Amanpour and Company

>>> NOW WE RETURN TO THE U.S. LAST MONTH SONYA MASSEY CALLED RAIN IN 11 FOR HELP WITH A SUSPECTED PROWLER, ONLY TO BE SHOT AND KILLED BY A SHERIFF'S DEPUTY INSIDE HER OWN HOME.

IN CONVERSATION, CO-FOUNDER AND PRESIDENT OF THE CENTER FOR POLICING EQUITY, DR. TRACIE KEESEE DISCUSSES WHAT WENT WRONG AND WHAT LOCAL LAW ENFORCEMENT CAN DO TO BETTER PROTECT THE COMMUNITIES THEY SERVE.

>> THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

A FEW DAYS AGO, THE NATION, I THINK, WAS RIGHTFULLY SHOCKED AND THE BODY CAMERA FOOTAGE THAT SHOWED THE LAST MOMENTS OF SOENL YA MASSEY'S RIFE.

SHE WAS A WOMAN WHO HAD CALLED POLICE FOR HELP AND SHE ENDED UP GETTING SHOT BY ONE OF THE VERY OFFICERS WHO WAS THERE TO HELP HER.

THE OFFICER HAS SINCE PLEADED NOT GUILTY.

HE'S BEEN FIRED AND HE'S BEEN CHARGED WITH ONE COUNT OF AGGRAVATED BATTERY WITH A FIREARM, OFFICIAL MISCONDUCT AND THREE COUNTS OF FIRST-DEGREE MURDER.

A GRAND JURY FELT THERE WAS ENOUGH EVIDENCE TO BRING THESE CHARGES.

NOW HIS SIDE HAS NOT SAID ANYTHING ABOUT THIS.

YOU HAVE SEEN THAT FOOTAGE.

WHAT DID YOU THINK WHEN YOU SAW AND IT WHAT WENT WRONG?

>> FIRST OF ALL, THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME, AND I WOULD TELL YOU, JUST IN OUR LITTLE BIT OF CONVERSATION BEFORE GETTING STARTED, THE TRAUMA OF HAVING TO WATCH THESE VIDEOS, AS YOU MENTIONED, NEVER GOES AWAY.

I THINK WHAT IS VERY STRIKING ABOUT IT, HERE YOU HAVE A WOMAN.

LET'S BE CLEAR, A BLACK WOMAN.

SHE CALLED 911 ASKING FOR HELP.

HEARING THINGS OUTSIDE OF THE HOME WHERE YOU HAVE DEPUTIES WHO ARE ON THE SCENE AND HAVE SEARCHED AROUND THE HOME AND ARE REALLY TALKING TO HER, THEY DIDN'T ASK IF SHE WAS OKAY.

DID SHE NEED ANYTHING ELSE.

SHE SAID NO.

THEN YOU HAVE THE DEPUTY IN QUESTION.

DEPUTY GRAYSON I BELIEVE IT IS WHO COMES IN AND ASKS AGAIN.

WHAT ELSE IS HAPPENING?

ASKS FOR HER I.D.

HER I.D.

IS INSIDE THE HOUSE, IN HER PURSE.

>> WHAT IS YOUR LAST NAME?

WHAT IS YOUR LAST NAME?

YOU'RE NOT IN TROUBLE.

>> MASSEY.

>> DO YOU HAVE AN I.D.?

THAT WOULD MAKE THINGS.

SO EASIER.

>> IN DOING SO, EVERYONE ELSE IS PRETTY MUCH LOOKING AROUND.

AND YOU CAN TELL THAT THERE ARE QUESTIONS HAPPENING.

BUT FOR MOST OF ALL THAT, THE INTERACTION IS GOING WELL.

THE DEPUTIES ARE ABOUT TO WRAP IT UP.

THEY'RE SAYING THERE'S NOTHING ELSE WE CAN DO.

WE HAVEN'T FOUND ANYONE.

SO ASKING FOR THE I.D.

THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH MAKING SURE THIS IS THE PERSON YOU'RE TALKING TO.

BUT WHAT GO HORRIBLY WRONG IS, OF COURSE WE HAVE A POT OF BOILING WATER ON THE STOVE.

NO ONE ELSE SEEMS TO BE CONCERNED ABOUT IT.

SHE IS TURNING IT OFF.

AND THEN SHE BEGIN TO UTTER STATEMENTS AND STATEMENTS THAT AREN'T CONGRUENT WITH SOMEONE, WE KNOW SHE HAS MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES BECAUSE SHE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT'S SHE TOOK EVERYTHING.

AND THEN BEGINS NOT TO TRACK.

AND THEN WHAT YOU SEE HAPPEN VERY QUICKLY IS THE ESCALATION.

>> WHERE ARE YOU GOING?

>> -- WATER.

>> AND THEN IMMEDIATELY YOU HEAR GUNFIRE.

AND YOU SEE IF YOU WATCHED THE VIDEO, YOU SEE MISMASSEY FALL TO THE GROUND.

SHE IS ALREADY ON HER WAY DOWN.

YOU WATCH ONE DEPUTY BEGIN TO RENDER AID IMMEDIATELY.

THE SHERIFF HAD A ACTUALLY SAW HER DOES NOTHING.

YOU HEAR THE COMMENTS ON THE VIDEO.

THEY BASICALLY STATE THAT SHE'S NOT WORTH SAVING.

THAT SHE CAN'T BE SAVED.

>> I'M GOING TO GO GET MY KIT.

SO YOU WATCH THIS INTERACTION AND YOU WATCH AS AN OFFICER AND YOU THINK ABOUT, ONE OF THE THINGS YOU SHOULD BE DOING THERE, ONE, YOU DON'T ESCALATE A SITUATION.

WE ALL KNOW THAT.

THIS IS 2024.

VERY RARELY DO YOU FIND LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES, SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENTS, WHO HAVE NOT GONE THROUGH SOME LEVEL OF ESCALATION TRAINING.

AND IN ADDITION, VERY RARELY, I WON'T SAY EVERY AGENCY HAS DONE THIS, BUT YOU WILL FIND MENTAL HEALTH TRAINING HAS ALSO HAPPENED.

YOU RECOGNIZE WHEN THINGS ARE HAPPENING, YOU WILL DO SOMETHING A LITTLE DIFFERENT WHEN YOU ARE WITH SOMEONE WHO MAY BE IN CRISIS OR WHO MAY NOT BE TRACKING.

YOU DIDN'T SEE ANY OF THAT.

YOU DIDN'T SEE THIS PARTICULAR PERSON BACKING UP TO GET DISTANCE BETWEEN THEM.

SO THIS IS WHAT IS SO SHOCKING AND HEARTBREAKING.

BUT THIS IS NOT NEW.

THIS IS WHAT THE BLACK COMMUNITY HAS CONSISTENTLY SINCE GEORGE FLOYD, BEFORE THAT, HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT.

AND THE DANGERS OF CALLING 911.

WE TALK ABOUT WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO BE SAFE IN YOUR HOME OR HOW DO YOU GET SAFETY, THESE ARE THE QUESTIONS CONTINUALLY AT THE TOP.

CONVERSATIONS, AND TOP OF THE POLICY DISCUSSIONS THAT CONTINUE TO HAPPEN.

>> WHEN YOU DISCUSS THE DISTRUST THAT EXISTS WITHIN MEMBERS OF THE BLACK COMMUNITY IN REACHING OUT TO THE POLICE FOR HELP.

SONYA MASSEY'S FATHER TOLD CBS NEWS AFTER THAT THEY FELT MISLED BY THE POLICE DEPARTMENT BEFORE THE BODY CAMERA FOOTAGE WAS RELEASED.

BECAUSE THERE WAS A NARRATIVE THAT SHE EITHER DIED BY AN INTRUDER OR A SELF-INFLICTED WOUND.

I MAY NOT, WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THAT FAMILY'S STATEMENT THERE?

>> IT'S A POWERFUL STATEMENT, RIGHT?

IT NOT ONLY UNDERGIRDS THE LONG-STANDING ISSUES ABOUT LAW ENFORCEMENT.

IT'S ABOUT THE TECHNOLOGY.

WE TALK GOING BODY-WORN CAMERAS, RIGHT?

WE HAVE TO TALK ABOUT THE INTRODUCTION OF BODY-WORN CAMERAS.

WHEN I CAME IN IN 1989, THERE WAS NOTHING ABOUT A BODY-WORN CAMERA.

I MENTIONED TO YOU, THE FIRST ITERATION FOR ME WOULD HAVE BEEN RODFULLY KING.

THAT WAS CAUGHT ON A VIDEO CRAM.

NOW A VERY OUTDATED VIDEO CAMERA.

IT WAS VERY GRAINY BUT YOU WOULD SEE IT.

YOU WOULD HAVE THE WORD OF THE OFFICERS AND NOTHING ELSE.

THE PERSON DIED OR WAS NOT ABLE TO SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES.

THAT'S WHAT YOU WOULD WITH HAVE.

WHAT HER FATHER IS TALKING GOING IS BEING ABLE TO COME FORWARD IN AN HONEST WAY.

WITHOUT THE BODY-WORN FOOTAGE, WE MAY HAVE NEVER KNOWN.

NOW WE KNOW THE NARRATIVE DOESN'T HOLD UP.

WITH THAT, WE THEN NOW NEED TO HAVE AND UNDERSTAND WHY THINGS UNFOLDED THE WAY THAT THEY DID.

AND THIS IS WHAT WE CALL A PORTION OF THIS, ACCOUNT AFBLT WITHOUT THAT, YOU DON'T BEGIN TO HAVE IT.

IN SOME CASES, YOU DON'T BEGIN TO HAVE WHAT PEOPLE WOULD CALL JUSTICE.

IT WAS ALSO INTERESTING, IF YOU THINK ABOUT THIS AND WE TALK GOING WHEN DO WE REALLY GET INTO CONVERSATIONS.

IN MY CAREER IT'S BEEN GOING ON FOR DECADES.

WHEN WE TALK ABOUT REFORMS, ONE OF THE THING THAT CAME UP WAS BODY-WORN CAMERA.

AND THE CONVERSATION WAS ABOUT THIS IS THE THING THAT WILL MAKE IT.

THIS PARTICULAR PIECE OF TECHNOLOGY WILL BE ABLE TO BUILD TRUST WITHIN THE COMMUNITY.

WE KNOW THERE ARE A LOT OF THING THAT HAPPENED WHEN WE TALK GOING BEING ABLE TO RELEASE THE FOOTAGE.

THE POLICIES AROUND IT.

IF I REMEMBER, I DON'T BELIEVE SHERIFF GRAYSON TURNED HIS CAMERA ON.

IF IT WEREN'T FOR ANOTHER SHERIFF AT THE SCENE, WE WOULDN'T HAVE THAT FOOTAGE.

>> GIVEN YOUR EXPERTISE, WHAT KINDS OF TRAINING ARE OFFICERS NOW GETTING IN DEPARTMENTS THAT CHOOSE TO INVEST THE TIME IN THIS?

>> WELL, IT VARIES.

IT WILL DEPEND ON WHERE YOU ARE.

HOW LARGE THE AGENCY IS, BELONG YOU'RE A SHERIFF'S AGENCY AND WHETHER OR NOT YOU HAVE THE BUDGET.

I THINK COMMUNITIES WOULD BE VERY SURPRISED ABOUT THE LACK OF A TRAINING BUDGET THAT MOST LAW ENFORCEMENT HAVE.

IN SOME CASES, IT'S NOT EVEN A LINE ITEM.

SO A LOT OF WHAT YOU WILL SEE IS THERE ARE CRITICAL INCIDENT TRAINING.

YOU WILL HEAR IT NAMED C.I.T.

MENTAL HEALTH FIRST-AID.

THAT'S A BASIC UNDERSTANDING OF HOW PEOPLE WHO ARE IN CRISIS SHOW UP.

WHAT DOES IT LOOK LIKE.

AND A LOT OF TIME YOU CAN LOOK AT YOUR OWN FAMILY MEMBERS AND FRIENDS AND SEE SOME OF THE SAME THINGS THAT HAPPENED WITH THEM.

SOME OF IT IS AT A VERY BASIC LEVEL.

THAT'S A LOT OF TIME WHAT YOU NEED.

THE ACADEMY CURRICULUMS HAVE BEEN CHANGED TO INCORPORATE THOSE THINGS INCLUDING THE SCENARIO TRAINING THAT YOU HAVE.

IT WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN UNCOMMON TO HAVE A SCENARIO-BASED TRAINING WITH AN EVENT LIKE MISS MASSEY AND IF YOU DO HAVE THE RESOURCES, THE ABILITY TO CALL SOMEONE ELSE IN TO HELP WITH HER TO SEE IF THERE IS ANYTHING ELSE YOU CAN DO.

AT THAT TIME, LAW ENFORCEMENT WOULD BACK OUT.

BUT THERE ARE PLENTY OF TRAININGS NOW.

AND IT IS REALLY INTERESTING THAT IN THIS DAY AND AGE, IT WOULD BE VERY UNCOMMON TO NOT HAVE SOME BASIC LEVEL OF MENTAL HEALTH TRAINING.

I WOULD BE SURPRISED IF A LOT OF AGENCIES DID NOT HAVE IT.

AND THEN I WOULD ADD TO THAT, BEFORE WE EVEN GET TO CALLING 911, DOES A PERSON HAVE EVERYTHING THAT THEY NEEDED BEFORE YOU BEGIN TO CALL LAW ENFORCEMENT?

AND THIS IS THE THING COMMUNITY -- EVEN LAW ENFORCEMENT IS TALKING ABOUT.

OFTENTIMES, THOSE CALLS WILL COME IN.

WE KNOW 4% OF 911 CALLS ARE, THE REST ARE SOCIAL NEEDS.

WHY WOULD YOU HAVE LAW ENFORCEMENT SHOWING UP FOR SOMEONE WHO HAS SOCIAL NEEDS?

THAT HAS BEEN AN ONGOING CONVERSATION.

EVEN WHEN I WAS IN LAW ENFORCEMENT, DO YOU HAVE THE RIGHT PEOPLE SHOWING UP FOR THE RIGHT THING?

>> IS THERE A DIFFERENCE IN EITHER THE TRAINING OR THE OUTCOMES OF HOW POLICE APPROACH WOMEN?

>> THERE IS.

WHAT IS INTERESTING IS, ONE OF THE THING WE HAVE TO UNDERSTAND IS WE STILL HAVE A LOT OF GENDER DYNAMICS WHEN IT COME TO HOW MEN BELIEVE WOMEN WILL RESPOND OR SHOW UP.

A LOT OF THOSE THINGS HAVE CHANGED IN THE TRAINING.

WHEN WE TALK ABOUT DANGER, WHAT IS INTERESTING, WHEN WE HAVE THESE CONVERSATIONS AROUND THE SCIENCES, ESPECIALLY BLACK WOMEN AND BLACK MEN WHO ARE IN DANGER, WE TALK ABOUT HOW QUICKLY FOLKS RESPOND.

WHEN YOU ASSOCIATE BLACKNESS WITH CRIMINALITY, IT CHANGES THE WAY YOU RESPOND.

SO THE TIMES OF TRAINING WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IN THE ACADEMY IS JUST THAT.

YOU WILL HEAR CONVERSATIONS AROUND NOT JUST IMPLICIT BIAS TRAINING BUT UNDERSTANDING CULTURALLY HOW POLICING HAS BEEN INTRODUCED INTO DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOODS.

FORM YOU TO HAVE A SELF-AWARENESS ABOUT HOW YOU MAY SHOW UP.

IN ORDER TO DO THAT, YOU HAVE TO SLOW YOURSELF DOWN.

YOU HAVE TO MAKE SURE YOU HAVE ALL THE INFORMATION THAT YOU NEED IN ORDER TO GO INTO THAT SPACE AND YOU ALSO NEED TO MAKE SURE YOU HAVE ALL THE RESOURCES THAT YOU NEED.

I THINK ALSO MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU ALSO WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU HAVE IN YOUR RECRUITING, THE RIGHT PEOPLE TO BE IN THE PROFESSION.

ONE OF THE THING WE ALWAYS TALK ABOUT, WHO IS ENTRUSTED TO THE JOB?

>> IN THE CASE OF SEAN GRAYSON, ACCORDING TO CNN, HE HAD TWO PREVIOUS DUIs.

HE WORK AT SIX AGENCIES IN FOUR YEARS.

HE WAS TOLD HE NEEDED A HIGH-STRESS DECISION CLASS.

HE WAS DISCHARGED FROM THE ARMY FOR A SERIOUS OFFENSE.

THE COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE SAID THEY DID KNOW ABOUT HIS TWO DUI ARRESTS BUT HE WAS STILL CERTAIN FADE FOR HIRE BY THE ILLINOIS LAW ENFORCEMENT TRAINING AND STANDARDS BOARD.

HOW IS IT POSSIBLE THAT WE HAVE SO MANY CRACKS IN THE SYSTEM THAT WERE DESIGNED TO CATCH PEOPLE WHO SHOULDN'T BE GIVEN THIS POWER TO WIELD A WEAPON AND ULTIMATELY, TO BE ABLE TO TAKE A LIFE?

>> IT'S A GREAT QUESTION.

HOW MANY MORE FLAGS DID YOU NEED ON HIM?

YOU MENTIONED, RATE?

THERE'S PEACE OFFICER STANDARDS TRAINING.

A LOT OF STATES HAVE THEM AND SOME DON'T.

THAT'S TYPICALLY THE ARM OF THE STATE, THE LOCALITY THAT GIVES YOU YOUR CERTIFICATION AS A POLICE OFFICER.

ONE OF THE CONTINUES THAT HAS NOT REALLY BEEN DONE IS A REAL GOOD EXAMINATION OF THOSE POST WARDS, IS WHAT WE CALL THEM.

OFTEN THE PEACE OFFICERS TRAINING BOARDS ARE COMPRISED OF RETIRED OFFICERS.

RARELY ARE THEY COMPRISED OF COMMUNITY MEMBERS.

AND LOOKING AT THOSE POLICY THAT'S TRIGGER WHEN OFFICERS CANNOT BE HAIRED OR TRANSFERRED, AS WE TALK ABOUT, THE GEORGE FLOYD ACT, HAVING A DID IT A BASE THAT FLAGS FOR YOU OFFICERS WHO MAY HAVE BEEN HIRED MULTIPLE TIMES AND HAVE THESE FLAGS.

WOMAN THE SHERIFF HAVE BEEN CAUGHT IN THAT PARTICULAR DATABASE?

WE DON'T KNOW.

THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

TO YOUR POINT, THE QUESTION NOW GOES, WE NEED TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT WHAT HAPPENED?

WHY WAS THERE PERSONNEL ELIGIBLE TO BE HIRED?

YOU CAN'T GO BACK NOW AND SAY, WE SHOULD HAVE KNOWN.

BUT SOME OF THIS SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN A BACKGROUND INVESTIGATION.

YOU ALSO HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE SURE THAT SOMEONE LIKE THIS IS NOT IN A PROFESSION THAT IS HIGH RISK.

AND WILL IN A PROFESSION WHERE THEY SHOULD NOT BE.

>> THE POLICE UNION JUST RELEASED A STATEMENT SAYING THAT THEY ARE NOT GOING TO FIGHT THE FIRING OF THE SHERIFF'S DEPUTY WHO FATALLY SHOT SONYA MASSEY.

HOW IMPORTANT IS THAT?

>> IT IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE A FEW DAYS AGO, THEY ARE DEMANDING THAT THE PERSON BE REINSTATED.

THEY WERE SAYING HIS DUE PROCESS RIGHTS WERE NOT FOLLOWED AND THEY WERE DEMANDING HIS HE FULL REINSTATEMENT WITH BACK PAY.

BUT IT IS IMPORTANT FOR UNIONS TO DO WHAT THEY'VE DONE.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT CREATED THE TURN OF THAT, BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE BODY-WORN CAMERA AND YOU SEE WHAT HAS HAPPENED, YOU UNDERSTAND WHY THIS PERSON SHOULD NO LONGER BE IN LAW ENFORCEMENT.

AND IT IS IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND THAT THE BLACK COMMUNITY SEES THIS.

WHEN YOU SEE UNIONS, AND BELIEVE ME, A LOT OF FOLKS BELONG TO UNIONS.

WHEN YOU SEE A UNION TRY TO PROTECT SOMETHING LIKE THIS, YOU THEN, IF YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY THE BLACK COMMUNITY HAS A LACK OF TRUST, THEN I HAVE TO SAY THERE'S A REAL DISCONNECT BETWEEN THE UNION AND WHAT THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE DOING ON BEHALF OF OFFICERS.

I BELONGED TO UNIONS MY ENTIRE CAREER.

THE ONE THING I WOULD ALWAYS WANT IS TO HAVE MY RIGHTS PROTECTED.

I ALSO KNOW THAT WHEN I VIOLATED SOMEONE'S RIGHTS, OR WHEN I WAS WRONG, THAT THERE WAS GOING TO BE A LEVEL OF ACCOUNTABILITY THERE.

AND THIS WAS BEFORE BODY-WORN CAMERAS.

NOW WHEN YOU HAVE BODY-WORN CAMERAS AND I'M AN AT-WILL EMPLOYEE, I UNDERSTAND THAT I MAY BE TERMINATED.

AND WHATEVER ABOUT-FACE THEY'VE TAKEN, IT IS GOOD TO SEE THAT.

BUT THAT ORIGINAL STATEMENT IS THE REASON WHY THE ONGOING ISSUES IN THE COMMUNITY CONTINUE AND IT GETS EXACERBATED.

>> HOW DO YOU MAKE SURE THAT THE POLICE FORCE REFLECTS THE COMMUNITY THAT THEY SERVE?

I'M NOT JUST SAYING BY RACE.

I'M TALKING BY GENDER, BY CLASS, BY A CONNECTION SO THAT THEY'RE ABLE TO HAVE A LIFE EXPERIENCE WHEN THEY WALK INTO UNKNOWN SITUATIONS THAT THE WHOLE SITUATION MIGHT BENEFIT FROM.

>> IF YOU WANT THE ORGANIZATION TO REFLECT THE COMMUNITY IT SERVES, FIRST, THE ORGANIZATION ITSELF NEEDS TO BE HEALTHY.

THAT MEANS THAT WHEN YOU ARE TRYING TO RECRUIT A DIVERSE ORGANIZATION TO YOUR POINT, IT IS NOT JUST ABOUT RACE.

IT IS ABOUT THOUGHT AND IT IS ABOUT EXPERIENCE.

THE OTHER PART OF THIS, TOO, IS UNDERSTANDING BROADER SOCIETY, HAD A DIFFERENT LIVED EXPERIENCE WHEN IT COMES TO ITS INTERACTION WITH POLICING.

THAT REQUIRES LAW ENFORCEMENT TO DECENTER ITSELF FROM WHAT IS HAPPENING IN THE LARGER COMMUNITY.

IN ORDER TO DO THAT, THAT MEANS YOU HAVE TO STEP OUTSIDE OF YOURSELF TO UNDERSTAND THAT ALTHOUGH YOU MAY BE TRYING TO DO A GOOD SERVICE, AND THOUGH YOU MAY BE TRYING NOT TO DO HARM, HARM HAS BEEN DONE.

IT MAY NOT HAVE BEEN DONE BY YOU.

YOU'LL HERE LAW ENFORCEMENT SAYING IT IS VERY DIFFICULT FOR THEM TO RECRUIT BECAUSE OF WHAT IS BEING SAID.

WHAT IS BEING SAID ABOUT LAW ENFORCEMENT IS NOT NEW.

WHAT IS NEW IS THAT YOU HAVE SOCIAL MEDIA.

YOU HAVE IT HAPPENING FASTER AND QUICKER.

SO THE ABILITY TO RECRUIT HAS BEEN HAPPENING FOR DECADES.

IT'S JUST BEEN EXACERBATED.

BUT UNTIL THOSE THINGS ARE TRULY ADDRESSED, INCLUDING THE ATTITUDES OF FOLKS INSIDE ORGANIZATIONS, AND IN THE COMMUNITIES.

I DON'T WANT YOU TO THINK THIS IS JUST ABOUT LAW ENFORCEMENT.

WHEN I MADE THE DECISION TO GO INTO LAW ENFORCEMENT, I STRUGGLED ABOUT THE DECISION ITSELF.

WHEN THOSE THINGS BEGIN TO ALIGN AND WE BEGIN TO ADDRESS THE CONVERSATION WE'VE HAD HERE.

THE LONGSTANDING ISSUES OF HOW SAFETY IS DELIVERED, THEN YOU WILL NOT SEE A LOT OF THOSE HURDLES.

>> TRACIE KEESEE, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH.

APPRECIATE IT.