Wisconsin Vietnam War Stories

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>> The Menominee people, going way back, served in the military. Per capita, Menominee is the highest in the nation as far as being in the service. It's the highest number in the nation of people serving per population. That has a lot to say about that was their life, way back as warriors. And so, that's something that's kind of hard to pull away from, is being a warrior. >>

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Across the ages, the Menominee people have evolved rituals to honor and care for their warriors. Today, they call them veterans. And their traditions are being overwhelmed by the devastation of modern warfare. It is the veterans themselves who are searching for a new way to cope with the scars of combat. Veterans of previous wars, reaching out to assist the warriors of today. >> Nobody can tell us how to deal with it. But we've got to try to take care of them, help them, talk to them about things, what PTSD is doing to them, what it could do to your marriage and your children, and all this, right now. Hopefully, they'll take it to heart and work with it. We've all went through it. >> He's been through a lot, and he's willing to open up his home and his heart, and be like, hey, I'm here for you guys. You know, I've been there, and I know what's going on. >> Wounded Warriors was funded in part by The Evjue Foundation, The National Endowment for the Humanities, and the Friends of Wisconsin Public Television. >> We grew up on the Menominee Reservation here. And the weekend we graduated from high school, we packed our suitcases and left for the big city. The two of us, we were going to go into the Marine Corps. Everybody's got a dad, granddad, or somebody, or uncle, that went in there, you know? I know that over the years, they got everybody somewhere along the line, the family, that's been through combat, you know? >> Well, I had three goals in my life, and one was to marry Warren Wilber. One was to make it to Hawaii some day. And the other was to see a Green Bay Packer game. I was engaged to Warren, and he tells me he signed up for the Marine Corps, for the adventure, for travel, education, and to go to Vietnam. In order to keep busy, I thought I would try to sign up also, so I went down to the Army recruiters and they let me in. >> Once a Marine, always a Marine. It's a lifelong bond, brotherhood, for everybody that joins. I'd made my decision when I was 16. I signed when I was 17. My parents had to sign for me to be in the program. I was 18 when I left. I had turned 18 two months before I left. I can still remember the feeling I got when I got on the plane, my mom crying. It was a sad day for me. I felt like a piece of me left me when I left home, you know? But you do what you've got to do, right? >> His grandpa was in the Marines. And he's got uncles that were in the Marines. I think that's kind of the way that it is here where we live. It's like tradition, you know. It's being a warrior that your father was, and your uncles were, and your brothers. He was already enlisted in the Marine Corps, so I enlisted. I was scared of the Marine Corps!

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My grandpa was in the Navy. Plus, my husband had a lot of family that was in the Navy. They told me that that was the route to go. >> I landed over there in October of '66. They brought out five green bags, laid them in front of us on the air strip. Dang, them guys are going home in a green bag, you know, and I just started. They shipped me up to the DMZ base camp. >> They got us ready to be deployed for Iraq. That was in 2004. They drove us through our FOB, it's called the Forward Operating Base. And we got there, and it was real small. It was smaller than a football field. It was probably maybe to the 50-yard line. That's how big the whole little base was. We were in Fallujah, the Sunni Triangle, which was a pretty hot spot when we were out there. >> One day we went out there to a rice paddy that was surrounded by the jungle. As soon as the last guy got in, then they closed the door, and the battle was on. They said you'll see things you've never witnessed before. But you don't give up, keep on fighting. You know, you go out, you take chances like everybody else. >> I was put on guard duty. They call it QRF, Quick Reaction Force. You'd stand in these towers on the corners of the FOB. During the night, the insurgents, they would drive in these little pickup trucks. They would fire mortars from the backs of the pickup trucks. Mortars and rockets, you know, RPGs. I can still remember them sounds of that rocket. I got hit, all kinds of rocks in the face. I was kind of blinded for a little bit, but I got up. There was shrapnel in the sand bag, so you know, it's pretty fortunate that you're only hit in the face with dirt and rocks, you know, instead of shrapnel. >> Corpsmen would bring some wounded guys back from the other end of the fire fight. I could see the bullets snapping around in the rice paddy and water. I run out and took that guy off the soldiers and brought him back in. You don't think about your own safety. You just go out there and get that guy, put him to safety. >> We pretty much got through to the middle of the city, and I don't know why, but they called off the operation, pulled us out of the city. We lost people. To do all that for nothing, you know, that's when you start questioning, well, why. >> I looked at the corpsman and he was running right back into the fire, going to get another guy and bring him back. Corpsmen, they were Navy personnel, but we protected them as Marines. Nobody messed with our corpsmen. >> I wanted to go for nursing, so I could get over to Vietnam. But I went into administration instead. White Sands Missile Range, New Mexico. I processed incoming personnel, retiring personnel, guys that came back from overseas. >> You're not supposed to be excited to go to war, but when you're living on an aircraft carrier for six months, and launching planes, it's exciting to me.

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I was a plane captain. What we did was prep the plane for the pilots, washed 'em, gassed 'em. The pilot jumped in, and start it up for 'em, make sure that all the wings work, and the wheels work, and send him off. >> There would be days when I would go without any mail from him. Then all of a sudden one day, there would be three or four letters. He wrote every day, but couldn't get them in the mail every day. >> We wrote each other all the time. When we got time to call each other, we'd call. Every time I hit a port, that was the first thing you'd do, is go stand in line with everybody else and make a phone call. >> He's in danger. You know, and "...it was a quiet night tonight." I knew it wasn't a quiet night. >> I think civilians, they don't understand exactly what you do while you're over there. And yeah, I may not have seen combat, but I think I know what my husband's been through. He did two tours of Iraq. It changed him a lot. He's seen some things he didn't want to see. He did some things he didn't want to do. I was a different person before I left. I think the military changes you, no matter if you tell yourself it doesn't. It does. If you try to be that same person you were, you're never going to be that person again. >> One of the things that we had to do, they call it personal effects. When someone died, everything that they had, everything that they wore, would get sent back to us. We would have to box it up. You know, nothing was ever clean. Everything was covered with blood. People that I knew that I worked with, that I knew when I was out in town on liberty, and stuff, you know, I'll never forget them guys, you know. I'll never forget their names. It's one of the things that bothers me today. I think about all the time, is when we used to have to do that. >> You couldn't think about the times that you were in those mortar and rocket attacks. There's other things that will flash you back, bring you back. But there are some things you can't get away from, either. It's there all the time. >> Being proud of yourself is very important, I think. So I just thought if I were to do this for myself and my country, then I would make my mother proud. So one day I walked in and talked to a recruiter, and before I knew it, I was on a jet. People could choose then their MOS and mine was Health, Fort Sam, Houston, Texas. I met a lot of people down there because that's where the guys were going to get their medical training that were going over then to Vietnam from there. I know a lot of them didn't come back. Then later on, I used my benefits to go to school. I took a class where I interviewed Vietnam veterans on their return home. I wanted to know how they felt when they came back, because there was so much turmoil. Here, veterans are revered and they were not treated badly when they came home here. But they still felt that there was things that went on over there that they didn't want to talk about. >> I was wounded twice over there, hit with shrapnel. The first time, I got what was referred to as just a Band-Aid wound, you know? The second one, it took two Band-Aids to get me. I spent seven or eight months in the hospital recuperating. >> They called me and said you have a phone call in the day room. So I went down there. It was my mom. She says Warren was missing in action, and they don't know where he's at, but he's probably wounded. But right now, MIA. And I don't really know what happened after that. I kind of remember dropping to the floor. Then the next thing I remember is I was in sick bay. >> Honestly, when I came back the first time, I never noticed any difference about anything, as far as it came to me or the people I was around. When it was building back up to go back to Iraq, they told me I wouldn't be going back, so I thought I was done with it, you know? But they came and brought me back. The craziest thing about it was that me and my wife were just ready to have our first baby. She was pregnant when I left. >> I think it's wrong. You know, my husband went over there the first time, he came back and he wasn't the same. Then to take him and say hey, you're going again, get ready, you're leaving in 24 hours, you know, it's bad. >> A couple days later, I got another phone call from my mother stating that he was not missing in action, but he was wounded. He was on a hospital ship. >> They flew me out to the hospital ship, USS Sanctuary, and there, I spent three or four weeks before I could walk again. You don't have to look too far to see there's a lot of guys that are a lot worse off than you. That kind of made you push harder to get back on your feet. >> I didn't know what to think or what was going on. If I could just hear his voice, maybe that would help. But that didn't happen for a long time. >> Got the word back that they were shipping me home. They put me on that chopper-- They put a body right in front of me. They laid a green bag down in front of me, and I thought, well, um, at least I'm going home alive. >> This time, we went to, it was called Al-Ramadi, which is part of the Sunni Triangle. The frequency of like, mortars and rockets, and all that stuff, was way worse, because the base was way bigger. When sirens would go off, you'd have to take cover. I remember praying, you know, I was praying to God. I was praying to the Great Spirit. I was praying to everybody you could think of. I'm not lying man, I was praying to everybody. >> I was pregnant with our first son. I was home. And let me tell you, that was an emotional roller coaster, especially when you knew where he was. That was the hot spot while he was over there. Every day on the news, you'd hear, two soldiers killed. It was hard, because while it was morning time here, it was nighttime there, so I was awake during the night and sleeping during the day, just to be able to communicate with him when I could. >> He never talked about it. I never knew how he was hit, what happened the day he got hit. I never knew that he had been in a hospital ship and paralyzed from the waist down. There was just so much I didn't know, because he didn't talk about it. I think it was like almost 17 years before I heard the word Vietnam come out of his mouth. >> A lot of things though, that still bother me, because I walk with pain every day from that, you know? You can't get rid of it. You wonder why the pain is there, and it takes you back to Vietnam, so it's a constant reminder. >> I went on a lot of convoys while I was there that second time. We got hit quite a few times, IEDs, other stuff. I've seen people get hurt pretty bad, losing body parts, stuff like that. >> My husband has a lot of problems. You know, he went through a lot. I think you're going to have a lot of that with the Desert Storm guys, and the guys that are over in Afghanistan, the guys that are in Iraq. I think they're going to be the same way, because of the emotional toll that they go through. >> You feel the percussion, the sound is something that, I remember once, I lost my hearing pretty bad, almost like I was disoriented. I was just one vehicle up, probably about 100 feet. We were pretty close. But that was one of the times where it was probably the craziest experiences I had right there, that I don't like talking about. >> It just amazes me that they put these people through a war then don't address that need that when they do come home. We know the numbers of people killed, but we don't have the numbers of the people that have been maimed, mentally. That number is tremendous. We still have them out there suffering, suicides all over. That's why we have a Veterans Task Force right now through the legislature, our Tribal Council, I'm the Chair, to address PTSD, working with people that come back from the war, trying to help what they're dealing with. You have a special feeling toward them, because they've gone through things that you can't imagine. You have to appreciate that. >> It wasn't the Warren that I knew before he went over, but a very good Warren. He became an electrician. We were able to raise five children. But there was a lot of hospitalization. >> I spent a lot of time in the hospital, away from my family, you know. The kids would come down. The wife would bring them down to see me in the hospital. Sometimes, I spent three months at a crack down there. That's a long time to be away from the wife and the kids. >> I would just hustle up the kids, get our little bags packed and say we're going down to see daddy. I had forgotten about this until my daughter reminded me. She says, I remember going up into the hospital, and you would say, now when we leave, you don't cry in front of daddy, because it'll make him feel bad. And I remember, mom, we would leave and wave bye-bye to him on the elevator. The doors would close and then we would all start crying. But we didn't do it in front of daddy. >> It was a sacrifice made by everybody, and family, you know, especially my wife and kids. I'm glad they stuck by me. >> Then he'd come home and everything would be fine for a while, but...

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I could see the troubles. He didn't realize there was anything such as PTSD. My kids would have to wake him up with a broomstick, because he would jump and holler, and be ready to swing whatever. So, that's how they always woke him up, with a broomstick. >> I was supposed to be back before my son was born. He was born July 4. I missed all that. It was pretty rough trying to adjust. For a long time, when I first got back, I'd have a dream and I'd wake up. Cold sweats. Not being able to go back to sleep. >> Yeah, the military is there and they're going to help you. But it's like, here, take these pills and everything will be fine. And talk about it. But it's not that easy to just be like, okay, I've killed kids, and men, and women, and I'm going to take these pills and it's all going to go away. That's not the way it is. >> My wife, she's the one that notices everything. She's the one that deals with everything. And uh, I don't even know where I'd be without her. You know, for someone to be able to understand me. >> The same thing that-- put my wife through, you know? But, I just think you adjust to it, you know, try to get by, if you can. >> When I first got back, I had some problems, and I got some help. I was good for about two years. I didn't need no medication, or noting, you know, I didn't go to no counseling. Wouldn't even talk to anybody, or tell anybody anything. Then just one day, it all just kind of hit me. >> It's something that we have to take care of. We can't just send these young guys into combat, and gals, and when their time is up, dump them on the street. >> I think it's really important that you don't just say, oh, we revere our veterans, and we think so much of them, and we're so proud of them. Take action. Put your money where your mouth is and do something about it. >> Warren is the one that really brought it to our attention that there was a need there. Because him and these other vets do 24/7 attention to these guys when they come home, and girls when they come home. So, I'm glad he called us in to help establish services for them. >> I think that's a very important part of the tradition, is to honor them, welcome them back home, and help take care of them. The suicide rate is high among Vietnam vets, Iraqi vets. It's something that's tough to deal with. You know, and it just... >> It was a long time before I talked to Warren. The only reason I talked to him was because someone told me I needed to. It was my wife. She knew that I needed someone to talk to. I've never talked to anybody about anything. I had a couple friends that came back. They never even talked about it, either, you know? There's days when I would feel like just crying. >> I call it when the sewer backs up, you know? Go over and see them just to talk for a bit. I don't feel comfortable talking about it yet either. They don't understand what PTSD is. But I know what they've been through. It don't go away. You know, it's, just learn to live with it, deal with it. >> I've had problems between me and my wife, you know? It's because of non-communication and not telling her what's going on. Days when I just wouldn't want to talk to anybody, and days where I would be mad at the world, and he related to things that were just like what I talked about. It made me kind of feel like I can get through this, and everything's going to be all right. He's always been there for me. And he knew what I was going through, every time. I owe a lot to him, definitely. >> Warren Wilber, if it wasn't for him, me and my husband probably wouldn't be together. You know, that's how hard it got, but Warren was the one to stick his hand out and say, "I'm going to help you." He was in Vietnam, you know, I'm going to help your family. I know what you're going through. And I know what your husband's going through. We're going to be there and we're going to make this work. >> I'm proud of our young men and women serving today. I don't care where they come from. It's great that we have that kind of people out there that's not afraid to step forward. But now I've got to make sure that they can cope with their experiences now. And that's tough. That's tough. >> They have services on the first day of school, at the high school. They go in and have the drumming ceremony, a blessing ceremony, presentations to make sure that the kids know that the veterans are always there for them if they ever need anything, funerals, Pow Wows. When we have our General Council meetings, they come in with the drum, because they are the veterans, they protected us. So, events like that, they're always brought in. Always. >> Wounded Warriors was funded in part by The Evjue Foundation, The National Endowment for the Humanities, and the Friends of Wisconsin Public Television.