This Old House

Kevin

Today on the "This Old House"...

Richard

This is the Breakers. They use this place for six weeks a year as a summer cottage. It's Windows 101 for our apprentices. All right. Nice job.

Kevin

And we are insulating our roof from the outside in. What happened to all this plumbing here?

Richard

I've never seen anything like this before.

Roger

There's already rot going on in that trunk.

Kevin

So, what have you found up here?

Tom

Well, a bit of a surprise.

Richard

It's really the classic plumber's lament.

Kevin

Nice!

Don

See this main roof form? We're just gonna pull that forward so it's even where this existing deck is.

Kevin

Definitely says mid-century modern.

Tom

The money's in the detail.

Kevin

That is beautiful. Hi there. I'm Kevin O'Connor, and welcome back to "This Old House" here in Jamestown, Rhode Island, where we're working on our 1920s bungalow. Now, last time we were here, we started installing these insulated panels all the way on the outside of the house. So, that's two inches of rigid insulation, as well as an impregnated OSB, and that's gonna give us an R-12 on the entire exterior of this building -- old and new. Now, that's gonna go a long way to get us to net-zero. But to go all the way to net-zero, we have to start thinking about the insulation on the roof, as well. And that's what we are working on today. Hey, Jeff. How are you?

Jeff

Kevin, how are you?

Kevin

Doing all right.

You boys are busy. Jeff

Welcome.

Kevin

I see you got the ice and water shield

down on the roof. Jeff

Yep.

Kevin

And I guess in a normal build, at this stage, you'd be ready to go to shingling, right? But that's not what we're doing today.

Jeff

Correct. So, we're gonna add insulation to the exterior of this roof in addition to what we're adding underneath. So, we're gonna start with 5/8 sheathing. So, we've ripped this 2x6 down to an even 5 inches. So, this makes up the thickness of our insulation. And it's also gonna be a place to nail our trim to. All right, so, this is gonna get toe nailed in right to the edge of our plywood, right at the tongue. Come down just a little bit.

Kevin

Here comes the insulation.

Jeff

All right. So, we've got two inch of mineral wall here.

Kevin

Thank you, Mark.

Jeff

We're gonna lay it in. So, this stuff is water-repellant, but it's vapor-permeable.

Yeah. Jeff

It's also fire-resistant.

Kevin

And what are we getting on an "R" per inch, 'cause this is a two-inch layer right here?

Jeff

So, we're about R-4 per inch.

Kevin

So, on top of this two-inch layer, you got, what, another three inches?

Jeff

Another three inch. Thank you. All right, so, this one is gonna go in the opposite direction.

Kevin

I'll take another,

Mary. Jeff

Oh, that's nice.

Kevin

So, with this built up five full inches, an R-20.

Jeff

Yep.

Kevin

All right, another layer of 5/8 OSB.

Jeff

Yep. We'll line that up. All right, put a tack in there, Kevin.

Flush here. Jeff

Yep. So, we're gonna fasten this whole assembly down to the framing with eight-inch screws here.

Kevin

So, we've now connected this insulated roof

all the way to those rafters. Jeff

To the framing. All right, we need another sheet.

Richard

If you're a visitor to Newport, you'll make a pilgrimage to these grand mansions. This is the Breakers, built in the 19th century for the Vanderbilts. They use this place for six weeks a year as a summer cottage. Now, most people are blown away by the opulent rooms inside. What blows me away are the mechanical systems. They're state-of-the-art for 1895.

Christopher

Richard, hi. Nice to see you.

Richard

Nice to be here.

Christopher

Thanks so much for coming.

Quite a place. Christopher

Yeah, it really is. Let me tell you a little bit about it. As I think you know, a lot of these houses that were built by the very wealthy at the turn of the century were state-of-the-art showplaces for technology and innovation.

That's right. Christopher

At that time, a lot of people didn't even have indoor plumbing.

Richard

Sure.

Christopher

And this was one of the first. One of inventors of the siphon jet toilet came right from Newport here in town.

Richard

Well, we're glad he did, he invented it.

Christopher

Yeah. This -- This is a sitz bath.

Richard

You don't see this much anymore.

Christopher

No, no.

Richard

People used to sitz in them.

Christopher

Exactly, exactly. So, after a long day of riding a horse, they'd come back to the house and just relax and soothe your muscles a little bit.

Richard

Perfect. Look at this.

Christopher

You might notice the opulent marble. This is all Carrara marble from Italy. It was all imported and hand-carved, as was this.

Richard

This is all marble, too.

It is. Richard

Beautiful.

Christopher

It is. It's pretty spectacular.

Richard

So, what's up there?

Christopher

They had three different water systems in the house, which was pretty amazing. Most people didn't have one at the time. They had city water, which was just a recent advent. But they didn't trust it, it had too high an iron content.

Richard

Okay.

Christopher

So, they used the city water just for the toilet and just for wash. But they had freshwater, also, and they collected it

from cisterns in the roof. Richard

Wow.

Christopher

They had eight 9,000-gallon tanks

in the basement. Richard

Right.

Christopher

They pumped it back up, and it was gravity-fed back down. And that was for drinking and cooking. And then they had a third system -- salt water. They pumped salt water from the ocean all the way to their boiler room 400 feet away, and then back here. So, each one of these has both freshwater hot, freshwater cold, saltwater hot, saltwater cold. And all this is nickel plated to avoid corrosion.

Richard

Still looking good a hundred and something years later.

Christopher

Exactly. So, this was absolute cutting- edge technology at the time. Let me tell you a little bit more about it. I'll show you the boiler room.

Richard

Awesome. Look at this.

Christopher

Yeah, so, here we are in the boiler room, subterranean. And these are the two boilers that provided all the heat and hot water for the house. But what powered that was this coal over here -- 250 tons of it per year.

Richard

So, it would have come down this shaft here.

Christopher

Exactly.

Richard

How many rooms were there?

Christopher

Two of these rooms filled completely full. And it must have taken an army of guys to shovel it then over here to the boiler.

Richard

Someone had to take the shovel, come over here. The door would be open, and he'd shovel it in. It must have been 900 degrees down here.

Christopher

Exactly. It must have been a sweatshop.

Richard

All right, so, it kept the fire going all day long, every day. And then this is the heating boiler, so this was cast iron.

Water was inside here. Christopher

Exactly.

Richard

The coal would heat up the water, and then that water would go out here and go back 400 more feet back to the building.

Christopher

Exactly. And there, it ran into these horizontal radiators that were inside of these 70 vertical shafts inside of the house. And through a process of convection, they had these barn doors that allowed air in from the outside terrace, under a subfloor, up through the shaft. It was heated by the horizontal radiators and then dispersed through the house in the circular system, pulling more cold air behind it. And the plumbing wasn't the only innovative system here in the house in the 1890s. Electricity was also brand-new at the time.

Richard

Absolutely. Look at this. Is this the panel?

Christopher

It is.

Richard

With marble.

Christopher

Yep, that's Tennessee pink marble.

Richard

Look -- everything's labeled. So, this the billiard room and the den.

Christopher

Exactly.

Richard

Look at this, all the wires go all through ceramic channels here, knob and tube.

Christopher

Exactly, with the ceramic insulators. But there's another really great technology

I'd like to show you. Richard

All right, lead on.

Christopher

So, that was state-of-the-art 1895. What I'd like to show you now is start-of-the-art 2018.

Richard

Oh, what do you got?

Christopher

This is a geothermal system, where we take the heat from the Earth and convert it into heat in the winter, and then the reverse, use the Earth as a heat sink in the summer to disperse our heat.

Richard

All right, but this is what's down in the ground, copper?

Christopher

Exactly.

Richard

So, you're not using the PVC or the plastic pipe with the antifreeze in it, you're actually using copper.

Christopher

Exactly. This is a closed-loop system, so the coolant is pumped down here in liquid form and then comes back in gas form when it's in heating mode. We've got 75 wells that go 100 feet down into the Earth and circulate back to 15 of these units that are dispersed around the house.

Richard

So, here's the indoor heat pump unit, here's the lines, the refrigerant lines right here. You gather the heat from the Earth, you bring it in in the winter. Comes to this unit right here, right? There's a fan that blows across, heats up the air, and then it goes out here. So, what does it do, how does it get into the building here?

Christopher

Exactly. Well, we're reusing the existing planning that we had. It used to be open-air, and now it's ducted.

Richard

So, into those shafts, they go all through

the building. Christopher

Exactly. The 70 shafts, the same ones as the horizontal radiators that we spoke about before, and then dispersed into the appropriate rooms.

Richard

Well, this is pretty cool. Instead of using, what, 250 tons of coal a year, you're gonna actually get free heat out of the ground.

Exactly. Richard

That's pretty good. I'm gonna come back in the next hundred years

and see what else you're doing. Christopher

Absolutely.

Kevin

Our initiative to get young people to consider going into the building trade, what we call Generation NEXT, has gotten a lot of attention -- attention all the way to Washington, D.C., which explains our current special guest. Congressman Norcross. Hey, Ben,

good to see you. Ben

Hey, Kevin, how's it going?

Kevin

Congressman, nice to meet you.

Donald

Good to be here. Good to be back with the tools.

Kevin

I was expecting to see maybe a suit and the rep tie, but not for you today, eh?

Donald

This is how I feel most comfortable. When I'm in Washington, I can wear the suit. But it's good to be back home and doing jobs like this.

Kevin

So, tell me about that career. How long and what did you do as an electrician?

Donald

I was from the late '70s I started my apprenticeship, all the way through till 2013, when I put my hand on the bible and got sworn in.

I loved it. Kevin

Mm-hmm.

Donald

Working at the refineries, up on bridges, doing pole lines -- Yeah.

Kevin

So, you weren't so much in residential electrical work, you were in commercial, industrial?

Donald

Yeah, until my mother would call and say, "Hey, I need you to come over and put this new circuit in."

Kevin

So, how many other electricians are with you in Congress?

Donald

Zero, but there's 211 lawyers.

Kevin

A lot of them, huh?

Donald

A lot of lawyers. So, we have one ironworker and one carpenter out of 435.

Kevin

Boy, that actually says a lot, doesn't it? So, tell me -- Obviously, you're a supporter of Generation NEXT.

You're here with us today. Donald

Absolutely.

Kevin

Why is it so important for these kids to know that this is an opportunity for them?

Donald

Yeah, we want to make sure that next generation has an opportunity to look out there and say, "What's best for me?" Not just what everybody's telling them, that you have to go to college to make it. You can get in an apprenticeship program, put four years in, come out with a trade with no college debt.

Ben

The opportunities are almost limitless in construction -- electricians, plumbers, HVAC techs. All these guys and all these trades need help, they need employees. It's very hard to find good help these days, so, you know, these kids definitely have a good future

ahead of them if they want it. Kevin

All right. Well, you two obviously have plenty to say on the subject. And we've got some young apprentices joining us on the job site today from a local vocational school. So, this is your guys' opportunity to talk to these two with questions about what their experiences are like -- residential, commercial. What have you got?

Woman

Well, I'd like to know how you got into electrical, both of you.

Donald

There are four boys in my family. My two older brothers went the traditional route, they went to college. I was a guy who loved to tear apart things, see how it worked. I really enjoyed that. And college just didn't make sense to me. And I had an opportunity to become an apprentice. And it was the best decision I ever made.

Ben

I sort of fell into it. But it's the same thing, you know, I always enjoyed working with my hands. I just liked that sense of completion that I get from doing a job, seeing it to its end, and walking away knowing I did a good job on it. So, I still really like going to work every day. I definitely have a good feeling about the profession that I have.

Kevin

All right, well, we've only got the congressman for the day, so we're gonna let him get back to work and let you guys get back to school. So, thanks for coming,

all. Donald

Thanks, guys.

Kevin

All right, let's go.

Man

All right, so, today is window installation day. Have you guys installed a window before?

Yes. Man

Kevin has.

Mary

I've not, but I've wanted to.

Man

All right, well, you're gonna learn today. The first thing we're gonna talk about is the window itself. In this particular window, we have three layers of glass so that there's two cavities here, and they'll get filled with argon and krypton gas, which is an inert gas that is a little thicker than air, so it's got a little bit more heat-resistance to it. So, that's what's gonna give us our high performance to get to that net-zero. So, then when we get to the window itself, this particular window is a double-hung window, and it's actually three separate components. We have the two sashes, and then we have the frame. And because everything has to move up and down, there's a lot of movement in this window. So, before it's installed, you can see how much we can move this window out of rack. And that becomes very important when we do the installation. If we're out of square, and that window goes up and down, it's gonna bind, you might have some air gaps. We're gonna create a diagonal measurement, which is how we're gonna check it for square. So, we're basically just gonna hook from one end to the other, and you get a number of 83 1/8. So, then we'll do the same on the other side. So, that's exactly the same. So, that window is square. Now, when you have a lot of the same-sized windows to put in in a day, it's nice to create a little jig so that way, we can use this instead of measuring each side. We just put this in, and you know the window's square. Then we can check it just by reversing it. And that should fit right in, which it does. So, that's how we tell a window's square going forward, and we only need one piece instead of having to measure each one. So, the first thing we're gonna do is we're gonna prepare our opening. Our windowsill is flat, right? We knew that from when we framed it. But one of the things that we want to do, and I learned this from Tom Silva, is we're gonna add a piece of clapboard. Now, you can se the bevel on the clapboard is thicker on this side and thinner on this side. So, we're gonna put that thicker part on the inside. All right, so we're just gonna nail this clapboard in. Okay, so, now we've got to waterproof the windowsill. And the way we've been doing this for years is that we cut self-adhered tape that are gonna go on the outside corners like this. Then we're gonna put another piece in the middle, working our way out. It's gonna come up the sides. And then we'll cut a little slice in the corner, and that's gonna wrap. All right, so this is basically the way we've been doing it for about 10 years now. And the only problem with it is that there is a cut here, so there is a little area where water could get in. So, now we have a product that enables us to it in one piece. And that way, we don't have to make that cut. So, we're gonna line up our centerline here, and we're gonna follow the edge of the clapboard again. Tuck that under,

Mary. Mary

Okay.

Man

Okay, now line me up on my edge of the clapboard there. Okay, I'll just use my square to get that corner set nice and tight. Now, here's where the magic happens. So, we have to work it out slowly, but, basically, this tape will stretch right around this corner... and create a flat transition right around the corner. Do the same thing on this side. Stretch it all the way out to the corner. Good. Thank you. All right. So, look at that. Now we don't have that cut there, so that's really a waterproof pan right there. Okay, so we're ready to put the window in. Garrett's gonna apply a bead of sealant all the way around the perimeter of the window so that this nailing flange sits into that sealant. So, now we're just gonna center it in the hole and just put my fingertips in there. That's good right there. So, the first thing we're gonna do is we're gonna level our windowsill in place. But before we do that, we're gonna shim this window up a tiny bit. And that way, if water were to get in there, we're gonna give it a path to escape. If that window is down tight, the window actually will stop the -- So, we're gonna put this up just a little bit and put a couple of composite shims in. And now we're gonna check it for level. And you guys did a great job framing, 'cause that is perfect. Now that we're level, we're gonna put a nail in the bottom corners. And now we're gonna check it for square. And that's good right there, so, Garrett, give me one up high. Yeah. So, that side's good. Now we're gonna reverse it, and this should be the exact same thing... which it is. All right, so now we can nail the entire flange off. The manufacture recommends two-inch roofing nails, six to eight inches on center. By the looks of that, it's about every other hole. Okay, so, now our window's installed. And you can see this gap, and it's slightly different from the bottom to the top. So, we want to close that gap so that that reveal is consistent all the way. So, we're gonna do that. We're gonna shim these two points here. And, Kevin, you can drive that shim pack in. All right, so I'm just gonna put a tack in the just to keep that shim to hold it in place. And now we're gonna do the other side. How's that look?

Kevin

Pretty good.

Man

All right, so next thing we're gonna do is we got to take the sashes back out, 'cause we've got to screw through the jamb into the framing. Okay. All right. Nice job. We got to cut these shims off, and then we got 30 more to go.

All right. Mary

Okay.

Kevin

Now that we've got a layer of mineral wool insulation on top of the roof, we've got to start thinking about the insulation underneath the roof. And Tom Kelly's crew is doing the spraying for us. Hey,

Tom. Tom

Hey, Kevin.

Kevin

What are you spraying today?

Tom

The application today is gonna start with a two-inch layer of our closed cell foam to provide a vapor barrier, some increased structural integrity,

and an R-14. Kevin

Yeah.

Tom

We're gonna top that off with seven and a half inches of open cell foam for additional area and permeable R-30 to give us R-44 total.

Kevin

All right, if I could just sneak behind you for a second, I want to show you this, 'cause Jeff Sweenor actually built us up a mock-up of our roof system, 'cause it's actually kind of complicated. On top of the rafters, we've got a layer of sheathing, and then we've got the ice and water shield. And in most cases, a lot of guys are just done there, and they're gonna put their shingles on top of that. Either the cedar or in many cases, asphalt. But we've gone a lot further. We've got yet another layer of sheathing, and that creates our sandwich, because we've got two layers of mineral wool. This gives us an R-20 in total. Another layer of sheathing, and this is as far as we've gotten today. And on top of this, we still have to do another layer of ice and water, then we've got the matrix, because we want a little bit of an air gap behind our cedar shingles so those can dry out. And this is on the top side. And what you guys working on today is the inside. Here are our rafters, and this is the bay that you're gonna spray. And you said two of closed and seven of open?

That's correct. Kevin

That is awesome. So, the prep work has started, get you guys going. What goes into that?

Tom

The sprayer is gonna be out in the truck getting himself situated. It's gonna involve recirculated materials, get the drums nice and warm. Dialing in his processing perimeters, temperatures, pressures, ratios on his spray equipment. And his personal protective equipment -- spray suit,

rubber gloves. Kevin

Right.

Tom

Full-face respirator with a fresh air supply.

Kevin

Okay. So, in each bay, you're gonna start off with a closed cell, spray it, let it set up, and on top of that, put the open cell?

Tom

That's correct.

Kevin

And what's the thought process between mixing the two formulas?

Tom

The homeowner really wanted a vapor barrier, which we don't get with the open cell. So, we had to put in at least that base layer of two-inch closed cell foam.

Kevin

Right.

Tom

That provides us the vapor barrier, structural integrity, and R-14. If we were to completely fill the bays with closed cell, we'd get a much higher R-value,

but it can be cost prohibitive. Kevin

Right.

Tom

So, we do this hybrid application to provide the benefits of the closed cell foam and then make up the difference in R-value and additional air sealing with a less expensive open cell foam.

Kevin

Gotcha. Okay. So, we just put in R-20 on top of the roof with the mineral wool. What was your total R-value underneath the roof?

44. Kevin

So, together, 64. And code only requires that we go to 38,

so we are well above that. Tom

Oh, yeah, well beyond.

Kevin

All right, well, thank you, Tom.

Appreciate it. Tom

All right, take care.

Kevin

All right, so at an R-64 and with a sealed-up roof, we are one step closer to the net-zero house we want. But we're not there yet. So, next week, we're actually gonna built a platform for solar panels, and it's actually gonna be an old-fashioned barn raising. So, until then, I'm Kevin O'Connor for "This Old House" here in Rhode Island. Next time on "This Old House"... Right through here is the old house. And we always knew that we needed to add insulation if we wanted this home to get to net-zero.

Jeff

And I will end up taping the seams and putting another layer of plywood down, and that will kind of lock it down and clean it up.

Tom

And our apprentices are learning how to install a wood roof.

Kevin

And it's an old-fashioned barn raising.

Norm

That's next time on "This Old House."