars just going up like a mushroom cloud. -I know you know a little bit about Daryl. What's your perspective on his work? -I would just want to know what the end goal is. For the layman on the projects who is receiving all the ills of white supremacy and that hate, right, on a day-to-day level, how do they begin to even think about that conversation that you're engaging in? -My end goal is to bring people together, okay? Bring white supremacists together with their nemesis. Unless we learn how to get along with one another, this country is a melting pot -- -But why I got to get along with them? -Pardon me? -Why I got to get along with them? -Because they are our fellow Americans. We all have to live in this country together, okay? We do. Otherwise we're gonna end up self-destructing. -So what is this museum? Who is it for? -For people like you. -Oh, no, I'm good. -Oh, yeah, no, you're not good. -You ever heard of something called intergenerational trauma? -Intergenerational trauma? -Yeah. -No, explain it to me. -It's trauma passed on from generations through images, symbols, different things like that. So I have a daughter. She's one years old. However, whenever the museum gets built, let's say she's 15. -Okay. -It's no way in hell I'm bringing her there so she can re-live that and see all of that. No, not at all. What's the point? -Because in order to know where you're going, you have to know where you came from. -White folks need to go see that. -How many robes have you collected? -Roughly, I'd say maybe 25, 26. -How long you been doing that for? -Since about 1990. -And you only got 26 robes? -You only got 25 robes? -You're asking about robes. You didn't say Klan memorabilia. I got tons of stuff. -So since 1990, which is longer than I've been alive, you've been trying to infiltrate the Klan. But what does that do for people? -Well, I'll tell you what. I'll tell you what it does. The state of Maryland had a large Klan organization. -Mm-hmm. -When the Imperial Wizard, which means the national leader -- When he turned in his robe to me, the Maryland Ku Klux Klan fell apart. Today there is no more Ku Klux Klan -- -I beg to differ. -Let me finish. Today -- Well, you can't because I got the facts, okay? Today there is no more Ku Klux Klan in the state of Maryland. -Infiltrating the Klan ain't freeing your people. -I disagree with you. -I don't see how. -What about Timothy McVeigh? -I don't -- He's in jail. -Oh, he is? -Wasn't he killed? Something like that. So what? -Obviously you're very uneducated about it. -And you uneducated about the reality that most of the people that look like you. -Every day on the hour, young black men and women are being snatched... -On the minute. -...and kidnapped off the streets. They're ruining people's lives, right? Not rehabilitating them and sending them right back into the same neighborhoods that are already screwed up, anyway. So when you say, "Oh, well, we need to be worried about somebody blowing some of them up," no! Somebody's getting locked up right now that's 16 years old that never may see the light of day again just because they look like my skin or Kwame's skin or your skin, for that matter. So we're talking about the energy that you putting into all them years? That's a whole lot of years to be doing that, to be studying. It sound like a fetish. -Befriending a white person who don't have to go through the same struggles as you, me, someone in the barbershop, or their father, that's not an accomplishment. That's a new friend. That's somebody you can call. -And this is coming from a dropout. -Dude, you don't tell Steve Jobs he ain't successful. He ain't had no college degree. Bill Gates ain't got no college degree. But, listen, the way I -- -I'm done. -You being disrespectful now. -You can be in the streets building with people, right? So stop wasting your time going into people's houses that don't love you, a house where they want to throw you under the basement. -So you believe that nobody can change? -No, I believe you believe the wrong people can change. -What do you mean, "The wrong people can change"? -White supremacists can't change. -You don't believe they can change? -No, white supremacists can't change. But I can change your mind 'cause you look like me. You ain't doing nothing but collecting something that's gonna build your own credibility. You nothing but a pimp in a pulpit. -And you're nothing but ignorant. Hey. I'm Daryl Davis. -Sorry, Daryl, but after that, I can't shake your hand right now. -Okay, that's fine. -I just want to be -- I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but I just want to say a couple things to you about the interactions that I just saw. First of all, man, you an old head like me. I remember the day when Martin Luther King was shot. I was 6 years old. And on that day, I realized I was black. Not my skin color, but I realized what it meant to be black. I realized that I could die because I got this skin color right here. That's insane that we live in this world, that we live in this country where your skin color determines your longevity. For you to come to Baltimore and disrespect some of the people who are on the front line here in Baltimore in the way that you did is reprehensible. Just like the young man said to you, you could have done a whole lot more work in the black community from the '90s to now to move our people forward, rather than coming in here and trying to uplift somebody that you got a hood off of their head. They still wear those hoods. And while you were saying the KKK doesn't exist, I looked up the KKK in Maryland, and there is a Klan group in Maryland right now still very active. You look it up yourself. So I'm saying you talking -- You calling somebody ignorant -- You might want to check your own ignorance around this before you start calling my young men in Baltimore, who are out here putting their lives on the line. Kwame marches hard with me in Baltimore. Kwame gets arrested in Baltimore. Where were you when the marches were going on? You were sitting with your Klan people and disrespecting my people. If you can't respect black people and respect my people for doing the work that they're doing, take your ass, and you hang out with them. Freddie Gray is dead. Tyrone West is dead. Anthony Anderson is dead. All that...you talking about -- these KKK hoods -- Who gives a...? I don't give a... about you or your KKK hoods. Don't come to Baltimore doing this...again. Don't come back here! -Oh, I can't talk now? -You can talk, but don't talk that...to me! -Then why don't you sit down and be quiet and let me talk, man? -Get the...out of my face! -You see how you are? You're showing your own ignorance, man. -Don't disrespect black people. You got some black in you, but you sound like you should have a hood on. -You said you'd let me talk, and you walk away. So you're showing -- -Don't call me ignorant. -Then what are you showing? -Don't come here calling my people that! -I just did. -Then don't...with my people, man. -You don't talk to the white supremacists like that! -You don't know. You don't know what I do. You don't know what I do. -But let me tell you something. Walk where we come from, and you gonna have some feelings. -Let's walk together. -You wasn't there, and we not gonna walk now! -All of you, if you didn't know him, you know him now. -This man hate himself, for real. -If y'all follow this dude, y'all part of the problem. -Do you feel disconnected from black millennials or from that age group? -I've met people like him before and have had confrontations with people like him before, not many. A Klansman hates a white person who "sells out," so to speak, more so than they hate a black person. Just like the young boy hated me more than he hated some white guy because he feels that I sold out my own race. He was very definite that white people could not change. How is he gonna advance any agenda in this country, as diverse as it is? You see where those people are standing right there on this first tier, the black people? -Oh, okay, yeah. -Right there where they're standing is where Martin Luther King gave his speech, "I Have a Dream." -Gonna take a picture of that. I'm Scott Shepherd. I'm a reformed racist, a former member of the Ku Klux Klan. -Scott Shepherd can relate to members of the Ku Klux Klan. -I was full of anger, full of hate. -He was one of them for 21 years. He even ran for office, appearing on national talk shows as a racist. -I'll be apologizing the rest of my life, but that's okay. I was born and raised in Indianola, Mississippi, which was a hotbed of racial turmoil and friction. The issues of my dad's alcoholism played a big part in my life. There were some incidents of violence that would instill PTSD in a solder. And that affected me growing up, you know. It left me with low self-esteem, and I projected this hatred that I had for myself and this anger out towards people of color. At the age of 16, I entered the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan and lived a life as a racist. They fed me the spiel. "We can take you in, give you a sense of family and belonging, protect you," 'cause they play on fear. -How did you feel to get that call? -Important. -And that's the idea, right? -Exactly. -What was their goal? -White supremacy by any means necessary, including murder. They destroyed my family. My older sister -- She called me on the phone, and she asked me what I thought I was doing. I wasn't raised this way. Do they have the spot marked? -Huh? -Do they have it marked? -Barely. Barely. -Hmm. -Right here. -You wouldn't even be able to see it if you didn't know it. -Exactly. That's him right there. There's the monument. -Mm-hmm. -That's where you're standing right here. Let me show you. Here he is. That's the back of him. You see the pool? -Mm-hmm. You can see it. -Uh-huh. -Yeah. Seen that many of times on TV. -Would you snap a picture of my friend and I? -My change of heart was in Nashville, Tennessee. I was at a restaurant, had a few drinks. Police pulled me over, and they got me, and I failed a sobriety test and that threw me into the court system. I was forced into a rehab to get out of trouble. I said, "Yeah, I'm gonna go to rehab." Take the paperwork to the judge, have the charges dropped, and go on with my racist life. It didn't happen that way. I went in that rehab one person and came out another. I was forced to take a cold, hard look in the mirror, and I saw the problem. The problem was Scott Shepherd. When she was on her deathbed, I was talking to my sister, and she said, "Do you ever regret some of the things you've done?" I said, "Every day." And she said, "Well, you know, you can use your past to help people." I opened up a blog. Once you hit that "publish" button, it's out there. I was scared to death what people were gonna say or think. And I was totally surprised by the outpouring of love and support that I got. It gets emotional, you know, for me because I fell for that crap. It's very easy to do when you're in the mind frame that I was at 16, 17 years old. -Do you think any of this, going in that direction, was your way of showing rebelliousness? -Extreme rebellion because I was raised by a black lady. I went without seeing her for years and years and years. -You couldn't face her. -Exactly. Ironically, you know, when I got out of the movement and stuff, went to her house, her arms were open. -As they always were. -Right. I saw Daryl on the Discovery Channel. He was making friends with Klansmen, and I thought he was a crackpot. I looked him up on Facebook or by e-mail, and we've been friends ever since. -I didn't mean to put you in back of the bus, Daryl. -Me and Rosa Parks, right? -It looks smaller than what it does on TV, doesn't it? -Yeah. -It's just slightly bigger than Graceland. -Basically, Daryl can probably accomplish more than I could. I never thought I'd stand here in front of this house with a black man. -There you go. With a black man inside the house, right? -Right, with a black man inside the house. -Yeah, yeah. So, you know, it is possible that change can occur. -Obama lives upstairs? -I'm not sure where his room is. -I bet them windows are bulletproof, aren't they? -Mm-hmm.

Indistinct conversations

couldn't it wait until the 6

How we all doing this evening?

Cheers and applause

couldn't it wait until the 6

All right. - When I was a child, I used to wonder How Santa put my toys under the tree I said, "Mama, can you tell me?" -When you have an alcohol or drug problem, the alcohol and drugs are not the problem. They're just the symptom. There's a deeper problem. And that's the same way with racism. That's just a symptom. I didn't have to address racism. I just had to address those issues, you know, within myself. - Baby, Santa Claus got some magic things As soon as you're asleep A chimney will appear -DC is very festive around the holidays. Of course, we have the National Christmas Tree. I really, really have a strong kinship with Scott. He has seen the light, and he feels the need to give back. I think one day Frank Ancona will leave the Klan. And I think one day I'm gonna be hanging this robe up in my museum. -Frank, how do you feel about that? Would you like to see Daryl's blue shirt hanging in your museum? -Actually, I wouldn't mind giving him one of our Traditionalist American Knights T-shirts. -I appreciate that. Thank you. I don't know where I would wear it, but, you know... -Right. - Someone is friendless -The friends that I've made I continue to keep. - In my window -I never set out to convert anybody. I just set out to get that answer to my question, "How can you hate me when you don't even know me?" And in my quest to have that answer, they couldn't answer it. And some of them ended up converting themselves. -Actually changing people's minds and hearts -- I think that's a testament to his character and the power of what he was doing. -Can you get a picture of Mike and I? -Yeah, that would be awesome, dude. -I do think that white supremacy is the main problem and privilege is the main problem. And if we can get past that, then we can focus on all the nuances of how to make it beautiful. - What to do make a world of love for me and you -I will say this -- For people coming out of the movement, role models, I think, are incredibly important. -I have seen things change. I have seen people change. And that inspires me. I've changed. I would hope that by the time I'm gone, things like this will not be as prevalent. - Some call me foolish -But if they are, perhaps this film will encourage others to do the same and to do a better job, you know, than I've been able to do. - I want to be there to help my fellow man So I keep a heart filled with mercy Shared throughout the land So I keep a light in my window So I can ease the pain That life can bring Help them find the peace Their spirit needs I have been chosen for this work to do -PBS. Your home for independent film.