Talib Akbar:
Well, when they see this version here, the people who have been impacted by the carceral system, they know the real deal. They say, "This is the thing right here." But other people, they don't have any experience in that, and it's just a new experience to them.

Murv Seymour:
Is it worth it to you? Do you find it's worth it doing all this?

Talib Akbar:
It is worth it, because I'm getting the word out. You know, it's the image — what it actually looks like and feels like to be in solitary confinement. We've also gone to various places and we've challenged dignitaries throughout the state to spend an hour in the solitary confinement cell. Mhmm, so it is worth it.

Murv Seymour:
Do they take anything from that?

Talib Akbar:
They do. They do. We've had a judge to take it. We have a sheriff that took it. Even right here, I presented at the Juneteenth, a number of different Juneteenths throughout the state, and they take a liking to it. I mean, you know, it's an experience, it's an educational experience for anyone that hasn't been in a solitary confinement cell.

Murv Seymour:
Yeah, and how close is this one to the actual dimensions?

Talib Akbar:
Well, the dimensions are not exactly the same, because this one is probably about half a foot shorter in length and probably about three or four feet in height different from the original version. But as far as width, it's right on time.

Murv Seymour:
And it still gets the message across?

Talib Akbar:
It gets the message across. When people see it and read the materials that I have laid out for 'em, they get the message, you know? They ask a lot of questions, and I'm pretty sure to answer most questions asked about solitary confinement, you know, 'cause there's so many different rules can land you in solitary confinement, and they're surprised to hear that and see it.