ANNOUNCER:

THE FOLLOWING PROGRAM IS PART OF OUR “HERE AND NOW” 2016 WISCONSIN VOTE ELECTION COVERAGE. FUNDING FOR “HERE AND NOW” IS PROVIDED, IN PART, BY FRIENDS OF WISCONSIN PUBLIC TELEVISION.

SCOTT WALKER:

PURSUANT TO OUR RULES, CAST 36 VOTES FOR TED CRUZ AND SIX VOTES FOR THE NEXT PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, DONALD J. TRUMP.

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

GOVERNOR SCOTT WALKER AND BADGER STATE DELEGATES CAST THEIR VOTES IN CLEVELAND. I’M FREDERICA FREYBERG. TONIGHT, ON “HERE AND NOW,” FULL COVERAGE OF THE GRAND OLD PARTY IN CLEVELAND THIS WEEK. AND LATER, A COMPARE AND CONTRAST OF ANTI-POVERTY PLANS FROM U.S. SENATOR TAMMY BALDWIN AND SPEAKER PAUL RYAN. WE’LL ALSO ASK SENATOR BALDWIN WHAT TO EXPECT IN PHILADELPHIA NEXT WEEK AT THE DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION. BUT FIRST THE HEADLINERS AT THIS WEEK’S REPUBLICAN NATIONAL CONVENTION OF COURSE WERE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE DONALD TRUMP, HIS VP, MIKE PENCE AND SENATOR TED CRUZ FOR CAUSING A RUCKUS BY NOT ENDORSING TRUMP. OUR OWN STATE FIGURED PROMINENTLY IN CLEVELAND WHAT WITH THE RNC CHAIR AND HOUSE SPEAKER PAUL RYAN HAILING FROM WISCONSIN. GOVERNOR SCOTT WALKER, SENATOR RON JOHNSON AND CONGRESSMAN SEAN DUFFY ALSO HAD SPEAKING SPOTS. HERE’S A SAMPLING.

PAUL RYAN:

DEMOCRACY IS A SERIES OF CHOICES. WE REPUBLICANS HAVE MADE OUR CHOICE. HAVE WE HAD OUR ARGUMENTS THIS YEAR? SURE, WE HAVE. YOU KNOW WHAT I CALL THOSE? SIGNS OF LIFE.

SCOTT WALKER:

LIBERAL WASHINGTON INSIDERS CREATED OUR PROBLEMS. AND HILLARY CLINTON IS THE ULTIMATE LIBERAL WASHINGTON INSIDER. IF SHE WERE ANY MORE ON THE INSIDE, SHE’D BE IN PRISON.

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

AMERICA DESERVES BETTER THAN HILLARY CLINTON!

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

AND THAT, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, IS WHY WE NEED TO SUPPORT DONALD TRUMP AND MIKE PENCE TO BE THE NEXT PRESIDENT AND VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.

RON JOHNSON:

WE MUST DEFEAT ISIS. AND THEN REMAIN FULLY COMMITTED TO DESTROYING ISLAMIC TERRORISTS WHEREVER THEY HIDE.

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

IT DOESN’T HAVE TO BE LIKE THIS. WE SHOULDN’T HAVE TO LIVE IN FEAR. BUT IF WE WANT TO CHANGE THAT REALITY, WE MUST UNDERSTAND EXACTLY WHAT IS AT STAKE. THIS IS A FIGHT FOR FREEDOM! THIS IS NOT SOMEBODY ELSE’S FIGHT. THIS IS OUR FIGHT. AND IT IS A FIGHT THAT WE ABSOLUTELY MUST WIN.

SEAN DUFFY:

WE CAN MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN. AND WE WILL. BUT IT’S GOING TO TAKE ALL OF US IN WISCONSIN. AND HELLO, WISCONSIN!

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

WE TURNED OUR BLUE STATE RED!

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

WE HAVE WON EVERY ELECTION EXCEPT THE BIG ONE. WE CAN’T STAY HOME NOW. IF WE’RE GOING TO SAVE OUR COUNTRY. AMERICA, LET’S RALLY BEHIND DONALD TRUMP AND TOGETHER LET’S MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT DID WISCONSIN DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION, DELEGATES WHO CAST MOST THEIR VOTES FOR TED CRUZ, MAKE OF THE WEEK THAT SAW DONALD TRUMP FORMALLY NOMINATED. WE TURN NOW TO WISCONSIN PUBLIC RADIO REPORTER SHAWN JOHNSON WHO’S COVERING THE PARTY CONVENTION. HE JOINS US FROM CLEVELAND. AND SHAWN, THANKS FOR DOING SO.

SHAWN JOHNSON:

THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

HOW WAS DONALD TRUMP’S SPEECH RECEIVED IN THE CONVENTION HALL?

SHAWN JOHNSON:

IN THE CONVENTION HALL ITSELF IT GOT PRETTY LOUD FOR SOME OF HIS LINES. I THINK YOU HAVE TO SAY IT WAS WELL-RECEIVED IN THERE. TO THE HANDFUL OF REPUBLICANS I SPOKE WITH AFTER THE SPEECH, MOST OF THEM LIKED IT. GOVERNOR WALKER THOUGHT IT WAS EXACTLY WHAT TRUMP NEEDED TO DO. HE SAID TRUMP NEEDED TO LAY OUT A PLAN. HE THOUGHT THAT HE DID. I TALKED TO DON TAYLOR, A LONGTIME WAUKESHA COUNTY GOP ACTIVIST, THE PARTY CHAIR IN WAUKESHA COUNTY FOR 30 YEARS. HE SAID HE DIDN’T REALLY KNOW MUCH ABOUT DONALD TRUMP AT THE START OF THIS CAMPAIGN, BUT THE MORE HE KNOWS, THE MORE HE LIKES. AND THIS CONVENTION SEALED IT FOR HIM. I TALKED TO VAN MOBLEY, WHO A FEW MONTHS AGO WAS THE ONLY DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTER YOU COULD FIND IN WISCONSIN, ELECTED OFFICIAL. HE LIKED WHAT HE SAW. ONE PERSON I TALKED TO WHO DIDN’T CARE FOR IT WAS CHARLIE SYKES, CONSERVATIVE TALK SHOW RADIO HOST OUT OF MILWAUKEE AND AN OUTSPOKEN LEADER OF THE SO-CALLED NEVER TRUMP MOVEMENT. CHARLES SYKES WAS A LITTLE BIT DOWNTRODDEN AFTER THE SPEECH. HE CONCEDED THAT IT WAS WELL-RECEIVED IN THAT HALL, BUT HE FEELS LIKE IT’S KIND OF THE CAPITULATION OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IN THE NAME OF TRUMP.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

SO EARLIER IN THE WEEK, WHAT DID DELEGATES YOU SPOKE TO MAKE OF TED CRUZ SO POINTEDLY NOT ENDORSING TRUMP? KIND OF A BIG BLOW-UP THERE AT THAT CONVENTION.

SHAWN JOHNSON:

YEAH. THAT WAS REALLY — UNTIL TRUMP’S SPEECH, THAT HAD THE RISK FOR REPUBLICANS OF BEING THE DEFINING MOMENT. BECAUSE, REMEMBER, THIS HAPPENED ON THE NIGHT WHEN THEY WERE SET TO NOMINATE MIKE PENCE AS THE VICE-PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE. NOBODY REALLY REMEMBERS PENCE’S SPEECH BECAUSE TED CRUZ GOT UP THERE AND SAID NOTHING ABOUT AN ENDORSEMENT. AND SAID VOTE YOUR CONSCIENCE. AND THERE WAS BOOING IN THE HALL. SO I THINK EVEN THOUGH WISCONSIN WAS A CRUZ STATE, WHAT YOU HEARD FROM AT LEAST THE DELEGATES WHO TALKED ABOUT WHAT CRUZ DID THAT NIGHT WAS THAT THEY DIDN’T REALLY CARE FOR IT. THEY THOUGHT THAT IT OVERSTEPPED ON BEHALF OF CRUZ. THEY THOUGHT THAT IT WENT AGAINST THE INTEREST OF THE PARTY. GOVERNOR WALKER, SOMEBODY WHO LIKE CRUZ, RAN FOR PRESIDENT AND LOST TO DONALD TRUMP, AND WALKER NOTED THAT THEY WERE BOTH ON A STAGE ABOUT A YEAR AGO IN CLEVELAND WHERE THEY TOOK AN OATH TO SUPPORT WHOMEVER EMERGED FROM THE REPUBLICAN PRIMARY. WALKER SAID THAT HE STANDS BY THAT BECAUSE HE THINKS THAT ANY OF THE CANDIDATES WHO RAN FOR PRESIDENT ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE WERE BETTER THAN HILLARY CLINTON.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

AND SO THE GRASP ON THE GOP PARTY UNITY MIGHT HAVE BEEN MORE FRAGILE EARLIER IN THE WEEK, BUT IT SEEMS LIKE THE NOMINEE HAS KIND OF PULLED IT BACK TOGETHER, AT LEAST FROM WHAT YOU’RE HEARING FOLLOWING HIS LONG SPEECH.

SHAWN JOHNSON:

YEAH. IT WAS KIND OF REMARKABLE TO SEE IT PROGRESS THROUGHOUT THE WEEK. I MEAN, EARLY ON IN THE WEEK YOU HAD REPUBLICANS SPEAKING TO THE WISCONSIN GOP DELEGATION. AND IN THEIR SPEECHES, FOR EXAMPLE, PAUL RYAN DIDN’T EVEN MENTION DONALD TRUMP BY NAME. REBECCA KLEEFISCH, THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR, DID NOT MENTION DONALD TRUMP BY NAME. IN FACT, SHE RELINQUISHED HER DELEGATE STATUS. SO THERE ARE OBVIOUS SIGNS THERE THAT THE WISCONSIN REPUBLICAN PARTY IS STILL WARMING UP TO DONALD TRUMP. IT SEEMED LIKE EARLIER THIS YEAR THEY MIGHT NOT. BUT I THINK WHEN SOMEBODY LIKE GOVERNOR WALKER COMES ALONG — GOVERNOR WALKER WHO BY THE WAY, A FEW WEEKS AGO WOULDN’T EVEN MENTION DONALD TRUMP BY NAME HIMSELF. NOW WALKER’S ON BOARD. HE SPEAKS AT THE CONVENTION. HE’S TALKING NOT ONLY ABOUT WHY DONALD TRUMP IS A BETTER ALTERNATIVE THAN HILLARY CLINTON. BUT HE’S COMPLIMENTING DONALD TRUMP. HE’S SAYING NICE THINGS ABOUT DONALD TRUMP, WHICH WOULDN’T BE NOTEWORTHY IN A NORMAL ELECTION YEAR, BUT THIS YEAR IT IS. WALKER SETS THE TONE AND THE REST OF THE PARTY IS SLOWLY FOLLOWING.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

TED CRUZ SEEMS TO BE SETTING HIMSELF UP FOR A 2020 RUN IF TRUMP LOSES. WHAT ABOUT SCOTT WALKER?

SHAWN JOHNSON:

SCOTT WALKER MET WITH THE DELEGATIONS OF IOWA, SOUTH CAROLINA AND NEW HAMPSHIRE THIS WEEK. AND IF YOU’RE WONDERING WHY THOSE STATES, IT’S PRETTY OBVIOUS THOSE ARE THE STATES THAT HAVE THE EARLY PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARIES OR NOMINATING CONTESTS. SO WALKER’S DOWNPLAYING THAT, BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF OTHER DELEGATIONS HE COULD HAVE MET WITH. IT’S A PRETTY CLEAR SIGN THAT HE WANTS TO BE THOUGHT OF SHOULD DONALD TRUMP NOT WIN THIS YEAR IN 2020 OR IF DONALD TRUMP DOES WIN THIS YEAR, IN 2024 AND BEYOND. HE’S TAKING A MUCH DIFFERENT APPROACH THAN TED CRUZ. WALKER IS KIND OF PLAYING IT SAFE AND BACKING TRUMP IN THE NAME OF PARTY. CRUZ IS OUT THERE SAYING, I KNOW THIS IS UNPOPULAR RIGHT NOW, BUT I CAN’T DO THIS AND, YOU KNOW, WHEN 2020 COMES, IF IT’S AN OPEN SEAT AGAIN, HE’LL BE THE GUY THAT TOOK THAT STAND, WHEREAS THERE WILL BE A LOT OF REPUBLICANS LIKE SCOTT WALKER WHO DID NOT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

ALL RIGHT. SHAWN JOHNSON, WE LEAVE IT THERE. WE WILL TOUCH IN WITH YOU NEXT WEEK FROM THE DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION. THANKS VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US FROM CLEVELAND.

SHAWN JOHNSON:

THANKS, FRED.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT A ROLLER COASTER THE REPUBLICAN CONVENTION WAS. HOW WILL THE DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION COMPARE? TONIGHT REPUBLICAN BILL MCCOSHEN AND DEMOCRAT SCOT ROSS WEIGH IN. THANKS FOR BEING HERE.

BILL MCCOSHEN AND SCOT ROSS:

THANKS FOR HAVING US.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

I KNOW YOU BOTH WALKED THE DONALD TRUMP SPEECH LAST NIGHT. FIRST YOU, BILL. DO YOU THINK THAT WILL HELP HILLARY CLINTON OR HURT HER?

BILL MCCOSHEN:

I THINK IT WILL HURT HER. FRANK LUNTZ, A RENOWNED POLLSTER DID FOCUS GROUPS ALL WEEK LONG DURING THE REPUBLICAN CONVENTION OF UNDECIDED VOTERS. WHAT TRUMP WAS SUCCESSFUL IN DOING LAS NIGHT WAS PROSECUTING THE CASE AGAINST HILLARY CLINTON SO NONE OF THE UNDECIDEDS WOULD CONSIDER HER AFTER THE END OF THE WEEK AND AFTER THE END OF THE TRUMP SPEECH. ONLY HALF OR SO WOULD CONSIDER TRUMP. SO HE’S GOT A WAYS TO GO. BUT I THINK IT WAS A SUCCESSFUL NIGHT FOR TRUMP FOR SURE.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

SCOT, WHAT DO YOU THINK?

SCOT ROSS:

I THINK WE HAD FOUR DAYS OF REPUBLICANS UP THERE READING EVERY CHAIN EMAIL THEY’VE RECEIVED SINCE WE HAD THE AUDACITY TO ELECT A BLACK PRESIDENT. IT WAS ALL ABOUT FEAR. FEAR AS THEY SAID IN THE BOOK “DUNE” IS A MIND KILLER. SO THE FACTS DON’T MATTER. WHEN YOU GET DOWN TO THE FACTS, WE COULD SPEND ALL OF OUR TIME UNTIL CHRISTMAS TALKING ABOUT WHAT FACTS WERE INCORRECT. BUT THAT EMOTION IS DEFINITELY HOW THEY’RE RUNNING THIS CAMPAIGN. THIS IS ABOUT DIVIDING PEOPLE. THIS IS ABOUT STOKING FEAR AND THE FACTS BE DAMNED.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT ABOUT THAT WHOLE FEAR FACTOR?

BILL MCCOSHEN:

I THINK DONALD TRUMP IS THE ONLY ONE OF THE 17 ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE AND THE ONLY ONE IN THE RACE NOW THAT IS CONNECTING WITH PEOPLE ON A REAL LEVEL. THEY ARE SCARED. THEY’RE AFRAID OF THEIR SECURITY. WE’RE HAVING MORE DOMESTIC ATTACKS THAN EVER BEFORE. NEVER HAPPENED WHEN BUSH WAS PRESIDENT. WE WERE NEVER ATTACKED ON OUR HOMELAND. NOW IT’S HAPPENED FOUR TIMES IN THE LAST FEW MONTHS. PEOPLE ARE AFRAID. THEY’RE AFRAID OF THEIR ECONOMIC SITUATION. DONALD TRUMP AGAIN HAS FIGURED THAT OUT AND HE’S CONNECTED WITH THOSE PEOPLE. HE IS THEIR VOICE. TO USE HIS WORDS FROM LAST NIGHT I THINK THAT WAS THE SINGLE BEST LINE HE HAD IN THE SPEECH AND IT RESONATED.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

SO HOW DOES HILLARY CLINTON UNPACK THAT FEAR? HOW DO YOU RESPOND TO A FEAR THAT PEOPLE ARE CONNECTING WITH?

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

I THINK, ONE AGAIN, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT FACTS, I MEAN BILL WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, 9/11 HAPPENED WHEN GEORGE BUSH WAS THE PRESIDENT. IF YOU THINK ABOUT WHAT HE SAID ABOUT VIOLENT CRIME AND MURDERS, WE ARE AT A 40-YEAR LOW FOR THE RATE OF MURDERS AND VIOLENT CRIME IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. PROPERTY CRIMES HAVE BEEN DWINDLING FOR 25 YEARS. GRANTED PEOPLE WHEN THEY’RE TOLD OVER AND OVER AGAIN WE HAVE THINGS TO FEAR WILL RESPOND TO THAT. THE MOST IMPORTANT THING THAT HILLARY CLINTON NEEDS TO DO IS MAKE SURE SHE’S NOT IN THE SAME BUBBLE THE REPUBLICANS ARE CURRENTLY IN IN TERMS OF YOU JUST LISTEN TO THE PEOPLE AROUND YOU AND NOT WHAT REAL AMERICANS ARE THINKING.

BILL MCCOSHEN:

I THINK THEY’RE DENYING. WHETHER IT’S THE VA WHERE HILLARY CLINTON SAID IT WASN’T THAT BIG OF A DEAL. ASK A VETERAN IF IT WAS A BIG DEAL. IT WAS A VERY BIG DEAL. WHETHER IT’S ECONOMICS. PEOPLE THINK IT’S A BIG DEAL THAT OVERALL INCOMES IN THIS ECONOMY, OVER THE LAST 14, 15 YEARS, HAVE GONE DOWN BY ABOUT $4,000. THOSE ARE REAL FEARS.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT TED CRUZ. WHAT DID YOU MAKE OF HIM KIND OF GOING SCORCHED EARTH AND NOT ENDORSING THE NOMINEE?

BILL MCCOSHEN:

I’M WITH CHARLES KRAUTHAMMER ON THAT ONE. I THINK IT WAS THE LONGEST, YOU KNOW, SUICIDE LETTER EVER. IT WAS JUST STUPID. IF YOU’RE GOING TO DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT, YOU DON’T GO. HAVE THE CLASS NOT TO GO.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT’D YOU THINK?

SCOT ROSS:

I AGREE. SCOTT WALKER, PAUL RYAN, RON JOHNSON, ROBIN VOS, SCOTT FITZGERALD ALL JUMPED IN LINE. THAT ALL SAID WE’RE NOW ON THE TRUMP BANDWAGON. WE’VE FULLY ENDORSED HIM. I THINK IT WAS…

BILL MCCOSHEN:

IT WAS PETTY. THERE WAS NO NEED FOR IT. IT CERTAINLY DIDN’T SET HIM UP LIKE HE THINKS IT MAY HAVE. REMEMBER REAGAN DID SOMETHING SIMILAR IN 76. IT SET HIM UP. THIS WILL SET CRUZ BACK AND PROBABLY SHORTEN HIS CAREER.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

I WANTED TO ASK YOU ONE THING, BILL MCCOSHEN, ABOUT DONALD TRUMP. AND HE REPORTEDLY ASKED JOHN KASICH TO BE HIS VP AND SAID YOU’LL BE THE MOST POWERFUL VP IN HISTORY. YOU TAKE DOMESTIC AND FOREIGN RELATIONS AND I’LL DO THE REST. IS THAT TRUE?

BILL MCCOSHEN:

NOT THAT I’M AWARE OF. BUT IF IT IS, KASICH SHOULD HAVE TAKEN THE DEAL. HE WOULD HAVE BEEN A GREAT PICK. I’M A FAN OF MIKE PENCE. I THINK IT IS A GOOD PICK TO BRING THE CONSERVATIVES AROUND, BUT I THINK KASICH WOULD HAVE BEEN EVEN BETTER. I’M NOT AWARE THAT THAT DEAL WAS EVER OFFERED, BUT IF IT WAS, IT’S UNFORTUNATE THAT KASICH WALKED AWAY FROM IT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT DID YOU THINK OF SCOTT WALKER’S SPEECH?

SCOT ROSS:

AFTER AGAIN THE HUCKSTERS AND THINGS, WE HAVE WHAT VITAMIN SALESMEN AND PYRAMID SCHEMES. IT WAS LIKE SCOTT WALKER STOOD UP THERE AND TOLD ME HOW I WAS GOING TO LOSE THE LAST 20 POUNDS I NEED TO LOSE. WELL, MAYBE MORE THAN 20. BUT I THINK HE WAS CLEARLY MAKING A CASE THAT I’LL STILL BE AROUND IN 2020. THE INTERESTING THING WAS WHEN TOMMY THOMPSON SAID HE’S NOT GOING TO WIN IN 2018.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT ABOUT THAT? TOMMY THOMPSON THIS WEEK CAME OUT AND SAID WELL WITH NUMBERS LIKE THAT, I DON’T THINK HE SHOULD RUN AGAIN FOR GOVERNOR AND REALLY I PREFER PAUL RYAN OVER SCOTT WALKER FOR PRESIDENT IN THE FUTURE. WHAT’S UP WITH TOMMY THOMPSON AND SCOTT WALKER?

BILL MCCOSHEN:

I THINK THERE ARE THREE ISSUES THERE. THE FIRST ONE IS I THINK WALKER DID IT THE RIGHT WAY, WITH CLASS. WHEN YOU LOSE, YOU WITH CLASS. AND HE DID. HE STOOD UP THERE. HE SUPPORTED THE NOMINEE AND DID HIS BEST TO GENERATE EXCITEMENT FOR THE NOMINEE. THAT’S EXACTLY WHAT YOU NEEDED TO DO IN THAT SITUATION. AS IT RELATES TO ’18, TWO YEARS IS A LONG TIME. I DON’T KNOW IF HE WANTS TO RUN FOR RE-ELECTION, MAYBE HE DOES, MAYBE HE DOESN’T. BUT HE’S GOT TIME TO REBUILD THOSE NUMBERS IF HE WANTS TO. REMEMBER, BARACK OBAMA’S NUMBERS TWO YEARS OUT WERE NOT VERY GOOD AND PEOPLE DIDN’T THINK HE’D BE RE-ELECTED AND HE EASILY BEAT MITT ROMNEY. SO A LOT CAN HAPPEN IN TWO YEARS. AND FINALLY AS IT RELATES TO THE FUTURE, I’M A PAUL RYAN FAN, TOO. I THINK HE WILL BE PRESIDENT ONE DAY. I DON’T KNOW IF SCOTT WALKER WILL BE, BUT I THINK PAUL RYAN IS WELL-POSITIONED FOR A RUN NATIONALLY AT SOME POINT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

SO THIS DOESN’T SUGGEST TOMMY THOMPSON DOESN’T RESPECT THE POLITICS OF SCOTT WALKER?

BILL MCCOSHEN:

NO, NOT AT ALL. THEY’RE GOOD FRIENDS. TOMMY GIVES HIM ADVICE ON A REGULAR BASIS. GOVERNOR WALKER FROM TIME TO TIME TAKES IT. SOMETIMES HE DOESN’T TAKE IT, BUT THEY’RE TWO DIFFERENT POLITICIANS IN JUST ABOUT EVERY WAY.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

ANOTHER THING THAT HAPPENED THIS WEEK WAS THAT A COUPLE OF GROUPS PULLED THEIR AD BUYS FOR RON JOHNSON.

BILL MCCOSHEN:

YEAH.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

GIVEN THAT THESE POLLS BETWEEN RON JOHNSON AND RUSS FEINGOLD ARE NARROWING, THOUGH, DOES THAT SEEM PREMATURE?

SCOT ROSS:

I THINK IT’S INTERESTING AND I THINK THEY MUST HAVE INTERNALS THAT SHOW THINGS ARE NOT GOING IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION. I DO WANT TO SAY WITH RON JOHNSON, IT’S VERY INTERESTING. HE WASN’T HERE CAMPAIGNING AND HE WASN’T IN D.C. DOING HIS JOB. I THINK THAT IS A GREAT JUXTAPOSITION IF YOU’RE THE FEINGOLD CAMPAIGN FOR WHAT WAS GOING ON THIS WEEK. RON JOHNSON WENT BACK ON HIS WORD, SUDDENLY SHOWED UP IN CLEVELAND. MEANWHILE WE HAVE A VACANCY ON THE SUPREME COURT THAT’S NOW GONE LONGER THAN ANY OTHER NOMINATION IN HISTORY.

BILL MCCOSHEN:

I THINK IT’S TOO EARLY. I WOULDN’T HAVE MADE THAT CALL QUITE THAT QUICKLY. BUT THE REALITY IS BOTH JOHNSON OR THEIR ALLIES OR FEINGOLD AND HIS ALLIES HAVE ALREADY SPENT FIVE, SIX MILLION A PIECE AND THEY HAVEN’T MOVED THE NEEDLE AT ALL. SO NOBODY’S PAYING ATTENTION TO THAT RACE YET. I THINK THE OUTSIDE GROUPS PULLED OUT TOO SOON IF THAT IS IN FACT THE CASE. TRUMP’S MESSAGE COULD RESONATE HERE. THE MESSAGE HE GAVE LAST NIGHT IS GOING TO RESONATE IN MICHIGAN, PENNSYLVANIA, OHIO AND IT COULD RESONATE HERE AS IT RELATES TO TRADE DEALS.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

MEANWHILE RUSS FEINGOLD I UNDERSTAND IS NOT GOING TO THE DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION. WHY NOT?

SCOT ROSS:

YOU’LL HAVE TO ASK SENATOR FEINGOLD.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT DO YOU THINK?

SCOT ROSS:

I THINK HE’S HERE CAMPAIGNING. THERE’S GOING TO BE A LOT OF THING THERE. HE’S IN A TIGHT RACE AND WANTS TO DO WHAT HE HAS TO DO HERE IN ORDER TO WIN.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT DO YOU THINK?

BILL MCCOSHEN:

I THINK THERE’S A LOT OF STINK ON HILLARY CLINTON AND HE DOESN’T WANT TO BE ASSOCIATED WITH IT. THE REALITY IS VOTERS DON’T THINK SHE’S HONEST OR TRUSTWORTHY. 57% OF VOTERS THINK THAT JIM COMEY’S DECISION WAS THE WRONG ONE. THAT SHE SHOULD HAVE BEEN INDICTED. I DON’T THINK HE WANTS ANY PART OF THAT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

DO YOU THINK THAT WAS THE ISSUE WITH RON JOHNSON, WHEN HE WAS NOT GOING TO GO AND THEN HE WENT. SAME ISSUE, DIFFERENT CANDIDATE?

BILL MCCOSHEN:

I’M NOT SURE. I MEAN IF I WERE JOHNSON, I WOULD HAVE GONE FROM THE GET-GO BECAUSE TRUMP IS VERY POPULAR IN NORTHERN WISCONSIN AND WESTERN WISCONSIN. IF HE CAN TURN TALK RADIO IN SOUTHEASTERN WISCONSIN, HE’S GOING TO HAVE A CHANCE HERE.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WE NEED TO LEAVE IT THERE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WE’LL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

BILL MCCOSHEN AND SCOT ROSS:

THANK YOU.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WITH JUST 3.5 MONTHS BEFORE ELECTION DAY A FEDERAL JUDGE IN MILWAUKEE RULED THIS WEEK THAT PEOPLE WHO CANNOT SUPPLY VOTER ID CAN USE AFFIDAVITS SWEARING TO THEIR IDENTITIES INSTEAD. U.S. DISTRICT COURT JUDGE LYNN ADELMAN SAYING IN HIS RULING THAT QUOTE, A SAFETY NET IS NEEDED FOR THOSE VOTERS WHO CANNOT OBTAIN QUALIFYING I.D. WITH REASONABLE EFFORT. THE RULING ALLOWING AFFIDAVITS WILL BE IN PLACE FOR THE GENERAL ELECTION NOVEMBER 8 BUT NOT FOR THE AUGUST 9 PRIMARY. WISCONSIN ATTORNEY GENERAL BRAD SCHIMEL HAS NOT YET DECIDED WHETHER TO APPEAL. THIS AFTERNOON, GOVERNOR SCOTT WALKER ANNOUNCED HE WILL APPEAL THE VOTER ID DECISION. IN STATE CAPITOL NEWS, GOVERNOR WALKER THIS AFTERNOON ANNOUNCED HIS PICK TO TAKE THE SEAT OF RETIRING STATE SUPREME COURT JUSTICE DAVID PROSSER. HE’S WAUKESHA ATTORNEY DANIEL KELLY, WHO WAS PART OF THE LEGAL TEAM WHICH REPRESENTED JUSTICE PROSSER DURING HIS NARROW 2011 RECOUNT WIN. KELLY WILL SERVE UNTIL 2020, AT WHICH TIME HE MAY SEEK ELECTION TO A FULL TEN-YEAR TERM. BACK TO THE REPUBLICAN CONVENTION IN CLEVELAND. THAT’S WHERE HOUSE SPEAKER PAUL RYAN TOUCHED ON POLICY ENCOMPASSED IN HIS SO-CALLED “BETTER WAY” PROPOSALS, INCLUDING GETTING AT POVERTY. HERE’S HIS ROLL-OUT OF THE POVERTY PRONG.

PAUL RYAN:

NUMBER ONE, REWARD WORK. NUMBER TWO, TAILOR BENEFITS TO PEOPLE’S SPECIFIC NEEDS. NUMBER THREE, DEMAND RESULTS, HOLD EACH OTHER ACCOUNTABLE. NUMBER FOUR, IMPROVE SKILLS AND SCHOOLS. NUMBER FIVE, HELP PEOPLE SAVE AND PLAN FOR THEIR FUTURE SO THAT PEOPLE HAVE THEIR OWN HORIZON THAT THEY’RE SHOOTING FOR. THIS IS HOW YOU FIGHT POVERTY. THIS IS HOW YOU CREATE OPPORTUNITY. THIS IS HOW YOU HELP PEOPLE MOVE ONWARD AND UPWARD.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

ACROSS THE AISLE, U.S. SENATOR TAMMY BALDWIN AND SENATE COLLEAGUE CORY BOOKER HAVE INTRODUCED LEGISLATION TO FIGHT POVERTY. THEIRS TITLED “THE STRONGER WAY ACT.” THEY CALL FOR A NEW TRANSITIONAL JOBS GRANT PROGRAM, EXPANDING THE EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT AND CHILD TAX CREDIT. SENATOR BALDWIN IS HERE TONIGHT WITH DETAIL ON HER PLAN AND THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

TAMMY BALDWIN:

I’M DELIGHTED TO JOIN YOU. THANKS.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

NOW, ONE OF THE THINGS PAUL RYAN TALKS ABOUT IN HIS PLAN IS EXPANDING THE EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT. IS THIS A PLACE FOR COMPROMISE?

TAMMY BALDWIN:

THIS IS A PLACE OF AGREEMENT, AND I WOULD SAY THAT THE THREE COMPONENTS YOU JUST OUTLINED OF THIS MEASURE, THE STRONGER WAY ACT, HAVE ALL RECEIVED BIPARTISAN SUPPORT IN THE PAST, WHICH MAKES IT SO HOPEFUL IN TERMS OF FINDING COMPROMISE AND FINDING A PATH TOGETHER TO MAKE A REAL DIFFERENCE ON POVERTY IN AMERICA.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

AND YET ARE THERE CUTS THAT RYAN IMPOSES TO EXPAND THE CREDIT THAT DEMOCRATS DON’T GO FOR?

TAMMY BALDWIN:

WELL, LET ME POINT OUT A HISTORY GOING BACK DECADES OF ENORMOUS TAX CUTS, MOSTLY BENEFITING THE VERY WEALTHY, THAT HAVE NEVER BEEN PAID FOR. REFLECT ON PRESIDENT BUSH’S , THAT TERM WITH TWO MASSIVE TAX CUT BILLS, TAX CREDITS AND TAX CUTS, ET CETERA, THAT HAVEN’T BEEN PAID FOR. I DON’T KNOW WHY THE RULES SHOULD CHANGE WHEN WE’RE TALKING ABOUT IMPACTING POVERTY AND RECOGNIZING THE DIGNITY OF WORK BY EXPANDING THE EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT OR THE CHILD TAX CREDIT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

DESCRIBE FOR US HOW EXPANDING THE EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT IN YOUR PROPOSAL DOES HELP THE WORKING POOR.

TAMMY BALDWIN:

WELL, FIRST OF ALL, FOR THOSE WHO ARE CHILDLESS, EITHER THEIR CHILDREN ARE GROWN AND OUT OF THE HOME, THOSE WHO DON’T HAVE CHILDREN, THE EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT TODAY HAS LITTLE OR NO IMPACT. AND YET MANY OF THOSE PEOPLE WHO ARE WORKING AT LOW WAGES ARE LITERALLY TAXED INTO POVERTY. THE SOCIAL SECURITY AND MEDICARE, PAYROLL TAXES COME OUT REGARDLESS OF INCOME. AND SO FOR MANY OF THOSE INDIVIDUALS, THERE WILL BE BENEFIT THAT THEY DON’T SEE TODAY. IN OTHER RESPECTS, THIS BILL WORKS IN COMBINATION, THOSE THREE PROVISIONS, THE TRANSITIONAL JOBS, THE EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT AND THE CHILD TAX CREDIT, TO LIFT SO MANY FAMILIES OUT OF POVERTY, AND ESTIMATES ARE THAT 63 MILLION AMERICANS WOULD BE IMPACTED BY THIS COMBINATION OF STRATEGIES IF BROUGHT UP TO SCALE.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

DESCRIBE FOR US WHAT TRANSITIONAL JOBS ARE.

TAMMY BALDWIN:

IT’S A GREAT QUESTION. SO, FIRST OF ALL, AS I NOTED BEFORE, IT’S A PROGRAM THAT HAS RECEIVED BIPARTISAN SUPPORT IN THE PAST. ABOUT 20 STATES HAVE CERTAIN TRANSITIONAL JOBS PROGRAMS, INCLUDING WISCONSIN. BUT THEY ARE USUALLY LOCAL OR PRETTY SMALL. BECAUSE THEY’VE PROVEN SUCCESSFUL — AND WHAT THEY ARE ARE SUBSIDIZED WAGE LABOR, JOBS, WITH TRAINING ASSOCIATED WITH IT AND SUPPORT SERVICES TO HELP PEOPLE WHO HAVE REAL BARRIERS TO KEEPING EMPLOYMENT OR HAVE BEEN UNEMPLOYED FOR A LONG, LONG TIME. SUPPORT STRUCTURE THERE TO HELP MAKE THEIR JOB PLACEMENT SUCCESSFUL AND TO SORT OF WEAN OFF THE TRANSITIONAL JOB INTO A PERMANENT JOB.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

AND SO THIS BILL WOULD PROVIDE A FEDERAL GRANT TOWARD THOSE TRANSITIONAL JOBS. HOW DO YOU PAY FOR THIS PROGRAM TO GET AT POVERTY?

TAMMY BALDWIN:

WELL, THAT’S GOING TO BE A CHOICE FOR THE CONGRESS. I KNOW — AND, AGAIN, THESE ARE RESEARCH-BASED POLICY PROPOSALS. I KNOW IT WORKS. AND IF WE WANT IT TO WORK ON A GRAND SCALE AND HELP PEOPLE WORK THEIR WAY OUT OF POVERTY WITH OUR SUPPORT, THEN IT WILL HAVE TO BE FUNDED TO APPLY IN EVERY STATE AND HOPEFULLY EVERY LOCALITY. THE SIZE OF THE GRANT WILL BE UP TO THE CONGRESS WHEN WE GET TO WORK ON THIS. BUT RIGHT NOW THERE’S JUST BEEN RHETORIC AROUND POVERTY. YOU SHOWED THAT CLIP OF MY COLLEAGUE, MY FORMER COLLEAGUE, PAUL RYAN. I WELCOME HIS DECISION TO TALK ABOUT POVERTY, BUT TALK ISN’T ENOUGH. HE HAS A BOOKLET. I HAVE A BILL. I’M IN THE RING, READY TO WORK ON MAKING THIS A REALITY, AND I WELCOME HIM INTO THAT RING, TOO.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

NEXT WEEK WE’RE MOVING TO THE CONVENTION IN THIS DISCUSSION, BUT NEXT WEEK IT’S THE DEMOCRATS’ TURN. HOW WILL YOUR PARTY CONVENTION LOOK DIFFERENT IN YOUR MIND THAN WHAT WE’VE SEEN FROM THE GOP?

TAMMY BALDWIN:

NIGHT AND DAY, IF YOU WILL. THE CONVENTION — AND I SAW PARTS OF IT THIS PAST WEEK — WAS SO DIVISIVE ON THE PART OF THE REPUBLICANS. VERY LITTLE OF IT FOCUSED ON THEIR NOMINEE. MOST OF IT FOCUSED ON PERSONAL ATTACKS AGAINST HILLARY CLINTON. AND THERE WERE VERY FEW POLICY IDEAS ABOUT HOW WE ARE GOING TO RESPOND TO THE VERY REAL CHALLENGES THAT AMERICANS FACE. AT THE DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION, I THINK YOU’RE GOING TO HEAR SPECIFICS. YOU’RE GOING TO HEAR A GROUP OF PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT HOW WE HAVE THE MOST QUALIFIED AND EXPERIENCED NOMINEE, PERHAPS THIS COUNTRY HAS EVER HAD, BUT CERTAINLY IN MANY DECADES. YOU’RE GOING TO SEE UNITY. AND, YES, THERE WILL BE CONTRASTS DRAWN WITH WHAT AMERICA HAS SEEN THIS PAST WEEK, BUT IT WILL BE OUR CHANCE TO MAKE A VERY HOPEFUL MESSAGE, NOT A MESSAGE OF FEAR, TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

ALL RIGHT. TAMMY BALDWIN, WE LEAVE IT THERE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

TAMMY BALDWIN:

THANK YOU.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

THAT’S OUR PROGRAM FOR TONIGHT. NEXT WEEK, FULL COVERAGE OF THE DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION IN PHILADELPHIA. I’M FREDERICA FREYBERG. HAVE A GREAT WEEKEND.

ANNOUNCER:

FUNDING FOR “HERE AND NOW” IS PROVIDED, IN PART, BY FRIENDS OF WISCONSIN PUBLIC TELEVISION. FOR MORE INFORMATION ON “HERE AND NOW’S” 2016 ELECTION COVERAGE, GO TO wisconsinvote.org.