Frederica Freyberg:

Primary election day is February 18 and we turn now to our interview series with candidates running for the State Supreme Court. Two weeks ago, we talked with incumbent Justice Daniel Kelly, last week candidate Marquette Law School Professor Ed Fallone was here. Tonight we introduce you to Jill Karofsky. She currently serves as a Dane County circuit court judge. Karofsky is the former executive director of the Wisconsin Office of Crime Victim Services and she’s a former state assistant attorney general. Jill Karofsky joins us now. Thanks very much for being here.

Jill Karofsky:

Thanks so much for having me here. I really, really appreciate it.

Frederica Freyberg:

So right out of the shoots, we just want to ask you why voters should elect you to the State Supreme Court.

Jill Karofsky:

Voters should elect me to the Supreme Court because I have the experience, I have the values and I have the energy to not only win this election, but to be on the Supreme Court. I’m the only person in this race who is or who has ever been a trial court judge. I presided over more than 1700 cases last year. I see every day how the law impacts real people. I also have experience as a prosecutor. I know how to be smart on crime. I know the importance of protecting individual rights of victims, of witnesses, of defendants, of members of our community. I also have been a victim advocate, as you mentioned. I was Wisconsin’s first Violence Against Women resource prosecutor and as the executive director of the Office of Crime Victims Services. I helped victims in every county in this state get the services and the help that they needed. I have the depth and breadth of experience that we need on the Supreme Court.

Frederica Freyberg:

You say that currently justices are acting like politicians. How so?

Jill Karofsky:

You know, as I’ve been traveling around the state listening to voters, I hear the same thing. What they see are justices who make decisions before anyone ever walks into the State Supreme Court chamber. They see justices who do not follow the rule of law. They see justices who more interested in protecting corporations than in protecting our air and our water from corporate polluters. They see justices who are — all of that feels like corruption to people, because what we have is a justice in Dan Kelly on the court who makes decisions every time he has the opportunity to for corporations, for the wealthy and for the right wing special interests that worked hard to get him on the court and is working hard to keep him on the court.

Frederica Freyberg:

What’s an example of a case like that?

Jill Karofsky:

If you look at — there was a case in 2016 dealing with the administrative rules at the Department of Public Instruction, at DPI. And the court ruled one way in 2016. In 2019 in the Koschkee case with Dan Kelly on the court, the court ruled 180 degrees different direction. The only thing that changed on the court — and this was what Justice Ann Walsh-Bradley wrote in the dissent, the only thing that changed on the court was the — the only thing that changed was the makeup of the court. So what we have is a court who wants to change the law. How are we in Wisconsin supposed to know what the law is if three years after a decision they rule 180 degrees the other way?

Frederica Freyberg:

Do you feel like recusal rules need to be stricter?

Jill Karofsky:

Absol–I think we need to have a recusal rule. We don’t have a recusal rule. Yes. We need a rule. It’s what’s fair to voters in this state. It’s what’s fair to candidates in the state. It’s what’s fair to judges and justices in the state. And the Wisconsin Supreme Court had the chance to craft a clear recusal rule when Dan Kelly was on the court and they didn’t even hold a hearing to gather information to be able to craft a rule.

Frederica Freyberg:

You are quoted as saying that we need to reform the criminal justice system in Wisconsin with an eye toward social justice? How so?

Jill Karofsky:

I don’t think anyone who has been on the front lines of the justice system like I have and I’m the only one in this race who has spent most of their career on the front lines of our justice system. I don’t think you can be there without thinking we need to reform our criminal justice system. And I think that the first thing we need to do is we need to first of all, admit that there’s a problem. And we do have a problem. We have a problem when it comes to racial disparity in our criminal justice system. We have a problem in Wisconsin with mass incarceration. The second thing is, as a judge, what I can do is to take steps to try to mitigate that problem. And I do it in my courtroom by making sure I’m diverting people to treatment courts: OWI treatment court, drug treatment court, veterans’ treatment court. We have a program in Dane County where people can do community service instead of having to pay a fine or go to jail and I refer people there every opportunity I have. The third thing that we can do is that I can’t make policy. I’m not–I don’t make policy as a judge. I certainly wouldn’t make policy as a state Supreme Court justice. But I can tell the policymakers, I can tell the legislators, what I’m seeing to inform their decisions.

Frederica Freyberg:

Does this make you soft on crime?

Jill Karofsky:

I don’t know how anyone could think that I’m soft on crime. I — what I do in my courtroom is I follow the rule of law every day. And if you look at decisions that I have made, you will see a judge who, when I’m sentencing people, relies on the sentencing factors in the state of Wisconsin: the severity of the crime, the protecting the public, the character and rehabilitation needs of the offender. I balance all of those and that is how I come to a sentence every single time I have to do that.

Frederica Freyberg:

Justice Kelly was endorsed this week by President Trump. What’s your reaction to that?

Jill Karofsky:

I think President Trump wants Dan Kelly to be on the Wisconsin Supreme Court because if and when there is litigation in the November election, he will have Dan Kelly on the court and we know based on Dan Kelly’s track record of always ruling for Republicans, always ruling for right wing special interests how he is going to rule in that case.

Frederica Freyberg:

Do you think that the date of the presidential primary falling on the same date as the general election for the State Supreme Court helps or hurts you in terms of interest and turnout?

Jill Karofsky:

I think that having — that getting people to the polls no matter what race you’re in is hugely, hugely important. Our job in this race is to make sure that when people go to the polls on April 7th that they vote all the way through that ballot, that they vote for president, that they vote for Supreme Court, that they vote for all their local elections and court of appeals if that’s on the ballot for them as well. That’s our job in this election, to make sure that we get people to the polls and that they vote for Jill Karofsky for Supreme Court.

Frederica Freyberg:

All right. Judge Karofsky, thanks very much.

Jill Karofsky:

Thank you.