Director's Cut

>> Seeing the joy of the kids, I think that's the joy we get out of it. If you focus strictly on the kids and not the paperwork side and not some of the egos, that helps me get though this. Or my five year old who's in his first track meet this year and just, seeing him run, he's smiling. Everybody's cheering for him, and he's just grinning. And then, just the looks on the kids' faces. Just to see them having fun and being out there and competing. That is what gives me joy. >> Fantastic. Welcome to Director's Cut. I'm Charles Monroe-Kane. That was a clip from the documentary "Passing the Baton." The film tells the story of the late Joe Sims, who worked for 30 years, running the inner- city Milwaukee Striders Track Club. The film was made by the project of Doc-UWM. We're joined today by the project director Ryan Sarnowski. We're also joined by a student who was part of the project and by the executive director of the club. But first, Ryan. How are you today? >> I'm good, thank you. >> I think, to get it out of the way so people understand it, tell me about the Strider Milwaukee club. Who are they? What are they doing? >> Milwaukee Striders is a track club started by Joe Sims over 30 years ago, with the goal of giving inner city kids something to do in the summer, to keep them off the streets, and then to keep them active. But also to give them a path to a greater future, mostly through going to college on athletic scholarships, as well as scholastic scholarships. >> Seems good. That sounds like a nice club. You teach at UWM. You teach documentary filmmaking. How do you end up, how do your students, right, end up making this documentary? How did that happen? >> All of our projects are usually a collaboration with somebody who has a story they want to tell, usually from our community in Milwaukee. They come to Doc-UWM and we work with them to come up with a project plan. That includes everything from a budge to what the goal for the project will be. This particular project came to us through the Helen Bader Foundation, who had worked for years with Joe Sims' track club. They felt that more people needed to know about the track club, especially because Joe was ill at the time we started. We knew that the team that would be kind of entering a new era with new coaches. >> That's apparent in the film, obviously, that just as you start to film, Joe was in the hospital. Joe Sims is a legend in Milwaukee. So, you're starting a project with someone who apparently is going to be passing away at any moment, as you're filming him. Wow, how does that change how you make a film? That must be quite a bizarre experience for the students. >> I think for the students, as well as for myself and everyone in the office, it adds a nice sense of gravity, that there's a seriousness about what we're doing. And there's an importance to it. So, Joe passed away within probably the first two or three weeks of our class. >> Wow. >> So our students didn't get a chance to meet him. Only I had gone down and filmed earlier with Joe. But right away, they got to know that they were working on something very special, and that they would want to treat it that way. >> It must've been amazing for them to see footage of Joe while they're sitting in the class, taking this class from you, and suddenly it's like, wow, we're making a film about this man's legacy. It's no longer about his life. There's a very big difference. Do you feel like that changed, I guess, did they do a better job than other students have done on other projects because of this? Or do you feel like they were more serious? How did it change them? >> I think this project did something very special to these kids. It was probably partly because of Joe's legacy. I think it was also part of what they got to watch grow out of that legacy. And spending time with this new era of coaches, this team from that year, even I didn't feel like I got to know Joe the way the members of Striders did. But we could understand Joe by listening to them, by hearing their stories. We knew that we had this just amazing individual that had touched all these lives. It was our responsibility to communicate that to anyone who would be watching this film. >> Wow, that's a big word, responsibility. We're going to show a clip from the film, then we're going to come back and talk some more. But before we do, this is a clip of Joe. You filmed him in the hospital before he passed away, correct? >> Yes. >> We're going to see that clip of Joe, then we'll come back and talk some more. Let's roll that clip. >> How you doing, man? Good to see you. >> I'm not going to tap you. I'll just give you a hug. >> Okay. >> How're you doing, Dad? >> I'm all right, Mr. Harris. >> Okay. Did you see the uniforms? >> Oh, I like it. >> Did you see your name? >> Papa Joe, how can I not? >> And then on the back. >> I mean, back then when we were coming up, "Who is Fat Joe?" You know, and everybody's looking. "Oh, he's the guy in the car." You know, from there, just seeing the other kids out there enjoying what they're doing. >> They just wanted to be with him or around him. Then the Striders is a family, and they want to carry on the Striders history. So we thought the best thing to do was to honor the Milwaukee Striders by changing the legal documents and saying "The Joe Sims Milwaukee Striders Track Club." >> Doesn't make a difference as long as the kids are still running. That's great. Good for him. A humble man. We're joined by Aaron Zakowsky. Aaron, how are you? >> I'm doing good. How are you? >> You're one of the students we were referring to. You were the main editor? >> Yes, I did most of the main editing toward the end of the project. I also worked as a student producer and shooter, too. >> We were talking backstage with some folks who work here, and they're like, editing a documentary is the hardest job in the film world, too many hours and you don't know where the story is exactly yet. How many hours of film did you have to edit and how long did it take? >> I actually lost count like halfway through, but anywhere from 250-300 was the total hours. >> You had to edit all that? >> Yeah, it was quite a process to get it down. >> Everyone knows that documentaries are about characters, right? It's not just about the idea, it's about people, like any other film. Did you know who the characters were going to be ahead of time? In some ways, but you must've been like, the editing must've chosen some of the characters. >> Oh, yeah, definitely. A lot of times, there were certain days where some kids would show up more than others. Through the editing process, we just edited down scenes and had seen, like this link carries over here, and then this person comes back over here. >> I went to college. And I don't think I've ever spent 250-300 hours on a paper. Is this like a whole semester extra credit, or is it a whole separate class that you did this? >> Well, I think in fairness, Aaron is the main editor, but it took a lot of work from the rest of the crew, which was a total of about 12 students, who were out shooting, and then many of them were back logging this footage, watching through the footage. >> This is a whole class. >> Yes. >> And you teach the class that makes this documentary as a class. >> Mm-hmm. >> Oh, I want to take that class. It seems like a great class. Maybe I will take it. I bet you can get on the show if I did. I was wondering. I do some audio editing for radio, and all the time, there's always this stuff that we call tape on the floor. Like just sad, I can't believe it. Is there something when you two watched this film, especially for you as an editor, where you're like, oh, man, I just had to leave this story on the floor, I had to leave this moment on the floor that you wished was back in? >> Yeah, there was definitely times where I was going back and forth. We were like, sometimes we'd want it, and then other times we'd review it and it was just like, that just doesn't make sense, or we need to cut to get it down to a smaller time format. So a lot of stuff got left, and it was just like, I really like it myself, but... >> Is there something specific where you were just like, oh, man, if I just had that one shot of that kid, or this one moment, or this one piece of dialogue? >> I think for me as a director, there was kind of a twofold thing for making these connections. One of them is that there's a great story that Joe tells about giving his own money to girls so they could buy prom dresses and go to prom, under one stipulation. They had to be back and practice the next morning. We actually filmed Chrystal's daughter going to prom with another member who had been a former Strider. There was a nice connection between this, but it just didn't find its way in to fit in there. But it'll be in the extras on the DVD.

all laugh

>> Was there a moment when you were like Ryan, who's the director and the professor, but also the director, but you're like no, man. No, this is going in, or no, you've got to cut this out. Did you guys do that, or did the class get together and say Ryan, you're wrong? Did they ever do that? >> Yeah, we would all get together as a class. There'd be a lot of review sessions, so when other people would edit clips together, and myself, we'd always come back and review it. There's a lot of times where it's like, that's just not making sense, or some people like this and some people didn't like that. So yeah, there were some heated discussions. >> That sounds fantastic. We're going to see another clip from the film and then come back and talk some more, but I want to set this up for a second, because we're talking about Joe, right, and Joe has passed away. We're also talking about the students, the athletes, I guess, who are running. But there's a whole other group of people we need to talk about, which are probably the most important people of the story. These people are the coaches. We're going to see a little clip that shows kind of the coaches. Then we're actually going to come back and talk more about that. Thank you very much for joining us. >> Thank you. >> Let's roll that clip. >> They were out playing around. They were down with the boys over there not practicing the batons. They went half way around and that was it. >> And didn't come back. >> So I figured practice was over. They were done, they were good enough to win the meet on Sunday. >> Oh, we gonna to find out. You know you're in the relay, right? So he's been gone out of town, he's gonna come on Sunday and y'all want him to beat those kids out of the blocks on Sunday. Instead y'all rather do flips over here. Go back to that number two. Ready? Go. Right, what was wrong with that? See? You told him to. Okay, that's fine. As a team, all four of you, that's fine. Okay, -- Feet up. When I'm talking, keep your feet up! Both feet! Down. >> Two, three. >> How many? >> Three. >> Okay, turn around. He's pumping his arms, he's putting them back which way? His left, so you gotta be on this side of the track. He's on that side of the track. Okay? So you say, stick. And you put it in his hand. Ready, go! You gotta watch the mark until you go. >> Stick! >> I don't care what you say, but get the hand off goin'. They do it. Easy. Boom! Boom, boom, boom. Elementary. >> Good stuff, I love it. Elementary. Welcome. This is Chrystal White, who is now the executive director of the Striders club. How are you? >> Pretty good, thank you. >> I have a question. As I'm watching that clip, I was actually just saying, my wife was watching it with me and she was like, wow, those kids just became better business leaders, better husbands, better in a lot of things they're going to do other than track. How blatant are you with the kids, because you're a coach throughout this documentary as well, with them that this isn't about track? >> Well, we tell them all the time, pretty much. >> Like what, you say this is going to change your life? >> Well, they didn't think about the film, but just in terms of us talking to them about their education, and then going on further and using this as a stepping stone. >> I can see that. There's a statistic in the documentary that blew me away. It was that 90% of the students who become athletes for the club since its inception received some kind of scholarship for college, 90%. That just blows me away. When you hear that, what do you think? Is that it? Is that the legacy of the club? >> When I hear that, I think "wow," too. But it's exciting, the exposure they get being able to travel and run with the club, and running with the Joe Sims Milwaukee Striders Club. They get so much college exposure, because we run on college campuses, so they, you know, coaches just come. >> I would assume, if my kids were in that neighborhood, right, I would assume that I would want my kids to be in your club for a variety of reasons. One of them would be because you have a 90% chance of getting a scholarship, but you also have the leadership things and other healthy things, and the things they're not doing when they're there. There's a lot of reasons for them to do it. >> Right. >> Is that why parents put their kids in this club. >> I think that's some of it. Just also, you mentioned the leadership. I mean, a lot of us are teachers or educators ourselves, and most of us have kids ourselves. So, there's a lot of things that just signing up with the track club, with the discipline, with goal-setting, with being able to reach a goal, how to handle a disappointment, how to get back on task. We always check and see how they're doing in school, and promote that. So there's just a lot of background work besides the running. >> That's a good way to do it. What's the budget for the club, and do you charge people to be in it? Is there a limit? >> We do charge people. There's a $100 registration fee. That usually pays for all the entries to the local meets. When we travel out of town for weekends in Minnesota, or Iowa, or things like that, there's a small additional fee. When we travel to Nationals, there's usually a fee, because we're gone out of state for a week. >> Yeah, $100 doesn't cover that. >> Right. >> We're going to see another clip and come back and talk to both of you, but before we go, I wanted you to set this clip up. It's also one of my favorite clips in the film. This is a clip that I think shows why you and the coaches are so important. This was a clip of Tiffany. Can you tell me about Tiffany and your time with Tiffany? >> Tiffany is a young lady, very strong willed. A very good athlete. We also steer people toward making good decisions, and how to present themselves when they're on and off the track. I think this situation, she got the room list, and we assign different people to rooms, and one of her good friends was assigned to a different room. We try to keep the relays together, so that the relays can bond and feel like a family, and have fun together. So Tiffany wasn't a relay runner, and her friend was with a relay. So I think she came with that disappointment and that little chip on her shoulder, and had to figure out how to handle that disappointment. We also get to see how you handle it, too, so let's roll that clip. >> Don't talk about that I'm going off on you, because I'm not. I pulled you off the bus to ask you, but if this is still an issue about the room, that's not gonna change. >> Why can't I be on the one? >> Because you are nine years old, you're not going on this bus. >> I'm not even nine. >> Okay, you're ten, my bad. >> Tiffany, I'm trying to talk to you and ask, because, like I said, I said, we've got 80 kids. I'm not dealing any attitudes. >> Right. How are we gonna let you on? >> I don't want to talk about what I can't do, like, oh, you got an attitude. >> No, I didn't check you like that. >> Because out of respect, adults speak to you, you speak back. >> So I'm asking, if you feel like you can get it together, I want you to stay. You know I love you, Tiffany. I enjoy you being on the team. If you feel like you're going to have a bad weekend. You're going to be icky to everybody, or whatever, than please stay. Don't ruin it for everybody else. And then I said the choice is hers. >> Right. >> The choice is always yours. Do I want you to stay? Of course I want you to. I want you to compete against the best. I like you being on the team, but attitude I'm not going to deal with. So the choice is always yours, Tiffany. >> Straight. >> Be straight, then. >> Girls on one bus, guys on the other. That makes my day. >> But you gonna be on there with 'em. >> On where, the girls bus? >> Yeah. >> Nah, you kiddin' me? >> I need somebody to talk to. >> Too much arguing, fussin'. >> No, right here with the... >> That's fantastic. It's the truth, you know, it's the truth. We were saying, as we were watching it, there's 122 students that year doing that. >> Yes. >> That's a lot of students. You can't do that just with hired coaches. You've got to have an involved community, right? >> Yes, we do. Actually, our coaches are all volunteer coaches. So the hours that they put in, all of that is volunteer. They learn about whatever they're teaching, whether it's the jumps or the sprints, or whatever. We all study or take classes. Then the trips that they go on, every day being at practice, all of that is volunteer because they love doing it, and they want to see the kids be successful. >> I'm intrigued for both of you as I watch this, because I think it's such a powerful thing that's happening here in the community. Everyone who's on the track team, unless I saw it wrong, is black, is that correct? >> Well, there are a few. That year there was probably four that I can think of. You see one of them, actually, in that scene we saw earlier, there was a young white male athlete. >> But most of the kids are black. And your crew, I would assume in the class. >> It's the complete opposite. I have one African American student, and the rest of us are middle-of-the-road white kids. >> How did that work? I know it doesn't come into the film, but you guys are spending a week long, you were in Iowa at a national track meet. You're filming these kids. It's intimate. You're on the bus. That must have come up. Race must've come up, right? >> I don't think it did. >> It didn't come up. >> It didn't? We've evolved. I didn't know, somebody should've told me. Another thing I really liked about the film that I thought I was really powerful. I saw this metaphor coming up again and again was shoes, kids talking about shoes. Michael Bennett and some other people who were giving eulogies to Joe Sims, and people talking and different people telling stories about shoes, about the simple fact of not having the right shoes, or Joe Sims carrying around an Army duffle bag full of shoes. I was wondering what that meant to you as a filmmaker, where you trying to find that after you saw that coming up a little bit. I found that to be really powerful and it helped me understand the importance of what was happening. Michael Bennett was saying he didn't have shoes, the right shoes. To him that was the symbol of the love that Joe Sims gave him, the shoes. Or, you didn't use it, but the prom dress. That's a very tangible piece. Is that something that you saw in the film? >> Yeah, it was something that was part of the mythology of Joe Sims, the story of the shoes. Every runner we ran into said that they either gave their shoes or that they'd gotten shoes from Joe. It still continued up to the day that we were there. You'd hear about people being told to trade shoes with somebody else or, you know, we have one scene where they actually go to the store to buy new shoes for the national meet. That's the showcase, the big event. But even then everyone was talking about that they got a good deal on good shoes. They found really great shoes, but at this place where they got a deal. >> I was thinking, if you where 13 years old, I think you'd rather run in Michael Bennett's shoes than a pair of new shoes. Wouldn't you? I would. That would be pretty awesome. >> We still do have bags of shoes and look for kids that don't have shoes, and try to do whatever we can so that they're equipped to run. >> Because you need the tools to succeed. What do you see as the legacy for the Joe Sims Strider Club. >> I think, what's left is he wanted to leave something that the kids in the community know, that they have some place that they could go and be safe, and have fun, and get them outside the city. A lot of them had never even traveled outside of Wisconsin. Just being able to know that there is a way to get your dream done. That's through running track and that can further whatever your dream is. I think that's one of the goals. To realize that you can reach whatever your dream is. >> For me the most powerful part of the film is at the end. I think it was part of the credits. I've met these kids, right? And it showed the kids, and all of the kids that I'd felt I had connected to that where seniors got full scholarships, track scholarships. Stanford, University of Minnesota, real schools! Every single kid. I'm like, oh, my gosh! Whatever you're doing is correct. It's almost like, can you take this on the road? Why isn't everyone doing this? Your success rate is phenomenal. Every city should do this. >> That is a good statement. I don't know. I wish we could. >> I don't think you can franchise the heart and dedication that these coaches and families have. Otherwise, they would've. >> We can try. Try to franchise heart and love. It just was a very, very powerful moment to see those scholarships. I was absolutely touched by that. >> They can also come to the Striders. >> That's true! They can move to Milwaukee. Well, thank you very much for joining us, it was very, very inspiring. We're going to see another clip from the film and come back for a little bit of follow-up. Thank you very much, and let's see another clip from the film. We don't get enough people looking at the positive side. We get too many people looking at the negatives and all they see on the news. Then they think that everybody who lives here must be like that. That's such a stereotype. It's wonderful out here. The children have a safe haven. And it goes all summer. One, two, three, four, five. Don't come up. Push yourself up. Legs up. Legs up. There wasn't a serious figure in my life as far as a male, so Joe filled a void that was in my life. And my mother really appreciated that because Joe has such a positive influence in my life and actually kept me from a lot of things that were negative out there, you know. >> Another powerful clip from Joe Sims. Ryan, we don't have a lot of time, but I'm curious, when you showed this documentary to the Striders Club, to those in the community, to the kids, the athletes that were part of it, what was the reaction? >> First, I was nervous. The first time we showed it was at the Milwaukee Film Festival and we had over 450 people show up for it, and I was pretty much, like Aaron, freaking out. But I'd heard, through the crowd, that people were crying. I knew when I heard that that they were crying at the right parts. And they were laughing. I knew we'd hit it. I had people I'd never met, people not even connected with the team, coming up to me and just thanking us for making it. I knew we did a good job. >> Actually, you guys do a great job at Doc-UWM. It's fantastic. Come back with more films. I love it. >> All right. >> Thanks for joining us. >> Thank you. >> And thanks everyone for watching today. And all the students, of course, who also worked on the film. I want to make sure we thank them of course, who also worked on the film. I want to make sure we thank them. >> Yes, definitely. >> We want to thank Chrystal White, the executive director of the Joe Sims Milwaukee Striders Track Club. And hey, you guys, thanks for watching Director's Cut today. We appreciate it. For more information on "Passing the Baton" please go to wpt.org and click on director's cut. I'm your host Charles Monroe-Kane, and check the gate. >> What's up, y'all? They never said we had to go to sleep, they just said we had to be in our room. Aw, why you catch that on tape? You gotta cut that off, okay?