PBS News Hour

GEOFF BENNETT: More now on President Trump's move to pardon or commute the sentences of the more than 1,500 January 6 defendants, mass clemency for his supporters, like David Dempsey, who was sentenced to 20 years for two counts of assaulting police officers with a dangerous weapon, seen here outside the U.S. Capitol threatening to lynch elected officials.

Proud Boys member Dominic Pezzola, who was serving a 10-year sentence for being one of the first to break into the Capitol, using a stolen riot shield to break a window.

Scott Miller, who can be seen in the brown jacket near the entrance beating police with a pole, he was serving a 5.5-year sentence, and Jacob Chansley, otherwise known as the QAnon Shaman, who pleaded guilty to obstruction of an official proceeding after trespassing on Capitol grounds.

For more on the implications, we're joined now by former GOP Congressman and adviser to the House January 6 Committee Denver Riggleman.

Welcome back to the "News Hour."

FMR.

REP. DENVER RIGGLEMAN (I-VA): Yes, thanks for having me.

GEOFF BENNETT: These pardons, I mean, this is a real body blow for the U.S. justice system in the sense that this was the single largest criminal investigation in U.S. history.

Nearly every FBI field office, nearly every U.S. attorney's office were involved in these prosecutions.

Now all but 14 people have been pardoned.

The other 14 had their sentences commuted.

How does all of this land with you?

FMR.

REP. DENVER RIGGLEMAN: It's heinous.

We have insurrectionists that were actually pardoned.

And I think it's just ludicrous that that's happening in the United States of America.

And I don't think it's just a body blow against the Department of Justice.

I think it's a body blow against the American people.

And the fact is that the Republican Party can't claim to run on law and order ever again.

And, for me personally, knowing what happened that day, that these coup-like movements and these insurrectionists are being pardoned by the president of the United States, I think it rattles our allies also.

And it really shakes the foundations of everything we stand for as Americans.

GEOFF BENNETT: What's the real-world impact of these pardons and the fact that these rioters are being released from prison?

FMR.

REP. DENVER RIGGLEMAN: Well, I think the real-world impact are, these individuals are back in their communities, where they can organize, they can run for office, January 6'ers that are presented with medals, that they actually get positions within certain government offices, maybe on the staffs of congressional representatives who support this kind of nonsense and this kind of insanity.

I think that's the real world implications.

And also, when you look at U.S. Capitol Police and those that were attacked that day, it's really this baseline disrespect against law enforcement, right?

It's not back the blue.

It's screw the blue.

And I think that's what you're seeing from the GOP today.

And, for me, how are they going to recruit the type of people that they need when they see that there's nobody backing them up, especially when they were trying to protect the Capitol, and our most -- my goodness, our most, I would say, enshrined and valuable institutions that were attacked that day by really ignorant, violent insurrectionists?

GEOFF BENNETT: You were extended one of the preemptive pardons that former President Biden issued to members and staffers on the House January 6 Committee.

How did that process play out?

Did you have to request it?

And once you got it, did you have to accept it?

FMR.

REP. DENVER RIGGLEMAN: It's pretty interesting.

I had no idea.

I didn't even know until the morning of, and I got a text message with an actual picture of the blanket pardon to all January 6 Committee members.

That really was the extent of it.

I guess I'm supposed to get a hard copy.

So I was never asked if I wanted a pardon.

If they would have asked me, I would have said no.

It just really chafes me that I have to have a preemptive pardon and sort of be in the same boat as a bunch of violent mouth-breathers, like the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers, that broke the law and went to jail.

And we have to worry about political retribution for doing our duty.

And as somebody who served in the United States military, took the oath there, was enlisted, and as a commissioned officer, somebody took the oath as United States Congressman, as a J6 Committee member, it really does make you feel like a stranger in your own country when you have to worry about a preemptive pardon on actually trying to protect our institutions.

And I would do it all over again.

So, no, I -- there was no consultation.

It just happened.

And I got it through a text message.

GEOFF BENNETT: Does the former president's novel and sweeping use of the pardon pen make it harder to criticize Donald Trump for the pardons that he issued?

FMR.

REP. DENVER RIGGLEMAN: No, I think when you have preemptive pardons of people who try to uphold the law, people who were actually doing their work under a United States Congress resolution, and when you have pardons of violent, superstition-driven fantasists who would rather attack the Capitol than have the rational ability to tell fantasy from fiction - - or fantasy from fact, those who literally believe that the "Lord of the Rings" is a documentary, I think that's the difference here.

It's really hard, right, to even compare the preemptive pardons from Biden for January 6 Committee members and congressional members to pardons of violent criminals that have no ability to discern fact from fiction.

I think it should absolutely frighten the American people.

GEOFF BENNETT: The Trump team's view is that people shouldn't be surprised, given that Donald Trump broadly previewed this during the campaign.

And they tend to think that the reaction in the rest of the country will be different than it is here in Washington, where January 6 seems to loom larger in people's thinking.

And you can take it a step further and ask the question.

If Donald Trump didn't pay a price for allegedly inciting the Capitol riot, he's now protected by the presidency, why should the foot soldiers?

FMR.

REP. DENVER RIGGLEMAN: You know, that's maybe the one thing that he did was, his pardon actually showed that he thought he was responsible for it.

And I think that's something we can look at.

I mean, obviously, he didn't do it for any noble reason, but he was ultimately responsible for what happened on January 6.

And as far as the foot soldiers, are we saying that people that are of sound mind actually think that QAnon is a real thing?

If you think about that -- what happened that day, that was purely based on conspiracy theories.

Every single person that day, whether they attacked the Capitol or not, believed in something that was false.

They believed in this sort of cultlike thing, right, that the election was stolen, whether it was through German servers or through broken algorithms or space satellites or NSA or CIA or white vans with ballots, all the ludicrous, ridiculous things that was pushed into the ecosystem by Trump and his minions.

So, yes, it should scare the hell out of people that you have somebody up there, right, that pardoned a bunch of violent people, where he's actually sort of saying, yes, it was me.

You know, I'm the one who told them to do it.

And so, for me, I don't care how other people react in Washington, D.C., or care how other people react outside of Washington, D.C. What I care about is truth.

What I care about is fighting corruption.

And what we're seeing in the Republican Party now is such a deep rot that I don't know if you can actually take it out.

So, for me, I would rather be alone telling the truth than with many following a lie.

GEOFF BENNETT: Former GOP Congressman and the House January 6 Committee adviser Denver Riggleman, thanks for being with us.

FMR.

REP. DENVER RIGGLEMAN: Thank you.