Frederica Freyberg:

In tonight’s inside look, divided state government on steroids. This week was a stark display of partisan power plays, or is it the new normal? We turn to our political panelists. Conservative Bill McCoshen and Liberal Scot Ross. Thank you for being here.

Bill McCoshen, Scot Ross:

Thanks for having us.

Frederica Freyberg:

First to you, Scott. Your reaction to the ouster of both Brad Pfaff and the special session that was not?

Scot Ross:

I think it’s just outrageous. It’s where the Republican Party of Wisconsin is right now because what you had if Brad Pfaff was an able servant who has been — he knows what it’s like to be a farmer. The guys’ a — you know, he grew up on a family farm. Worked there. And he’s worked helping farmers in Wisconsin for 25 years. He’s devoted his life to it. The fact they got rid of him was a complete and total power play. It was because the Republicans don’t like — you know, the industries that support the Republicans don’t like what Brad and the DATCP were doing related to siting, related to big agribusiness polluting our waters. And it’s very simple. They want to send a very strong message. And they did. They sent a message to farmers that they don’t care about farmers.

Frederica Freyberg:

Bill?

Bill McCoshen:

I think Scot and I are actually going to agree on one of his points that DATCP did not listen to farmers on this rule. Let me say this. Brad Pfaff’s a good man. I’ve known him a long time. I think what happened this week was unfortunate but it was preventable. I mean it really was. On the livestock siting rule, he had four chances to change this rule and the DATCP decided not to. The ag industry sent him a letter in August with specific concerns. They did nothing. Speaker Vos, Majority Leader Fitzgerald sent him a letter in September saying hey, if you don’t listen to farmers on this, we’re going to suspend the rule. He did nothing. Senator Nass, chairman of the Joint Committee for Review of Administrative Rules put out a statement saying, hey, if you don’t listen to farmers, we’re going to send this rule back. They did nothing. It wasn’t until last Friday when Majority Leader Fitzgerald said to the governor, hey, we don’t have the votes for Pfaff. He might be going down, that they finally withdrew those rules. If you’re ag secretary, you have one job. That’s to defend and promote the ag industry, period. That’s it. They chose environmental activists over farmers and it was a big mistake.

Frederica Freyberg:

On the gun special session, what do you make that?

Scot Ross:

Well, the Republicans simply are beholden to the NRA and they won’t do anything like pass common sense gun reform that, in this instance, 80% of the public supports. When it comes to universal background checks, when it comes to the extreme risk protection orders. These are things that 80% of the people support. And the Republicans simply will do nothing.

Frederica Freyberg:

And yet, Tony Evers knew that they weren’t going to go for this. He gets to now go ahead and put up statements about the 80%. He knew they weren’t going to go for it.

Scot Ross:

Well, again, the modern Republican Party is bought and paid for by the National Rifle Association so they are going to stand in the way no matter how many tragedies occur. No matter how much data-driven — that’s the thing about these two pieces of legislation. It’s data-driven that they work. The reduction in gun-related suicides in Indiana, 10 years after they put these measures in place, the ERPO, 7.5% reduction. I mean it’s very simple. It works.

Bill McCoshen:

Democratic governor in Minnesota, Tim Walz, had the same opportunity and he chose not to call a special session on guns because he knew he couldn’t get the bill through. I think the Evers Administration could have easily seen that this Legislature wasn’t going to pass the two bills he was promoting. And frankly, they put the governor in a bad spot. He looked weak this week, Frederica. He really did. You don’t have a governor sit on the state Senate floor for 2 and 1/2 hours watching one of his own cabinet secretaries go down. That was malpractice by the staff. You can’t have that. I worked for a governor for 10 years.

Frederica Freyberg:

That was pretty unusual to see him in the chambers.

Scot Ross:

Yeah, sure. I don’t think I could watch the Senate for 2 and 1/2 hours at this point, I can tell you that.

Frederica Freyberg:

Is there any amount of revenge politics in all of this?

Bill McCoshen:

I think it speaks to they have to figure out a way to work together. Remember, let’s go back to Tommy Thompson. Tommy Thompson got his biggest achievements: welfare reform and school choice when Democrats controlled both houses of the legislature. Why? He figured out how to work with the Democrats. Jim Doyle got things done with a Republican legislature. Scott McCallum got things done with a split legislature. This administration has to figure out how to work with the Republicans in the majority.

Frederica Freyberg:

Things are so different now though. So much more entrenched.

Scot Ross:

Yeah, I mean let’s talk about what happened last year. The lame duck attacks. The rule changes. Rejecting a secretary for the first time in modern history and now the stuff related to restricting the veto authority of the governor. These are all attacks by the Republicans who sat and did every single thing that Scott Walker wanted as governor and now they’re changing the rules because a Democrat won and they lost.

Frederica Freyberg:

How do you work together?

Bill McCoshen:

It’s a matter of finding the right person who can build the relationship with the majority leader, with the speakers. Start to cut small deals that lead to medium-sized deals that lead to bigger deals. You have to build trust. Right now, there’s no trust between the legislature and the administration.

Frederica Freyberg:

On the national level, what do you make of the Kentucky governor’s race that saw a Democrat win despite President Trump’s very best efforts?

Bill McCoshen:

I would say it’s a tiny win for Democrats. And here’s why. Matt Bevin was very unpopular. A month before the election, his job approval was in the 30s. I mean frankly the guy should not have run for re-election. Yet, Donald Trump went in there and helped him get to 49 and 1/2%. He lost by 10,000 votes out of a million and a half.

Frederica Freyberg:

It’s a win.

Bill McCoshen:

Well, more importantly down ticket, there were five other statewide races on Tuesday night and Republicans cleaned up on all of them. They won anywhere from 10 to 18% in all five of those other races. More importantly, those candidates got between 75,000 and 155,000 more votes than Bevin. So the Republicans came out on Tuesday night. They just didn’t like Bevin.

Scot Ross:

Democrats came out. I mean you saw — Trump won that state by 30 points. Look at Virginia where for the first time in a generation, the Democrats control all branches of government and have not lost a state —

Bill McCoshen:

Been turning blue for a while.

Scot Ross:

Have not lost a statewide race since 2009. In Mississippi, the Democrat came close to winning. Democrats win elections when Democratic voters go to the polls. It doesn’t matter whether it’s an off year or whether it’s a presidential election year. Democrats are motivated to go out there because of the corruption, because of the kleptocracy, because of the fealty to whatever Donald Trump wants by the Republican Party and they’re holding Republicans accountable.

Frederica Freyberg:

So you think that kind of a results is a bellwether for 2020?

Scot Ross:

I absolutely do but with a caveat. Democrats have to keep working. They have to keep working and talking to their base so their base goes out to the polls.

Bill McCoshen:

It is not a bellwether, not in Kentucky. Virginia, that’s been trending blue for a while. Trump didn’t last it time. Bush didn’t win it either time. So that was not a huge surprise. But I’ll tell you what, the one thing Republicans have to be careful of is they have lost 350 state — seats in the legislatures during Donald Trump’s administration. That’s half of as many as Obama lost at the same point in his presidency but it’s still something to be mindful of.

Frederica Freyberg:

Thanks very much. Bill and Scot, thanks.