Frederica Freyberg:

Next from our partners at the Wisconsin Center for Investigative Journalism, workers’ comp claims in Wisconsin and whether injured workers are being denied by the State Labor and Industry Review Commission. A commission stacked since 2013 with Scott Walker appointees. Dee Hall is managing editor at the Center for Investigative Journalism. Thanks very much for being here.

Dee Hall:

Thanks for having me.

Frederica Freyberg:

Why did you start digging into this?

Dee Hall:

This is part of an overall investigation that we have been doing called “Broken Whistle.” We’re looking at the state of whistle-blowing in Wisconsin. And we’re also looking at Scott Walker’s efforts to rid out waste, fraud and abuse in state government. And what we’re finding is it’s somewhat of an uneven effort. And there may be some collateral damage there.

Frederica Freyberg:

What's an example from your reporting of workers’ comp of a case that was denied?

Dee Hall:

So we looked at — we featured a case of Richard Decker. He had worked for 36 years at Kohler Company making toilets there, was proud, was a hard worker, worked a lot of overtime and weekends. And he — in 2010 he was hit on the head by an 80-pound toilet and knocked out. He attempted to go back to work, but he had ongoing symptoms, dizziness. He’s developed a stutter. He is exhausted. He’s got a lot of pain. And so he filed for workers’ compensation and ultimately he was denied.

Frederica Freyberg:

And on the basis of?

Dee Hall:

So what happened in his case and happens in many cases is his doctors, his personal doctors, came forward and said, “We think that he is, in the end, permanently disabled, fully and permanently disabled.” The self-insured company, Kohler, hired its own experts to say that, “No. This is really — he healed a long time ago and he should be able to return to work.”

Frederica Freyberg:

Did your reporting find that the Walker Administration rejected workers’ comp claims more than in prior administrations?

Dee Hall:

It was a difficult thing. We were looking to see whether there was some imbalance because there were predictions back in 2013 when all three of the commissioners were Walker appointees that perhaps employers would have more favorable rulings. There’s a local attorney who did a study and he found that in fact between mid-2014 and mid-2016 that that was true in his assessment. He looked at every single case that was decided and found that overwhelmingly when decisions were reversed, they were reversed in favor of the employer.

Frederica Freyberg:

How does Wisconsin compare to other states in that regard?

Dee Hall:

I'm not sure about that. Each state has its own workers’ comp program. We were one of the first workers’ comp programs in the country over 100 years ago. And so it’s called the “Grand Bargain,” and it is that if someone is injured at work, rather than assigning blame and everybody getting their — calling their lawyers in and suing, what you’re supposed to be able to do as an injured worker is rely on your workplace to take care of you and of course then the employers rely on you being honest about your symptoms and the effects of your workplace injury. So for most people in our system, it works that way. It really does. But as it turns out, for some people, especially in these very high-cost cases like the Decker case, they feel that they were unfairly treated.

Frederica Freyberg:

So what kind of recourse does someone like Mr. Decker have, having been denied?

Dee Hall:

His case first went to an administrative law judge who declared that he was permanently and fully disabled. But then it was appealed to the Labor and Industry Review Commission. From there you can go to the circuit court, but their attorneys apparently advised them that that would probably not win.

Frederica Freyberg:

Takes us back a step, who pays into workers’ comp?

Dee Hall:

So the workers–so the employers get insurance for workers’ compensation and it depends — how much they pay depends on their claim history and the type of business that they are. And so it’s in businesses’ best interest to keep the claims down because then their premiums are down. So they are required, most businesses are required to be paying into the system.

Frederica Freyberg:

So with that said, do businesses in Wisconsin regard Wisconsin as friendly, you know, open for business in this way?

Dee Hall:

Well, I think that that was the prediction and I think that this one particular study — again, this is only one study and this was done by a person who represents injured workers. He used to represent companies and employers, but now he represents exclusively injured workers, so there will probably be some people who will say well, he’s biased. But he said he tried to look at things from both — because he’s been on both sides of these cases, to look at them as neutrally as he can. And there were several that he said really just broke his heart because he felt they were so wrongly decided.

Frederica Freyberg:

Has there been response and reaction from this commission or from the Walker Administration?

Dee Hall:

So the commission has a new chairperson and she issued a statement saying that there is no ideal proportion of pro-employer or pro-worker decisions. Every case should be decided on its merits individually and that to try to go about and prove that the commission is tilted one way or the other really is not useful. So she essentially says you have to judge each case individually and this particular look at it doesn’t do that.

Frederica Freyberg:

All right. Well, Dee Hall, thanks for your reporting.

Dee Hall:

Thanks for having me.