In Their Hands

(dramatic music) (metal clangs) - How long does it go?

I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

I'm sorry for 47 years already.

- You kill an officer, you are going to spend the rest of your life in prison.

- I didn't see much sense of his ability to ever get out of prison, but things changed.

- [Chick] Hope, we always have hope.

(crowd clapping) - [Ronnie] Everybody's praying and believing that I'm gonna be granted parole.

That is God's gonna change these people's heart.

(dramatic music continues) - [Announcer] Major funding for "In Their Hands," is provided by Vital Projects Fund, with additional funding from Field Foundation of Illinois, Leonard C. Goodman, Joseph and Bessie Feinberg Foundation, Fund for Investigative Journalism, Woods Fund Chicago, and the following.

(upbeat dramatic music) - [Parole Board Member] So this case is very polarizing.

This deals with the murder of a police officer.

There's a lot of layers to it and a lot of emotion on both sides.

(upbeat dramatic music continues) (incarcerated people chattering) Ronnie Carrasquillo is up for parole for the crime of first-degree murder.

(dramatic music) He's classified as minimum security, A-grade, and low-escape risk.

- Could put my feet down or it's good like this.

- [Parole Board Member] Ronnie Carrasquillo's age, at the time of the offense was 18.

He was sentenced to 200 to 600 years in prison.

(dramatic music continues) - I was 18 years old, and I'm 65 years old now.

So I spent 47 years in prison.

I'm guilty, I fired the gun.

So I'm guilty, period.

I've taken accountability every time I go to the parole board.

1985 was my first parole hearing.

- [Parole Board Member] 1985, '86, '87.

- [Ronnie] I've been to the parole board at least 30 times.

- '92, '93, '94, '95.

- You have these people in these positions, "We're gonna keep you forever.

We're gonna waste you forever."

How long does it go?

How long now that, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, for 47 years already.

(car engine humming) - Good morning.

- Morning.

- Good morning.

- [Friend] What can I do?

- We have so many supporters.

You know, we've had as much as 40 people come out.

Zach, do you want a yogurt, babe?

Here.

The parole board members always say the same thing, "We've never seen this much support."

We're there every year.

I thought Zachary was driving.

(melancholy music) Okay.

Let's pray we have good, good, uh... - [Passenger] Outcome.

- Yes, a good outcome.

(melancholy music continues) We really believe every single time we're up there, "Okay, we got it this year.

We got it."

I have to, I have to, without hope, you don't have anything, so, I can't give up that hope.

(melancholy music continues) If you love someone that's incarcerated, you don't have a heart, if you don't feel that emptiness when they're not around.

Who gives an 18-year-old, who has never committed a crime, 2 to 600 years?

There has to be some kind of consequence to everything we do, and when I think of Ronnie's case, others may think differently, I think he's been in prison 47 years, he's done his time.

(melancholy music continues) - Good morning.

- Good morning.

- Good good.

- How are you?

- Yeah, you too.

- This is... Oh.

- Charles Hoffman's here.

I didn't, - I know.

- I didn't know he was coming.

- Mr.

Hoffman.

I'm Ronnie's brother.

- How you doing there?

Nice to meet you.

- You know, it's the first time that I don't feel like a hundred percent, so maybe this is the day.

- That's the day we- - You know, like?

- You never know what- - 'Cause we're always like, so hyped.

- Right.

If they deny him today, I wanna talk to Ronnie about maybe filing a motion to see if we can get him out on bond, pending an appeal.

He would want me to do that.

- Of course.

- So, Catanzara's up there.

- Are they?

- The what?

- The head of the FOP.

(light dramatic music) - The prioritization of a law enforcement death speaks right to the fabric of society.

He means something.

He carried a badge and a gun just like we all did.

And sadly, he paid the price.

I'm giving a stance on behalf of the 17,000 active and retired members that we represent.

You appoint and entrust these people to make informed, articulate, educated decisions.

But legislatures change, politicians change, and God only knows where it goes from there.

(heavy dramatic music) - Motion to open up this session.

We're gonna conduct a hearing today of two cases before we go.

- My family members go to every hearing.

A lot of friends go to the hearing.

Everybody's praying and believing that I'm gonna be granted parole.

That is, God's gonna change these people's heart to see what I've been established, what I've been done.

I came in as a child, and matured into where I am now.

So we're expecting and believing I'm gonna be granted that mercy.

(heavy dramatic music continues) (heavy dramatic music continues) - [Official] Miss Terrones?

- [Terrones] Present.

- [Official] Mr.

Tupy?

- [Tupy] Here.

- Chairman Shelton.

- Good morning, here.

Okay, today's hearing is in fact a continuance of the February hearing, where we took testimony on behalf of Mr.

Carrasquillo.

Now there was no one present in opposition to the case.

Would you care to introduce yourself, sir, and be sworn?

- My name is John Catanzara Jr, President of the Fraternal Order of Police, Chicago Lodge 7.

- Thank you.

- Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.

Thank you for the opportunity.

I've been coming to these hearings for quite some time now, and speaking at them for the last several years as president of the union.

This case specifically, I'm very well versed in.

The defendant, repeatedly, said he was just firing willy-nilly into a crowd to disperse something that was going on across the street, but had no idea what he was doing.

There's a lot of new members on this board from the last time we were here, and I will just tell you this.

That first shot went exactly where Ronnie wanted it to go.

He took aim, leaned against the car, and fired a round across the street at a white male he saw, he thought, attacking his friends.

- Police and city workers (suspenseful music) were still looking for evidence Sunday morning in the 3600 block of West Fullerton.

It was here that the 36-year-old patrolman stopped late Saturday night to break up a gang fight.

It was also here he was shot.

(dramatic music) - Well, we were in this wedding event from 6:00 at night until when it happened.

We were drinking all night long, everybody in the house.

It was a party.

Probably 75, 80 people were in the house, and it was a borderline Hispanic community and borderline, going the other way, more Caucasian that way.

Probably 2: 00 in the morning, somebody was yelling, "Hey, these guys are having problems down the street."

So I decide, "Okay, they're down there a long time.

It's been going on awhile."

So I went to go outside.

(dramatic music continues) And then down the street you could see a lot of people, I don't know, 50, 75 people, and just running, all 10 or 20 in this group, in this group and wrestling or fighting.

So I figured, bein' that environment, somebody's gonna get hurt, something's gonna really happen in there, so I'm gonna just shoot down there and I know it'll break 'em up, not knowing who was who in the crowd.

So I leaned against the car.

I shot four shots.

(dramatic music continues) I remember how fast it was.

Everything happened in three seconds.

You couldn't tell who was who.

I did it.

Shot the gun, walked up through the house, walked out, and walked away, and walked home, and never thought anything about it.

In my mind, I knew I didn't shoot anybody.

I would've been running.

(dramatic music continues) We went back and they had already taped off the section and cordoned it, and the officer was saying somebody shot a police officer.

And then this first time I'm like, "Ooh.

It's too late.

It's already done."

(dramatic music continues) - [Catanzara] The shots were intentional.

He meant to shoot Terry Loftus.

He pointed the gun, leaned and braced himself, and fired a shot in that direction.

You don't brace yourself against a car if it's not intentional.

- [Reporter] Funeral Mass was held at the Our Lady Mother of the Church Catholic Church at 8701 West Leland.

Loftus was widely known by his friends and fellow police officers as a good guy, a guy who would stop to help people.

Terrance Loftus is survived by his wife, Carol, his mother, and his brother Tom, a Chicago fireman.

(dramatic music continues) - Sadly, he paid the price on his way home from work trying to do the right thing.

He could have just kept driving that day.

That first shot went exactly where Ronnie wanted it to go.

It killed Officer Terry Loftus.

A judge sentenced him to 200 plus years.

It was effectively, life without parole.

That judge was trying to make a statement, you kill an officer, you are going to spend the rest of your life in prison.

We just lost two police officers (struggling) in the last 60 damn days.

When does this stop?

What kind of message do you think this is gonna send, if you give parole to a police officer murderer?

I get you have a responsibility to consider what he has done as far as rehabilitation.

But you don't just get to flip a switch one day.

I, I'm just gonna leave it at that.

I appreciate your time and attention in this case, and thank you.

- [Jennifer] If it's appropriate, I'd like to offer rebuttal at this point.

- Okay.

- Thank you.

- You have the floor.

- Thank you so much.

Members of the board, there's no question that if he were to be released, Ronnie Carrasquillo would not violate the conditions of his parole.

There's no question that he's rehabilitated.

Mr.

Carrasquillo has spent his entire adult life doing everything that he can to make up for the thing that he did as an 18-year-old drunk child.

Behind me sits Mr.

Carrasquillo's immense and loving family and his friends.

I think this board is very well aware of the support that he has in the community.

Next to me sits (fades).

- We're they're all the time.

We've gotta show them who we are.

I think it's important.

Yeah, I think it's very important.

(phone ringing) - [Operator] Free call from (beep) - [Ronnie] Ronnie.

- [Operator] To accept this free call, press one.

(phone beeps) You may start the conversation now.

- [Ronnie] What's going on over there?

- Good morning.

- Everything good?

- Yeah, everything's good.

How are you?

- [Ronnie] Ah, just walking through the time, ya know.

- She stepped up in my life.

I had no technical skills of emails and computers.

I didn't have no, know nothing about that.

She did.

So she became the hub of all the communications that get these people to go to Springfield, get these people to go to the courtrooms.

- Well, I told you that Allie's not feeling too good, so I don't know.

I don't know.

I don't think so.

- We talk every day.

You know, everything, nothing's barred from speaking about with me and her.

Everything, every aspect of life.

Everything.

When, uh.

- My gosh!

I get, I actually get to talk during this conversation.

Usually you take the lead and you take up the 20 minutes.

I think I got to talk more than you today.

- [Ronnie] And my brain, my brain's just, you know, thinking and thinking.

- Takes a lot to communicate to a lot of people and organize 'em, and it's, it's an energizer.

It's, I can keep going.

- You have a lot of people praying.

A lot of people praying for you.

- [Ronnie] Yeah.

Wow.

- The only question before this board truly, is whether Mr.

Carrasquillo's release would deprecate the seriousness of the offense.

And had Ronnie Carrasquillo intended to kill a Chicago police officer, the answer to that question might be yes.

But that is not what Ronnie Carrasquillo did.

It's not what he was charged with.

I think there are two things to note in this indictment.

The first thing is that in neither count is Mr.

Carrasquillo charged with killing a Chicago police officer, because the government did not believe, and continues to not believe, and there is no evidence that Mr.

Carrasquillo knew that Officer Loftus was a Chicago police officer.

That doesn't mean that Mr.

Carrasquillo did not commit first-degree murder.

He did.

He's not looking for a pass.

He's looking for a sentence that appropriately reflects both what he did, and who he is now.

(tracks rattling) (whistle trilling) (horn honks) (traffic rumbling) (bell dinging) (paper rustling) Ronnie's parole petition took about a month to compile, and it does every time.

The whole idea of this packet of information is to try to help the prisoner review board understand who Ronnie is, who he is as a person, not just a crime, right?

And so you can see just in the last year, he founded Hispanic Heritage Month.

He started a program called Breaking Point, which is an anti-gang mental health program.

He organized a whole bunch of events at Kewanee for folks who are religious.

Foundations For Life, Unleash the Masterpiece, the Christian (fades out).

- I got into the church.

I've been ministering ever since in here.

- The Crossroad Bible Institute.

He took (fades out).

- I became a disciplinarian to myself, educational-wise, training-wise.

- A ministry, called the Institute for Prison Ministries.

- And I don't stop.

- Christ Prison Ministries.

(dramatic music) - If I was to stay in the rational mind that I was as the 16, 17-year-old kid coming in prison, it's easy to lock into the hate.

It's all around me I was living in, it's a swimming pool of hate, where I came to the conclusion, "I gotta fix me."

Ya know what I mean?

I had to work on me.

(dramatic music) (people chattering) It was 1968.

I was 10 years old.

(tracks clattering) (light dramatic music) We grew up in a pretty good environment, but for some reason, my father purchased a house in the Humboldt Park area.

I grew up the first 10 years not knowing what it meant to be Puerto Rican.

So when I moved into the Humboldt Park area, people would say, "You shouldn't come to this school, you're Puerto Rican."

And I'd go home, "Hey, Moms, what's, what's that?"

(light dramatic music continues) - At that time back, back, let me see, I would say 50 some years ago, this was a white neighborhood.

So there were Italians and different white ethnic groups.

They would gang up on the Hispanics.

We were getting beat up every day.

We lived right here.

(traffic humming) My mother would clean the sidewalks in the summer 'til 9:00 at night.

If you're not home after it gets dark, you get beat with a, with a spoon, 'cause she was really that loving to her children.

And Ronnie was the spoiled brat.

He got to get away with everything.

(traffic rumbling) - My mother was a very loving mother, very structured.

You had to be sitting down at 4: 00 to eat.

She just did everything, ya know, everything to care for us.

My father was not around.

He created a second family.

He married again.

We rarely seen him.

So my mother depended on the Chicago Board of Education system to basically raise us, so she put us in every park district program there was.

Baseball, football.

(children yelling) She had no idea, starting 12, 13 years old, going into first year of high school, we were latching more onto the street.

(people chattering) - This is the school yard.

We hung here, and then gangs would come by, start shooting at us in the school yard.

And it just made us get into a fact of turning into a gang to protect each other, because it was Hispanics against whites at that time.

At 12 years old, you witness a girl die in your arms.

And those are the things that you never think that children do, experience funerals.

- A girlfriend of mine, I carried her into the hospital.

They shot her in the head.

She passed away.

Another month or two later, another girlfriend and five or other six people shot down juveniles, and I carry 'em into the hospital Christmas night.

So I'm seeing all this, and that drew me into the gang life more, then I spent more time, instead of going home.

The gang became my family.

We felt safe in that playground.

That was our mental security place, being in the playground.

- We didn't have a family life.

We didn't have a child life.

My father didn't raise us or nothing.

He would come around once a week, buy us a beef sandwich, give us $5 each, and say, "Be good."

- And that was the extent of our relationship, for a long time.

(light dramatic music) Until my mother passed away.

You know, I was in school that day, and some teacher came and said, "They wanna talk to you in the principal office," or whatever.

I went down there, they say, "You have to go to this hospital.

Your mother's in the hospital."

So from seeing her one day, and the next day it was over with.

So it was that fast.

So being 15 years old, it don't compute.

(light dramatic music continues) - And our world just changed.

That's how we ended up being with my dad, only for that reason.

This is where we lived with my father.

He lived in the front right here, this white house right here.

And we lived back here, 'til this house burned down.

And then he put us in the basement, 'til they found us an apartment.

(light dramatic music continues) - I basically became his father.

And I didn't do a good job with it.

I didn't have the skills to, you know, to train somebody to be a son or raise him up.

I don't take shame or fault, like, but I recognize what I did to my younger brother.

You know.

(light dramatic music continues) (traffic humming) We would end up staying in the street 24 hours a day, 2 days at a time.

We'd run away right back to where we felt safe in that playground.

I felt I was doing right by going, securing that environment.

And it eventually brought me to this prison.

Brought me to my prison life.

(light dramatic music continues) (people chattering) (wings flapping) He loved me He loved me - [Leader] Sing it.

Dying, He saved me Dying, He saved me Buried, He carried Buried, He carried My sins far away My sins far away O glorious day O glorious day O glorious day O glorious day - [Pastor] Glory to God.

Thank you, Jesus.

(congregation applauding) - Yeah.

(congregation chattering) - [Pastor] Hallelujah.

- I'll tell you a little story.

I don't have a lot of time.

So in 1976, my brother (struggling) did a crime, and he was sentenced to 2 to 600 years.

A lot of you will be shocked by that.

I never shared my brother's story.

My parents always made us keep quiet about Ronnie, 'cause it was embarrassing.

And I have so many friends to this day that were my high school friends that I never told anything to.

And it wasn't until I started coming to RTO that I realized that there were other people like me.

And there were other people that had people that were incarcerated.

And it was okay.

It was okay to, it was okay to have someone in your life, or in your family, that made mistakes.

So for that, I just wanna say thank you.

- We love you.

- Thank you.

(congregation applauding) - Bring him home, Lord Jesus.

Bring him home to us.

We praise you for his (fades).

- [Ronnie] When it dawned on me what I caused, - Lord, go before us.

- [Ronnie] the, the drama and the trauma that I bring on to all these people.

- In the name of Jesus Christ.

Amen.

- Amen.

- The financial burden of the justice system coming on my family, that was already discombobulated, that was already dysfunctional.

So that's another weight I gotta walk with every day.

(light dramatic music) After my conviction, we didn't have no money for lawyers, the family-wise, so we had a public defender for the appeal.

Being that we lost that, and my father then tried to hire an attorney, I told him, "Hey, Daddy, I'm going to a parole board.

Stop buyin' attorneys.

Stop doing that."

And I put my trust in the parole board.

- [Parole Board Chair] Jan, please take the roll.

A yes vote is to grant parole.

- [Ronnie] 1985 was my first parole hearing, and I was denied.

That was year after year after year.

- [Parole Board Member] Carrasquillo fails to receive the sufficient votes for parole.

- I had my first vote in the year 2000.

George Montes, Jorge Montes became the chairman, first person ever to vote for me.

(light dramatic music continues) - I remember voting against him multiple times, because he was a classic, in my mind, the classic cop killer.

The case came up, and it was assigned to the former sheriff of DuPage County.

He was a gun expert.

And he said there was no way in his, given his expertise, that a kid that age handling a gun of this kind, at that hour of the night, like, 2:00 in the morning, shooting into a crowd, could aim from the distance that he aimed, and would've intentionally wanted to kill this police officer.

Absolutely not, would somebody be able to use that caliber of a pistol, shoot into the intersection that far away, aim at an officer, and be that good.

Not even a real professional marksman would probably be that good.

And so that convinced me.

After that, I started voting for him consistently.

- [Ronnie] He became my vote and started from there, and then he, I guess, talked to other people.

- When I first joined the board, we were paroling very, very few people.

So I would say, in the first few years, I didn't see much sense of his ability to ever get outta prison.

But things changed.

(light dramatic music) I thought he was well-spoken.

He was reserved.

He'd done a lot to try and prepare himself for release.

He'd taken advantage of the programming that was offered.

And some of the family, I think were going to provide a very good home for him.

That made it much easier to support him.

I voted yes.

I supported him.

- Then three people voted.

Then it was a fourth person.

So I thought I was progressing.

I thought there's light at the end of the tunnel.

- [Jorge] Mr.

Carrasquillo started gaining more favor.

It crept up to the point where we were one vote shy.

- In 2008, I had the majority of the board members at the hearing.

But they have a policy they created in 1985 that says I need the majority of the board.

So if a board member doesn't show up for work that day, they count that vote against me.

(people chattering) - And that is the time when we had the former chairman flip flop, and did not give his vote, and that's why Ronnie didn't get out.

He had been advocating for Mr.

Carrasquillo, and then mysteriously dropped out.

(dramatic music) - And what changed my view on that was the possibility of his gang activity, things about his conduct that were not previously known to me.

- There is information that the board has discussed in the past.

Information that we've gotten from the Department of Corrections over the years, that involved the issue of gang membership.

That is not something we could discuss in open session.

So we're gonna go to closed executive session.

(dramatic music) (people chattering) - Our board at that time was able to read documents from the Department of Corrections, that are confidential and not shared with anybody.

Documents from the Chicago Police Department, interviews with confidential informants in the Department of Corrections.

And that certainly had influence on me.

- The police department and the IDOC's internal affairs got together.

They put out an investigative report of all these confidential informants to show the board I was still gang-active.

(dramatic music continues) It's unusual to do that, for you to reinvestigate me, to use taxpayers' money just to prove that I'm a gang leader and all that.

I have a bachelor's degree in theological studies.

I graduated four Bible colleges.

What gang member does that?

For what purpose would I do that if I still run a street gang?

- Mr.

Carrasquillo had done everything he could in prison.

He was very careful.

Gang chiefs almost never get disciplinary reports in prison.

They're too cautious.

They have other people do the work for 'em.

Was that the case for Mr.

Carrasquillo?

I don't know.

Possibly.

(dramatic music continues) - It's just falsified information, documentation through official channels.

So as you drive up in the neighborhood, you can just grab 'em, "Hey, you know this guy?".

You know, and if you read that, half of 'em say, "I don't know that, I don't know him."

They actually brought a person that saying he was my family member to the parole board, and he's no relations to me at all, saying that he's my nephew and I gave him this much territory to run and all that.

My family said, "We don't have no family member of that name.

Who's he talking about?"

- There was enough evidence to satisfy my belief that his gang involvement was more substantial than he would ever admit.

- You go to the PRB Board, they're mostly elderly people.

And when you show 'em physical papers, "He's still doing that?

And all these guys said that," it looks real.

So if they were gonna vote for me, not now.

So in their minds, and in even my family's mind, some of 'em believe the reports that the officers are not gonna lie.

The system's not gonna lie.

They're the system... Oh yes, they will.

(dramatic music continues) I needed one vote.

So for the officers' standpoint of view, they're, "we gotta stop this."

(people chattering) - We had a very interesting conversation in closed session.

Some of that involved the issue of gang membership, that I want those points to be made in open session.

- (sighs) What was just shared is the concern of affiliation when it comes to community safety if he continues with his affiliation, external to the institution.

- I will simply state that I know there has been a lot of question as to whether Mr.

Carrasquillo has sincerely renounced his gang membership.

I do understand it's been consistently reported that he did officially renounce in 1993.

Again, I know that leaves a lot of question in people's minds as far as the severity of it, but I thought this was all important context.

- I have a question regarding whether Mr.

Carrasquillo made statements acknowledging that he believed he had killed a, quote, "pig"?

- I would just like to say, when you look at the information, and he didn't know, supposedly, that he shot a police officer, but yet after the shooting, he goes to his friends and said, "I shot a pig," to me, determines that he knew that Mr.

Loftus was a police officer.

- Yeah, if I can just respond to that.

I think there is some reason to potentially question whether he stated that.

I also think it's important to kind of distinguish teenage street bravado from sincere statements of what would an individual who is street-involved, 18-years-old, have said upon receiving that news, surrounded by his street-involved friends.

(people chattering) - The case would come up, he's a cop killer.

You got all these cops all around you, and they were breathing down, literally, down your neck.

(easy jazz music) A lot of decisions were made by board members on the basis of the pressure they were feeling.

And it would always be a very automatic, "No."

(easy jazz music continues) So every vote that I cast, especially as a chairman, and that's exactly why I'm not chairman anymore, (chuckles) because my votes were watched.

We would hear from legislators who took offense at some of the votes we took.

- [Official] Mr.

Secretary, read the bill.

- [Mr.

Secretary] House Bill 2376 offered by Senator Fine, and that concerning safety.

House Bill 2380 offered by Senator Fine.

- The politics of this situation is to become a parole board member.

The governor appoints 'em on the board, and then they're confirmed into that seat by the Senate body.

The way the political structure goes, you can have 10 members on the board, and next year they remove 'em all and put another 10, and you just lose everything.

So there's no, nothing stationary.

(dramatic music) (counter clicking) - The parole board, who's on it, who did they release?

Inevitably it's going to be a political football every election year.

- You know, there are a couple things that the general public just will not allow.

And one of them is endangering public safety, because we all want our children to be safe.

We all wanna lay our heads down at night, and hope that no one's gonna try to break into your house.

Right?

Or murder you.

I think real town America, which is Murphysboro, believes in rehabilitation.

But I also believe in keeping our community safe.

Great place to live.

(birds chirping) Murphysboro, it's a nice town.

We all help each other, and do things together.

We have a car show.

They'll have hot dogs, cotton candy, snow cones.

It's free.

We also host the Apple Festival.

It's been going on now for over 75 years.

Lots of correctional employees in this town, because, in or around, the 58th Senate District, we have seven prisons.

So it's a kind of an important part of the economic makeup of our area.

I mean, it's a lot of employers.

(easy jazz music) There are individuals who cannot be rehabilitated.

I really believe that.

And one of the things that you just don't release people for is killing police officers.

That person is an individual, in my mind, who will kill anyone.

(easy jazz music continues) - You have these political people in office.

They said, "We want harsher laws and lengthier times."

It fit right in that they were walking me out of my natural life.

We went through a, you could say a spasm of that for 20, 30 years.

- [Crowd] Power to the people!

- Power to the people!

- [Crowd] Power to the people!

- Power to the people!

- Looking at the video, - Power to the people!

- and you can see that this man shot Laquan McDonald 16 times in cold blood.

(crowd yelling) - Specific to Chicago, there was a very palpable change in the perception of policing with the Laquan McDonald murder.

Nobody can deny that.

(crowd chanting) You could say the same thing about 2020 with George Floyd's murder and the anti-police sentiment that swept across this country and the emotions it invoked.

- George Floyd!

- Say his name!

- [Crowd] George Floyd!

- [Leader] Say his name!

- [Crowd] George Floyd!

- [Leader] Say his name!

- Lieutenant Governor Juliana Stratton and I, brought our state's prison population down by about 25%, since the beginning of this pandemic.

(crowd applauding) - [Catanzara] It permeated every single aspect of government, including the parole board.

- [Parole Board Chair] The first case is that of Mr.

Ronnie Carrasquillo.

- The review board members who had been appointed by Governor Pritzker, fit into the framework of what his political beliefs were, which is very soft on crime.

I believe very pro criminal.

- The men and women of the Chicago Police Department are literally under attack more than ever before.

The morale has been shattered like nobody cares when one of ours dies, or one of their murderers gets let out.

It's no big deal.

You can stop this right now.

Do not grant parole, I beg of you.

Thank you.

- This case tears me apart in so many different ways.

I see folks that, every day are out there, doing something that I can't do.

And I got to meet Ronnie and meet his family, and I see folks that have stood by him and helped him become something, that maybe at 18, no one ever thought he could.

(sighs) And this is tough.

I, I... - More times than not, it's the liberal minds that wanna give parole, parole, parole.

Everything's about emotion and sympathy and trying to, you know, give people the benefit of the doubt, except for the officers.

- Thank you.

- [Parole Board Chair] The question is, shall parole be granted to Mr.

Ronnie Carrasquillo?

A yes vote is to grant, please take the roll.

- [Official] Mr.

James?

- [Parole Board Chair] There's no wrong vote, Mr.

James.

- [Mr.

James] Yes.

- [Parole Board Chair] Six in favor of parole, seven in opposition.

- Thank you.

- I can tell you, we were sitting kinda tightly in our chairs, me and Frank.

We really thought, "Oh, damn!"

As the sentiment and the pendulum started swinging, it really kinda was a all-out effort to right the ship, so to speak, and get more balance back at that parole board.

So we reached out to both sides of the legislature down in Springfield, and said, "This is an issue that matters to the FOP.

We'd like to talk to you about it."

(dramatic music) (people chattering) - We heard from people from all over law enforcement.

I'm in a minority party.

We don't have enough numbers to stop something.

So systematically, the three Republicans, who were on executive appointments committee, started trying to make the general public aware of who was being released from prison and why.

- The handful of Senate Republicans rather unhappy with the number of controversial releases of five convicted murderers, two of them guilty of killing police officers.

- [Reporter] Republicans seizing the issue in a political season where crime and safety are the number one concerns of voters.

- [commercial] For decades, Jean had the support of governors of both parties to keep her uncle's killer behind bars, until JB Pritzker.

- My message to the governor would be, "Shame on you."

- The prisoner review board became the political football.

They became the scapegoat for all of the sort of societal challenges that Illinois was facing during COVID, mind you.

- The record will (fades).

- They're an easy target for someone who wants to challenge a political opponent for being too quote-unquote, "soft on crime."

- Each of these individuals should come before the committee so that we can ask them specific questions.

- Okay, so the prison review board, we're going to go to Oreal James, appointment message 102109.

- So I would repeat a question that I asked a previous candidate for this position.

- Okay.

- And that would be, what crime could someone commit that would be reason enough to warrant life in prison, and that they would not be released?

- If I were to say that I would never vote for something, then there is no reason for me to have a hearing.

- In 2018 you said that you could not support parole for an individual who would shoot at a police officer.

You have subsequently voted to release at least seven people who've killed police officers.

- (laughs) Senator Plummer, I understand that you wanna paint a picture with certain sentences and certain statements.

So I am - Thank you, sir.

unable to answer your question, because you have already made up your mind on this statement.

- Thank you.

And we will move on to our next appointment.

(dramatic music) - [Jorge] Many heads rolled, and some people didn't even bother to go forward with the whole process of confirmation, 'cause they knew they wouldn't make it.

- [Mr.

Secretary] The Senate rejects the nomination.

(bangs gavel) - That's the strength of this kind of lobbying that goes on behind the scenes with the parole board.

(dramatic music continues) - We're thankful that, you know, the legislature heard our complaints.

And there was definitely changes that were made.

I'm not saying that we were solely responsible for the changes made.

But you know, it definitely made a difference.

And the chairman now has a law enforcement background.

We'd like to think we have more of a fairer board at this point.

(dramatic music continues) - [Jennifer] The Senate has gutted the prisoner review board.

Everyone who's ever voted for Ronnie has been removed.

Now we have a prisoner review board primarily made up of people who very rarely, if ever, vote for release.

(light dramatic music) - I think most of you who've heard me speak on this before are probably guessing correctly that I'm not in favor of this petition, personally.

The petition this year says, "Ronnie has always taken full responsibility for his actions.

He's spent the last 45 years, not only accepting that responsibility, but trying to be a force for good."

Okay, I think that's absurd.

I'm sorry.

Regarding his credibility, and this is the reason why, when I see all these good things that he's done, and all this programming, I wonder whether or not, I mean, honestly, I wonder whether or not this is a person who's made this reform, who's made this change in his life, or if he's just smart enough to know he's gotta present a totally different face if he ever expects to get out of prison.

So the real question for me is, do I believe all the good that I've heard about Ronnie Carrasquillo is now the function of a person who's made this change in his life?

It could be.

I can't say that it's not.

Even if it's true, I still believe he murdered a Chicago police officer.

I believe that.

And I'm having real difficulty getting past it, so I cannot bring myself to support the petition.

(dramatic music) - [Parole Board Member] Thank you.

I think that concludes our comment.

- [Parole Board Chair] Call the roll please.

On the motion to deny.

- [Official] Miss Shoffner?

- [Miss Shoffner] Yes.

- [Official] Miss Globokar?

- No.

- Mr.

Grubbs?

- Yes.

- Mr.

Coates?

- Yes.

- Mr.

Heaton?

(dramatic music continues) - Every parole hearing we say the same thing.

"Did I intend?

Did I see him?

Did I know what I did?"

In my spirit, I know.

I never intended that.

- The motion's been made to deny.

That motion carries.

Thank you very much.

(tally clicking) Call the next case.

(people chattering) (gentle music) - [Ronnie] I've never come out of being not sorry.

I'm sorry for what I've done.

- It's such a sham.

- The life that I walked, I fired the gun that caused this.

Officer Loftus his life.

(gentle music continues) As a person, that's who he was, you know, helping people.

You know, that's what, that's what he done, so he, in the incident this happened, he was helping people.

You know, he came out of his car in the middle of a bad situation to help people.

And my action took that away from him in an instant, from him and his family.

So when people speak of remorse, I live with that every day that I can't give it back.

I can't speak to him.

I can't do that.

So they say, how can you prove remorse?

And I say, by living this way, that that person in me, I had to, I had to get rid of that person in me.

(gentle music continues) Time to go.

See ya another day.

(officers chattering) Can't change anything of yesterday.

God says, I forgive you for that, and I go forward.

So it's, what can I do now?

- [Family member] So you needed seven out of nine?

- Yeah.

That's so dumb.

Two people that have never heard the case.

And that man, that, that... - They make up the rules, - how is that fair?

- [Family member] as they go.

- How is that fair?

Oh my God.

(people chattering) - But it wasn't even close anyway.

- [Paul] That ain't never gonna change.

- [Friend] Right, this is the worst.

- This is the worst it's been.

You know, they already knew.

- Like they've all made up their mind about it.

- They got rid of the whole board, to create this board.

- They make up the rules along the way.

- You know what we should do?

No, but listen to me.

If they're getting paid $80,000 a year, the public don't know.

- Paid 100.

- Okay, well the public don't know how corrupt this is.

- Yeah.

- They didn't have a, that wasn't a hearing.

That was biased.

- Yeah.

- It's okay.

I'll talk to you soon.

- Talk to you another time.

- Okay.

- [Ronnie] All right, take care.

Later.

- Ronnie just called for to find out what the outcome of the hearing was.

He doesn't have much emotion.

You know, he doesn't, he doesn't say anything.

He never does.

He'll just go back, and he'll pray a little bit, go back to his Bible, and he'll be fine.

- [Interviewer] What about you?

- I'm okay.

I believe in God.

Ronnie's time is coming.

It just wasn't today, but his time's coming.

(people chattering and laughing) (dishes clanking) - Where's my buddy, man?

(person laughs) (people continue chattering and laughing) (friends greeting) - Good, good, good!

You look, nice.

I like this.

You remind me of my father, mm.

- Were ya?

(people continue chattering) - So, if Jenny, Jennifer, and Chuck and Michael could come up.

(all clapping and cheering) (people chattering and clapping) - We can't be more honored than to have you on our team.

Charles, you brought us this far.

Jenny, we can't even say enough about you.

The way you handle that parole board.

That's a mean, (laughs) sometimes a mean group of people to go up against, but she's always so positive.

We really thank you from the bottom of our hearts.

We're gonna ask you if you could update the group.

- Yeah, yeah.

- Go ahead.

- Deyra has said she can't thank the lawyers enough, but I'll tell you, the real heroes in Ronnie's case are Ronnie and his family.

- Yes.

(attendee clapping) (all clapping) - So here's an update on the case.

For any of you who's ever been to one of Ronnie's parole hearings, you'll know that that's a sham.

Well, we're done with the parole board.

We were back in the appellate court to prove that Ronnie's original sentencing hearing back in 1977 was unconstitutional.

- [Attendee] Ooh.

- Ronnie had an immature brain.

His brain was like a juvenile.

The judge never considered Ronnie's youth and its attendant characteristics, which is what the constitution requires.

And so we were able to convince the appellate court that Ronnie gets a new sentencing hearing.

- Bravo!

(people clapping) - The slate is wiped clean.

So everybody keep your, keep praying for Ronnie.

It's not over.

We may have won the latest battle, but we haven't won the war yet.

So hope.

Hope, we always have hope.

- Amen, thank God.

- Ah!

(laughs) - [Jennifer] Yeah, always.

(people chattering) (light dramatic music) - When you come out and say that my brain was not the stage of an 18-year-old because of different traumas, different things in life, it's a reality.

I was 18, and you think you're all that, and I wasn't.

I got lost somewhere in a couple years of time.

(light dramatic music continues) Finally, that reality, my truth of my life, came to be the fact on the table.

It's, it's mind boggling, you know?

Hm.

(light dramatic music continues) - Oh Jenny, thank you so much.

Thank you so much.

- My sister, she said, "What do you wanna do when you go home?

What's the first thing you wanna do?"

I wanna go in your backyard and sit, and uh, (struggling) just say, you know, "Whew, it's over."

And I just wait and bide my time.

Just keep praying, just keep praying.

(light dramatic music continues) (traffic humming) (birds chirping) (people chattering) - Only way we got here.

That's the only way we got here, Manny.

- Oh my gosh.

- Oh yeah.

(car engine humming) - [Jennifer] Everyone is asking for time served.

Time served for Ronnie would mean 47 years.

47 years in prison.

The judge, you know, he's the judge.

He has the final authority, and he has absolutely the power to impose whatever sentence he deems appropriate.

(people chattering) (gentle music) - [Ronnie] Sitting in the bullpen, more people I guess were coming and coming in the courtroom.

And as one guy went in to hear his case, came back out, he was telling everybody, "That courtroom is packed.

I've never seen a courtroom full of people.

Something's going on."

(gentle music continues) (people continue chattering) They took me into the courtroom, sat down at the table, and then I was just scanning the courtroom, who was there, you know.

And I seen, you know, Eric, my brother, Sister Janet, all these different people, parole board members who voted for my parole.

The judge let the representative for the Fraternal Order of Police, let him speak.

He went into his, you know, I should stay there forever, don't deserve anything.

And all that went on and on.

So the judge just went into, everybody was saying how bad I was and not reformed, I was the bad guy still.

So he said he heard this over and over, but that he was recognizing my accolades, my certificates, and my work in the prison system.

So he said, "I'm gonna recognize that you have worked, and that you are not that same person."

He finally concluded, "I'm gonna sentence you to 46 years and 11 months."

So when he said it, "46 years, 11 months," I knew right there.

I said, you know, "I'm going home.

It's over."

(people clapping and shouting) (light music) (crowd cheering) For 40-something years, they were sending me money, paying lawyer fees, suffering through every hearing.

You know, just, they constantly supporting me.

They finally got their relief.

(people chattering) - We're overwhelmed.

We're very happy.

Justice was finally served.

- [Interviewer] Yeah, yeah, and you know, yeah, one of the things the judges talked about was that he was 18 at the time, and was convinced that he's a changed person.

Like, what's your reaction to that, Ronnie, that is.

- I've been asked that question many times during the years, and I just answer back as, "Who were you when you were 18 years old?"

I don't remember a lot of things that I did when I was 18 years old.

And I could, if I could go back, I'm 54, if I could go back to when I was 18 years old, I'd certainly do a lot of things differently myself.

(people chattering) (light music continues) - Didn't even stick around for the final sentences out of his mouth.

It was very clear where he was going with it.

We walked out.

Disgusting.

(light music continues) (people chattering) - [Family member] Yeah, go ahead, and put a bunch of hearts.

- [Family member] Yeah, just put, "We love you."

- Ya gonna have to.

- Wow.

- There ya go.

See?

- Whoo!

- I think we have it the wrong way.

- Wait, wait, wrong way.

(laughing) - Then you.

- Oh yeah.

(laughs) There ya go.

- [All 3] Yay!

- We've only waited 47 years.

(laughs) I can't wait to just hug him.

Oh my gosh, I wish I was a fly on the wall right now, watching Ronnie, (laughs) what he's doing.

I can't even imagine what it's like.

When you're in the visiting rooms, you know, you're not allowed to, you can have a one second hug, ya know.

Like, I just wanna embrace him, and I'm really excited.

I, I can't even, I'm overwhelmed.

Yeah.

- Okay.

Don't get excited, Ronnie.

You got a crowd out here, but you'll be fine.

Okay, I love you.

Okay, God bless you.

Five minutes he'll be out.

Five minutes he'll be out.

(light dramatic music) (people chattering) - That's him!

That's him!

Hallelujah!

Ronnie, we love you!

- Oh, my God!

Oh my God!

Oh my God!

(crowd cheering and yelling) Oh, I'm so excited!

(crowd clapping) (Ronnie clamoring) (crowd cheering) Yes!

(light dramatic music continues) (Ronnie and Paul rejoicing and crying) (Deyra crying) - Whoo!

(all 3 yelling) - Oh, I can't believe it.

(light dramatic music continues) (all chattering) (all laughing and chattering) - I gotcha.

I'm taking your paperwork out of your hands right now.

- Hallelujah!

(people chattering) (all cheering) - Whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo!

- Yes sir.

Here we go.

Everybody, wanna see me.

- Thank you Lord Jesus.

- Thank you God.

That's the name of the game.

- [Interviewer] What are you gonna do now that you're out, Ronnie?

- Help people live.

Keep 'em in joy.

- Yeah.

- You know, after everybody goes through a lot of traumas and trials, you learn to overcome 'em.

That's just the life I've been living.

- Okay.

(laughs) (people chattering) - Okay.

Thank you guys very much.

See you another day.

- All right.

- Okay.

- Good night.

(light dramatic music) (crickets chirping) What is this one?

This is Pac-Man, Ronnie.

Never played Pac-Man?

So basically if you wanna play, use this.

- Yeah.

- And don't let the ghost get you.

(game whirring) - Who's the ghost?

- These are the ghosts.

- He got me?

- [Friend] You gotta move around.

But when they're, when they're colored, you can't, you gotta run over, no, see?

- He got me, huh?

(game fading) - He did get you.

(laughs) - Hey man, you sit here and do this all day?

Oh, he got me again, see.

I got whooped on.

(people chattering) - One of these, and one of those.

- I got bigger plates.

- Oh, you got it.

- Every day it's a learning process.

You know, even though my family's my family, I haven't been around them to know 'em, in that regard.

I knew 'em from a telephone.

I knew 'em from every month, a visit, or every six months, a visit.

So to live around them, to be around them, to watch 'em eat, how they put the fork down, or how they lift up their knife, or it's the small things that you don't know.

Oh, this one likes a lot of ketchup.

That's a lot of ketchup you're putting there.

Or man, this one puts a lot of pepper.

Wow, what are you doing?

(people chattering and laughing) Now I'm getting to know them personally.

(wind chimes ringing) (light dramatic music) - Want some fruit salad?

- I'm, I'm not a not-guilty person.

I'm a guilty person.

And that's the bottom line to my action, I sinned.

In the eyes of God, scripture wouldn't be scripture if there was no forgiveness.

That's what Jesus did.

He was the master restorer.

You know, something was wrong, have mercy, give grace.

The prisoner review board had their intention of my death of incarceration, I believe, and another door was opened through the grace of God.

(light dramatic music continues) (wind chimes continues ringing) (light dramatic music continues) (light dramatic music continues) (upbeat music)