By the River with Holly Jackson

Host> Multiple award-winning journalist and author Michael DeWitt Jr. uses his extensive journalistic experience and research skills to cover a small community in South Carolina that has received national recognition.

His book, "Wicked Hampton County," details the corruption, murders and crimes that remained in the memories of locals for years.

Michael talks to me about his experience covering the Murdaugh murders trial and how this has impacted the small community of Hampton County.

I'm Holly Jackson.

Join us as we bring you powerful stories from both new and established Southern authors as we sit by the river.

Narrator> Major funding for "By The River" is provided by the ETV Endowment of South Carolina For more than 40 years, The ETV Endowment of South Carolina has been a partner of South Carolina ETV, and South Carolina Public Radio.

>> Hi, I am Holly Jackson, host of "By The River."

Thanks so much for joining us today.

You know, "By the River" is a show that goes beyond the book.

We help you get a better understanding of the journey that led the author to that story and to that book.

And we have a great lineup for you this season.

And today is one I'm especially excited about.

He is Michael DeWitt.

We're talking about "Wicked Hampton County."

And boy, we have a lot to talk about, Michael.

Thanks so much for joining us here on "By the River."

Michael> My pleasure.

Thank you for having me.

>> Just down the road in Hampton County, you know, Hampton County is one of those places, kind of like where I'm from is you say where you're from and in the same sentence you typically say it's between so and so and so and so as an identifying place because they typically don't know where you're talking about.

But that's changed for Hampton and people all over the world now know Hampton.

Did you ever think that that would be the case?

>> No, I thought if we, you know, before recent events happened, if we were known at all, we were known for our Watermelon Festival, and like you say, we're kind of out in the middle of nowhere.

We're about an hour from everywhere, an hour from Charleston, hour and a half, I mean, hour, from Savannah just, you know, kinda close to something, but not quite close to anything, really.

And Hampton has been a quiet place until recently.

>> Okay.

I feel like we need to address the why in case there's anybody out there who's thinking, what are they talking about?

So why is it that Hampton is now known?

>> A local attorney from a prominent family, he was the latest generation in a dynasty of, of prosecutors and attorneys in Hampton.

His son was involved in a, in a fatal boat crash right here in Beaufort County.

And people outside the 14th circuit who didn't know this family were suddenly introduced to this family through this fatal boat crash.

It was almost like the, the Kennedy scandal in the sixties where, um, I think a car crashed and a young lady died.

Well, this was a boat crash and a young lady went in the, in the river and that kind of put a spotlight on, on this local family and introduced them to the entire Palmetto state.

Then that South Carolina story became a national story when that attorney Alex Murdaugh, when his wife and son Paul were murdered in Colleton County, they have a, a hunting retreat, which was their primary residence.

People call it a hunting estate, but it was where they lived and his wife and child were murdered.

And all of a sudden this story blew up into a kind of a national level story.

Then when the public learned that this lawyer had been stealing money for over a decade, it was a multi-county, multiple victim financial crimes spree, and he attempted to stage a shooting of himself beside the road in Hampton County.

And then all of a sudden it became an international crime saga.

You've got Netflix, you've got people all over the English speaking world now know where Hampton County is and know about this Murdaugh family because of the, the rogue actions of this, this local attorney.

>> First of all, congratulations on summing that up.

That was impressive because it's pretty hard to tell all that in just a few sentences.

>> I have told this story in seven words and I have told this story in 7,000 words.

<My gosh!> It's easier when you have 7,000 words.

>> I bet it is.

Now you also serve as the editor of the local newspaper.

And as, like I said, you know, I'm from a, a small town much like yours and there can be weeks whenever you don't know how in the world you're gonna fill that space.

What was it like as a writer going from somebody go out and take a picture of something so we can fill this space to having all this material to go with?

>> You kinda summed up what I said in, in a recent news interview: Before all this happened, I was, we were sitting around wondering what are we gonna put in the paper this week?

You know, we were, we'd go out and we'd look for, look for stuff, you know, lots, you gotta get some good news in there.

You gotta get grandma winning the cooking contest.

<Right.> You know, all these, these wonderful things.

Bad news happens.

It, it would find its way into the paper and we had to look for stuff.

And I have been the editor of that weekly, small weekly paper in Hampton for going on 20 years now, and I was a different kind of writer before all this happened.

I wrote an award-winning humour column that eventually was published from coast to coast through our newspaper network.

It was like a syndicated column.

I was writing for outdoor magazines like South Carolina Wildlife and Sporting Classics, and I was still very much a country editor, but my dreams were to remain small town, small time quiet, but write, I wanted to be the Lewis Grizzard of the Lowcountry.

And then all this happened and not only did my professional work life change as editor of the paper, but my writing life changed as well.

Holly> You know, all this happens as the print news...

So many newspapers are closing down, you know, and what did you think it taught people as the value of recordkeeping and looking back at those old newspaper articles?

Because suddenly people wanna know what was this person like so many years ago?

Because this is a family that you had covered for years for different reasons.

I mean, so involved in the community.

So it was very interesting to look back and say, you know, this was published then and that sort of thing.

>> Yeah.

To answer that in two parts, this is a very fascinating family if you spent time with them, they had just wonderful legends about themselves, wonderful stories, and I can go in into that, but I covered 'em for 20 years.

Alex Murdaugh's mother taught me English and reading in middle school, I went to school with his little brother.

And so I very much knew this family and they, to, to know him was to like him.

I mean, you could spend five minutes around Alex's father, Randolph Murdaugh III and just hear some of his colorful courtroom stories and you'd walk away like, man, that was, that was, that's just a, just a great guy.

And that was all part of the Murdaugh charisma and charm that Alex Murdaugh later used to his advantage.

But back to the newspaper archives as editor of the paper, and I mentioned it in the, in the book, I inherited over a hundred years of research and archives from previous editors like Wayne Knuckles and the great Martha B. Anderson.

And I respected that history and I preserved it as editor.

And obviously in the recent past year and a half or, or more I've added to it.

But I inherited this, these history and these archives and I cherished them.

And I actually wrote another history book in 2015, and in the process of going through those archives to find the wonderful history of Hampton County, I stumbled upon a lot of dark stories and a lot of the, the secrets of the Murdaugh dynasty that kind of, had kind of been forgotten in our local area, but the rest of the world knew nothing about.

And so, yeah, I, I've spent a lot of time digging through our newspaper archive.

I could not have written either book, any of these history books without those archives.

>> So this book in particular that we're talking about today, "Wicked Hampton County," we've talked a lot about the Murdaughs already so far.

How much are, are they part of this book?

Because they're part of the Hampton story, <Right, right.> Even, even before all this happened.

Michael> That's right.

The...

I had started the research for this book in 2015 when I, when I published "Images of America, Hampton County," and I just had, and my wife worked at the newspaper at the time.

So on rainy day, slow day, we both just went, you know, on a fun dive through the archives and just made copies of interesting stories and, you know, moonshine and, and murder and things that happened, dark stories from, from back in the day and just put 'em in a folder for a rainy day.

Then when this Murdaugh crime saga happened, I was asked to do a lot of different things outta my comfort zone.

I was asked to do national television interviews.

I was approached with the idea of, of writing a book about the Murdaugh dynasty.

I was already writing historical feature stories in our national USA Today network about the Murdaughs.

And my company officials were like, nobody knows this history like you do.

If you wanna write a book or if you want to, you know, do these national interviews, we'll support you, we'll help you out, we'll help you find an agent, whatever you need.

And so, but I had this book just kinda out there waiting in the wings and I needed to do a little more research to do "Follow the House of Murdaugh."

So with one final research effort, I finished this book and I wrote "Follow the House of Murdaugh."

So within the course of a year, 14 months, I've written two books, but it was easier than it sounds because it was, Hampton County's story is the story of the Murdaugh family dynasty.

So I'm, as I'm combing through the pages for, for moonshine stories and, and lynch mobs and the klan and things of that nature, civil rights, I'm finding the Murdaughs are key players.

If there's a bad guy in Hampton County in the past eight, nine decades, a Murdaugh was the prosecutor who put him away.

So these, these histories are, are the same.

And that's what I've been doing for the past 14 months, it's kind of... unearthing and preserving the history that, that my ancestors already knew, but the world is just dying to learn more about.

Holly> Tell me what it's been like.

I mean, you've had tour groups coming and that sort of thing.

There's a lot of fascination over this >> Hampton, Colleton County people are, they, they do a tour now at the Colleton County Courthouse where the double murder trial was held and people will get off the interstate and just, they wanna see the tour.

They wanna, they wanna see where Judge Newman sat.

They wanna sit in the chair where Alex Murdaugh's at.

They wanna go down in the dungeon is what they call it, the dungeon, where Alex was detained in during breaks of the trial.

And it's a true crime fascination.

True crime is one of the greatest, um, it's one of the most popular, you know, areas right now in literature, in podcasts and social media, so, a fascination.

>> You know, as the world, including myself, were watching that trial, I watched you a lot because I knew, I said, this is a journalist who has a different kind of connection.

He knows these people, he lives with these people.

How, I mean, you know, even those of us who were disconnected, we have, you become emotionally involved after spending so much time watching.

That had to be a struggle for you.

Maybe it wasn't; I'd love to know what you say about that, and just kind of separating those emotions and knowing you have a job to do to, and a deadline to meet at the end of the day.

Did you ever struggle with that as the days got long?

>> I struggled greatly.

You know, we, you, you just touched on a lot of different things there.

I was, I had emotions when I first saw Alex Murdaugh in a, in a detention center jumpsuit, which was in Hampton County.

The, I think he was actually, you know, booked elsewhere was his first arrest.

But when he first came to Hampton and the first time I, and many locals saw him in a, in a Hampton County detention center, jumpsuit, wearing shackles and handcuffs.

It was shocking.

I remember writing and, in one of my stories and telling people, there were reporters from New York, you know, all over in this little tiny courtroom before this story really exploded.

<Mm-hmm> Reporters are all over in this little tiny courtroom in Hampton County.

And I told one of 'em, I said, "You don't really understand the significance of this, do you?"

This is a Murdaugh wearing handcuffs.

This is a Murdaugh on the other side of the courtroom for the first time in eight decades.

It's just kind of weird and chilling for me.

And then to go into this murder trial, and obviously a lot of things have taken place between Alex Murdaugh's first arrest and his murder conviction.

So you, there's lots of stuff to process.

You know, the morning I woke up and heard that they had been murdered, the Saturday on Labor Day weekend when we heard that Alex Murdaugh had been shot beside the road.

Just so many emotions between then and there.

But during the trial, you know, keep in mind I've had to make a transition from a small town newspaper editor to basically a national reporter because of this story.

<Mm-hmm> I could not have done it without the support of my company.

I've had editors in Greenville, Augusta.

That trial was brutal for me.

I drove every day from Hampton, which is 45 minutes or more from Hampton to Walterboro.

And I wrote two stories a day every day.

I missed three days outta that entire six weeks trial.

<Wow.> I wrote two stories a day.

I would sit in court all day, then go to my truck and eat a sandwich and write a story.

And my editors in Greenville would clean it up and add photos and video and publish it for me.

And then at five o'clock, I'd come out the courtroom brain just fried and exhausted from absorbing so much information.

And I'd write another story before I made the long drive home.

But on top of all that, we go back to the emotions.

I'm sitting in the courtroom and the last time I covered a murder trial from start to finish, Alex Murdaugh's father was the prosecutor.

And now here I am and I'm looking at Alex Murdaugh.

He speaks to me several times during the trial.

"Hey Michael, how you doing?"

You know, his brother John Marvin speaks to me.

It's like we were sitting in church instead of attending your murder trial.

<Wow.> And the judge put the local reporters front and center.

And this was kind of funny, if you're a small town newspaper guy.

He made sure the Hampton and Walterboro newspapers had a front row seat and the "New York Times" was way back there.

And I just thought that was funny.

<Yeah.> But I'm sitting here and the entire Murdaugh family is to my right and I know 'em all.

And in the first part of the trial we actually interacted and, and talked a little bit.

And then as things became more emotional, the evidence was, was revealed, they kind of pulled back and there wasn't as much of this, "Hey, how you doing?"

kind of stuff.

They were basically within their own selves, in their own emotions when I think it became apparent all the evidence that he was guilty.

But for anyone from Hampton County, this was a very emotional, very emotional six, mammoth six week trial.

Holly> So you said that Alex would talk to you.

Was it anything passed "Hey, how you doing?"

Was there anything else that you remember he said?

Michael> Well, in, I attended the arraignment in Beaufort County when his son Paul Murdaugh was arraigned for felony boating under influence in the death of Mallory Beach.

I sat one row behind Alex and, and Maggie and there was more interaction there.

"Hey Michael, how you doing?"

You know, and, but it wasn't a long conversation.

In the trial in Walterboro, there was pretty much security on both sides of him.

So it was a short greeting, you know, but still with a smile.

And there wasn't, there wasn't a handshake or anything like that, you know?

So, but still that was part of the Murdaugh charisma.

<Right.> As politicians, as lawyers, they, they knew your name and they just had a, a personality that kind of endeared them to juries, endeared them to voters, endeared them to everyday citizens.

And that kind of helped make who they were.

>> You talked about your shift as a writer or, or as a reporter, really from, you know, kind of being a little bit slow to super fast in terms of how many you're having to put, put out.

<Right.> Two stories a day in that six weeks, weeks period.

Tell me about your change just as a journalist.

I mean, do you, do you value the profession more?

Is it more of that, because I know how this is, it's kind of a love hate, you love it and hate it all at the same time.

Has that part grown?

How would you say you feel about just journalism in general based off this experience?

Michael> That's a very good question.

I was going through a crisis of faith before all this happened.

I was, the "Hampton County Guardian" had been through a lot of changes.

We were, we've been bought out by several different companies.

In my 20 years, I've had four different owners and just seemed like for a while, each one was a little bit, I'm not gonna say worse.

Each one was a little different from the last, there were layoffs, budget cutbacks.

One by one, my staff was whittled down.

I am now the only, only employee of the "Hampton County Guardian."

I'm the editor, I'm the reporter.

The, you're looking at a one man newspaper.

And in today's world, if something ever happens to me, if, if I ever retire, you know, there may not be a "Hampton County Guardian."

It all depends on what corporate decisions are made at a national level about small weekly papers.

I think this story, this national story has kept me going as a, as a reporter, has kept the Guardian open.

I think as long as Alex Murdaugh is a, is a news headline, there, there will be a "Hampton County Guardian" and we'll be writing for a national audience.

So all these changes, I was going through a crisis of faith.

I was thinking about leaving the profession.

I was very tempted to go into PR, just something where I, you know, just a very, very tough time.

And then this story happened.

I don't, how can I say this?

I chose to rise to the challenge.

I came to a, to a crossroads where I could say, you know, I can walk away right now and or I can change who I am.

Well, I'm 50 years old, it's kind of hard to change and start over when you've been doing something for 20 years.

And I thought, if I'm not a writer, what am I gonna do?

What am I gonna be?

And I chose to change and evolve because I am a writer.

I will write until my fingers fail me or there's nobody listening.

And, and so I learned to put the small town slow southern ways behind me and go from writing six stories a week to writing two a day or whatever is needed.

I've learned, you know, digital technology, I do more with computers.

And when I first started at The Guardian 19 years ago, I knew how to type a little, 'cause I took typing in college, but I'd never sent an email.

Never sent an email in my entire life.

Okay?

I wrote my stories.

I was doing a little part-time writing.

So I wrote my stories before then on legal pad, and my wife would type 'em up for me.

So I was raw and green as they, as they come.

And in 20 years, I've had to learn everything from page design to, you know, digital technology.

I'm, I've become, I've been forced to become a high tech redneck, if you will.

Holly> (laughs) I like that.

Yeah.

I've enjoyed some of your tweets, by the way.

Michael> I'm kind of new to Twitter.

Holly> And, and just so you know, as it's been said many times on this set, Pat Conroy wrote all his books on a legal pad.

So, you know, some of the best stuff can come like that.

>> Well, and when I'm, when I'm kind of fleshing things out, I like to do, I like to do it on, on, on paper and pen.

I've hired a lot of young reporters over the years and we'll be talking and they'll be sitting there doing things on their phone.

I'm like, I'm talking to you.

Are you not listening?

Oh, I'm taking notes.

Oh, I didn't know you could take notes on your phone.

Gimme a piece of paper.

That's how I do it.

Holly> Right, right, right.

All right.

Unfortunately, we're kind of running out of time.

I hate to say it.

Michael> I'm a talker, so.

Holly> But, well, me too.

Michael> Cut what you don't need.

Holly> And this is a good story.

I'm sure everybody watching is hanging on to it, but I do wanna say, so this is Wicked Hampton County.

<Right> Following that is which book?

Which has...?

>> This book is followed by "Fall of the House of Murdaugh."

<Okay.> And the difference between the two, this is a history of Hampton County that goes back from the Native Americans to, to modern times well, civil rights.

And the Murdaugh dynasty is a large part of this book.

The second book, "Follow the House of Murdaugh," it focuses entirely on the Murdaugh political and legal dynasty from the last days of the Confederacy to the murder trial, and then the aftermath of the trial.

Holly> Okay, and, I'm just curious, have you written Alex Murdaugh a letter in prison yet?

Michael> I was encouraged to.

My, my wife and people that, that I know said, "You ought to write Alex a letter.

"If he, if anybody, if he'll let anybody write his, "his biography or his memoirs, it'll be you, 'cause he knows you."

And then I saw that some of the tabloid media are kind of putting everybody on blast.

They're publishing, they publish Netflix's - >> Oh, they published the emails and letters going out?

They published emails and letters going to Alex.

And I said, "Well, you know, "I don't really want the whole world to know "I'm trying to woo Alex Murdaugh into writing a book for him."

So I have not.

<Okay.> And, and I think I'd rather let these books stand on their own.

You know, if I'm gonna write a book about a person, I'd like to write a victim story.

>> Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

>> I'm not a true crime writer.

You know, I'm publishing a history book and a true crime book, but I'm not a true crime writer by nature.

And so if I am gonna write, I'd rather tell a victim story and how they overcome the villains.

<mm-hmm> Holly> Well, one thing that I like, even though it kind of just happened, is that you, you went into this new territory.

So 20 years into your career, you started exploring new ways of writing.

So, I think that's neat, and, uh, Michael> And, uh... Holly> You learn a lot about yourself during stuff like that, don't you?

Michael> And we're doing, and I'm totally new to this, but this week we're launching a podcast, the Wicked South Podcast.

>> Oh?

Look at you.

All this technology, >> New, new forms of storytelling.

And I just kind of told myself, you know, I can be a dinosaur and, and, and, and go away.

Or I can evolve and find new ways to, to, to tell old stories.

And, you know, video, audio, multimedia: that's the future.

I won't, I will always write books as long as I can.

I hope people always read them.

I love a magazine.

I'll, I'll, I'll take a magazine to the beach or the river with me every time I go.

But I'm not ignoring the fact that people rely on social media.

They rely on video and audio.

And I'm a storyteller, not just a writer.

So I've, I've chosen to evolve and, you know, it, it, I'm too old to do anything else I want.

I wanna finish my life as a writer, so.

>> I like it.

Michael, thank you so much for joining us.

It's really been a pleasure.

I've learned a lot and I appreciate all the work that you've done on this story and just, you know, letting people know what Hampton County's all about.

So.

>> Well, I appreciate the time to be here.

>> Absolutely.

And thank you all for joining us here on "By the River."

It's always a pleasure having you tune in with us.

We look forward to seeing you next time.

Right here by the river.

Narrator> Major funding for "By the River" is provided by the ETV Endowment of South Carolina.

For more than 40 years, the ETV Endowment of South Carolina has been a partner of South Carolina ETV, and South Carolina Public Radio.