Here & Now

Here & Now for February 28, 2020

Announcer:

A PBS Wisconsin original production. The following program is part of our “Here & Now” 2020 election coverage.

Frederica Freyberg:

I’m Frederica Freyberg. Tonight on “Here & Now,” State Attorney General Josh Kaul responds to this week’s mass shooting in Milwaukee. The state deputy health administrator is here. He’ll go over preparedness for a possible COVID-19 pandemic. An inside look at the latest results from the Marquette Law School poll. And McCoshen and Ross look ahead to Super Tuesday. It’s “Here & Now” for February 28.

Announcer:

Funding is provided by the Focus Fund for Journalism and Friends of PBS Wisconsin.

Frederica Freyberg:

Governor Tony Evers ordered flags to be flown at half-staff Thursday in honor of the shootings victims at the Molson Coors plant in Milwaukee a day earlier. Six people, including the gunman, 51-year-old Anthony Ferrill, died in the rampage that marked the 11th mass shooting in Wisconsin since 2004. The CEO of Molson Coors described the five victims as operators, machinists and electricians. The shooter was a current employee of the company. The Wisconsin Department of Justice is assisting Milwaukee authorities. From the State Capitol, we are joined now by Attorney General Josh Kaul and thanks very much for being here.

Josh Kaul:

Thanks for having me Frederica.

Frederica Freyberg:

First, what is your response and reaction to the shooting in Milwaukee?

Josh Kaul:

Well, these mass shootings that we keep seeing over and over again, they’re all awful and tragic. But it’s particularly gut wrenching when another of these mass shootings has happened here in Wisconsin. Our Department of Justice has been involved in the response to this shooting. Our Division of Criminal Investigation responded shortly after the shooting took place and our Office of Crime Victim Services is going to be available to assist those who’ve been impacted. My heart goes out to employees at Molson Coors and everybody who’s been impacted by this.

Frederica Freyberg:

What can you tell us about the ongoing investigation into such things as motive or where the gun came from or whether there were any red flags about the gunman?

Josh Kaul:

As you said, the investigation is ongoing, but there are a lot of law enforcement personnel who responded to the scene and who are involved in the response to this, including investigating some of the issues that you just talked about. As we learn more, we’re going to make that information available to the public so that people know as much as they can about what led to this tragic incident.

Frederica Freyberg:

On other matters, your justice department has just signed on to an agreement with the largest generic opioid manufacturer in U.S. What will that mean for Wisconsin?

Josh Kaul:

A big part of our strategy for responding to the opioid epidemic is to make sure that we are holding those who are responsible for the epidemic accountable. That includes any drug companies that engaged in false and deceptive marketing practices. This agreement is going to be part of that effort. It’s going to mean that more resources are coming to the state of Wisconsin and I’m going to do what I can to make sure that those resources go where they should, which is to help fight the opioid epidemic through support for treatment, support for prevention and support for enforcement efforts.

Frederica Freyberg:

Any understanding yet as to how much of the settlement under the agreement would come to Wisconsin?

Josh Kaul:

We don’t have specifics yet. The total value of the agreement is estimated to be about $1.6 billion nationwide. So there will be millions of dollars coming to Wisconsin as a result of that agreement. It’s also important to note that that’s one of the companies that was involved in opioid manufacture, but there are certainly other companies that were involved and distributors that were involved and in my view in contributing to this epidemic. So this is one part of that broader effort to hold those pharmaceutical companies accountable.

Frederica Freyberg:

One of those might be Purdue Pharma, the manufacturer of OxyContin. Where does that case stand?

Josh Kaul:

Last year we filed suit against two Purdue Pharma entities as well as Richard Sackler who was the former president and co-chair of the board. Purdue Pharma has declared bankruptcy and there are bankruptcy proceedings ongoing right now. Some states entered into a proposed settlement. Wisconsin did not join that proposed settlement. I don’t think it goes far enough to hold members of the Sackler family accountable. But again, we are trying to maximize the recovery for the state of Wisconsin so that we can get resources to communities to help them fight this epidemic.

Frederica Freyberg:

You’ve also joined a multistate investigation of Juul labs, which makes e-cigarettes for vaping. What exactly is being investigated?

Josh Kaul:

We’ve seen a dramatic increase in the last few years in e-cigarette use among young people. I think if you talk to most parents of kids who are in high school and even some middle school students, certainly teachers at high schools and middle schools, you’ll hear about just how widespread this has become. That’s a real danger for the health of kids here in Wisconsin and across the country. What we’re going to be doing is looking in to see whether there were any false or deceptive marketing or sales practices that contributed to this epidemic. Also to see whether there was targeting of young people through the advertising that Juul was doing. If we do find that that sort of improper marketing and sales process was going on, we’re going to take steps to hold them accountable.

Frederica Freyberg:

Lastly and briefly, with about a minute left, what is your response to the state legislature not passing the sexual assault backlog bill?

Josh Kaul:

It was incredibly disappointing to see how the legislature responded to that. Years ago, Wisconsin identified thousands of untested sexual assault kits. What that backlog has meant is justice was delayed in some cases for survivors and people who committed a dangerous offense remained on the streets longer than they should have. We announced a conviction just within the last few months of somebody who had a kit — there’s a kit collected in his case about 20 years ago and he went on to commit two more assaults in part because that kit wasn’t tested and he wasn’t prosecuted. We need to make sure there’s never another backlog of untested sexual assault kits in Wisconsin again. We had bipartisan support for that in the Senate. But unfortunately politics got in the way of it getting passed in the Assembly. I’m going to keep fighting to get that legislation passed.

Frederica Freyberg:

All right. We need to leave it there. Josh Kaul, thanks very much for joining us.

Josh Kaul:

Thanks for having me, Frederica.

Frederica Freyberg:

Disruption to everyday life may be severe. That’s according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention this week in declaring that the novel coronavirus or COVID-19, has potential to spread widely in the U.S. In tonight’s closer look, federal health officials warn that schools could be closed, mass public gatherings suspended and businesses forced to have employees work remotely. What is Wisconsin doing to prepare? We turn to the Deputy Administrator of the State Department of Health Services Chuck Warzecha. Thanks for being here.

Chuck Warzecha:

Thanks for having me and thanks for your continued coverage of this important topic.

Frederica Freyberg:

The CDC further says that now is the time for businesses, hospitals, communities, schools and everyday people, they say, to begin preparing. So what does all of that look like in Wisconsin?

Chuck Warzecha:

So I think the key moment that we’re looking at is that the potential for this disease to become transmitted widely in our communities, we’ve shifted to becoming prepared for that from just watching it and trying to prevent it from coming into our communities. We’re reaching a point where the potential and the likelihood is that it could. So we’re asking people think through what they would do, how they might socially isolate, how we might encourage people to think about what kinds of mass gatherings are happening where transmission could be a problem and then again making sure we’re making good decisions based on risk. We know that some folks have already signaled that they’re making those decisions even without that risk in the community and we want to make sure that we get ahead of that as well.

Frederica Freyberg:

And so if people were making those decisions on their own not to attend, you know, big concerts or something like that, should the public actually expect the public health infrastructure to tell us when the point has come?

Chuck Warzecha:

Yes. In fact, when people make those decisions, it’s usually because they don’t know there is help. We want to make sure that folks when they’re starting to wonder what they should do, make that contact particularly with their local public health agency. In Wisconsin we’ve got really strong public health support at the local level.

Frederica Freyberg:

Now, with Wisconsin having just a single positive case, it really seems hard to understand how a wild spread of COVID-19 could happen here. How could it?

Chuck Warzecha:

It’s like the H1N1 virus if you remember from about ten or so years ago. When that first arrived on the scene, its starts in some areas but like influenza, this has the potential to spread fairly rapidly. We watched that happen in China from the early stages of this outbreak to broader community spread. That can happen quickly with any respiratory virus that circulates in the community.

Frederica Freyberg:

Are there new guidances for people getting it from other people in terms of testing? Do you still have to have come from a place like China where it is widespread to be tested or is that being expanded as well?

Chuck Warzecha:

That is actually being expanded. In fact as recently as yesterday, we’re getting updated guidance from the CDC on that. The CDC, World Health Organization and others are monitoring what’s happening around the globe and that’s changing what we’re giving out in advice for travelers as well as how we’re considering people’s risk levels when people come back into the country, and whether or not they’ve had symptoms. Whether they’ve had contact with someone who’s travelled from some of the higher-risk regions. We expect that to continue to change as this develops and evolves at the global level.

Frederica Freyberg:

Are cases under investigation in Wisconsin at this moment expanding?

Chuck Warzecha:

No. Actually, we currently have had 17 cases under — persons under investigation. That’s been the case for some time. We currently have no pending cases. So all but one of those was negative and then that one case you mentioned earlier is our only positive case that we’ve had.

Frederica Freyberg:

I understand that the CDC says it has now kind of fixed the test kits that can be sent out to states. Has Wisconsin received its test kits? And when do you expect that to happen?

Chuck Warzecha:

So I know our State Laboratory of Hygiene has been working with the CDC on getting that test up and running. I can’t forecast when that will happen. I expect it will be relatively soon, within a week or two at the very longest. We are very fortunate in Wisconsin to have a very high-quality State Laboratory of Hygiene.

Frederica Freyberg:

Given the issues in China with this, are there supply chain problems in terms of getting even pharmaceuticals or equipment or the protective gear that we need here?

Chuck Warzecha:

So from a personal protective equipment standpoint, yes. FDA just sent a message out I think even this morning announcing they don’t have an ongoing shortage of pharmaceuticals at this point, so I’m not sure I’ve heard an update on that. But from the standpoint of personal protective equipment, face masks, gowns, things like that, yeah, we definitely are seeing challenges in the supply chain and that’s an area that we’re working on guidance on as well to make sure that we can give people alternative recommendations, we can give guidance on conservation until the supply chain can be restabilized and also maybe make a pitch that everyone get their flu shot, because that is circulating in the community at a high level and that puts stress on the same health care system that we need to be prepared for this virus.

Frederica Freyberg:

All right. Chuck Warzecha, thanks very much for joining us with your information.

Chuck Warzecha:

Thanks for having me.

Frederica Freyberg:

Now to state politics and the fate of a Republican tax cut plan that passed both Houses of the legislature last week. The bill used state surplus dollars to lower income and business taxes while bringing down the debt. It had a short life span. That’s because Governor Tony Evers killed the bill with a veto on Tuesday. Appearing at a Wauwatosa school, Evers said the bill should have used surplus money to boost school aid.

Tony Evers:

Folks, this is — the sustainability of this is not possible. We have to start investing in our kids and our schools. And to be clear, we don’t have to choose between investing in our kids and reducing property taxes. We can do both at the same time.

Frederica Freyberg:

Republican leadership fired back at Governor Evers after his tax cut veto. Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald said in a statement, “While I’m disappointed in the governor’s actions, I’m not surprised. This is the second income tax cut he’s vetoed as governor. His budget proposal last summer included over $1 billion in tax hikes. Republicans in the legislature will continue to hold the line against his far left agenda,” he said.

A Wisconsin appeals court today struck down an Ozaukee County judge’s ruling that purged thousands of people from state voter rolls because they were tagged as having changed address. The appellate court also reversed the lower court’s ruling finding state election officials in contempt for not immediately removing the voters.

Speaking of state election officials, in trying to make sure the Wisconsin election coming up in a little more than a month is secure, the Wisconsin Elections Commission late this week threatened to publicly shame six unnamed communities across the state if they don’t upgrade outdated computer systems that could put them at risk for hacking. The commission made more than $1 million available to clerks to upgrade their computers but not all of them took advantage of the money.

Mark Thomsen:

I said this before. I do not like the way we address our weaknesses. I think we have to know who they are. We have to disclose it and we have to get over this myth that somehow keeping that a secret actually creates security.

Frederica Freyberg:

The commission wants the upgrades to happen before the April 7 presidential primary and Supreme Court election or the communities will be publicly named. For more on this story and others, go to PBSwisconsin.org and click on news.

Meanwhile, Wisconsin is “feeling The Bern.” In tonight’s inside look, the new Marquette Law School poll has Bernie Sanders in a double digit lead against Democratic primary challengers in Wisconsin. We check in with Poll Director Charles Franklin. Thanks very much for being here.

Charles Franklin:

Good to be here.

Frederica Freyberg:

Well, so your polling shows a 29% favor Sanders, 17% Bloomberg, 15% Biden, 13% Buttigieg, 11% Klobuchar and 9% Warren. Things really have changed since your last poll for Joe Biden.

Charles Franklin:

That’s right. And what’s happened between those two is Iowa and New Hampshire. We were finishing up polling after Nevada voted so mostly this is before that. But that’s a 10 point bump up for Sanders. It’s the first time he’s led in the polls we’ve been doing almost monthly since August. It’s also a fall for Biden. He had led each previous poll and now falls not even to second, but to third place. Mike Bloomentha — Bloomberg, sorry, who has been down in single digits, bumps up into second place. And finally Elizabeth Warren, who had been in the top tier of candidates, has fallen off to now sixth place.

Frederica Freyberg:

Another question in your poll showed that the three top Democratic picks also have like these really high unfavorables. Is this like holding your nose and voting?

Charles Franklin:

Well, there are two sides to this. Among just Democratic voters, most of them are seen pretty favorable. The one exception is Bloomberg. But among the entire electorate, all of them, with the exception of Amy Klobuchar, are more negatively viewed than Donald Trump is, which is sort of a surprise. But the reason is that Republicans are completely united in liking Trump and disliking all of the Democrats. But within the Democratic Party, between 20% and 25% have unfavorable views of their own candidates. The reason is that they have a first choice and that person gets 90% favorability, but then they have reservations about the other Democratic candidates. It will probably come together once there’s a nominee. But right now it’s holding down Democratic favorability.

Frederica Freyberg:

So another question you asked was whether or not people had made up their minds, and you found that 56% of Democratic respondents say they might change their mind. Is that a high number at this time?

Charles Franklin:

It’s kind of high. It’s been coming down gradually over the last four months. So it may be high, but it’s less high than it was a little while ago. Also, remember, we are so early in the process really of voting. South Carolina and then Super Tuesday and then more March events will all affect who is still a candidate by the time we vote in April. So in that sense, it may be realistic for Democrats to say I could change my mind because I don’t actually know who will still be a viable candidate.

Frederica Freyberg:

Would a big win for Biden in South Carolina change the trajectory of this thing?

Charles Franklin:

It’s hard to say. It’s clear that if he loses South Carolina or just barely ekes out a win that puts his campaign in real trouble for doing well on Super Tuesday. A strong finish, though, gives him the opportunity to do well. But it’s unclear whether it would propel victory on Super Tuesday. So more of a risk on the downside.

Frederica Freyberg:

The age of Bernie Sanders’ backers has changed a little bit in this latest survey. 18 to 29-year-olds still by far the biggest supporters. But the older set is kind of warming up to him.

Charles Franklin:

I think that’s an important point. He has always, in 2016 as well as this year, done way better with younger voters and fallen off quite a bit with older voters. But in this February poll we see him cracking 20% support and above with some of the older voters. That’s something he had not done before. And it shows that his rise this month is coming across the age spectrum in every group that’s more support than it was a month ago.

Frederica Freyberg:

As for Republican respondents, your polling showed they think Bloomberg is the biggest threat to Trump. You also found 10% of Republicans expect to cross over in the primary and vote for who?

Charles Franklin:

Well, that’s an interesting question. With just 10%, it’s hard to know. There’s just not enough cases to have much of an idea. Some of those people may be anti-Trump Republicans who are crossing over. Some may be crossing over to make mischief in the other party. And finally let’s remember, we have an open primary law here.

Frederica Freyberg:

Right.

Charles Franklin:

It’s every citizen’s right to vote in whichever primary they want to vote in. They don’t have to be predeclared as a Republican or a Democrat.

Frederica Freyberg:

On head to head match ups, Sanders is the only one who slightly edges Trump, all the rest are pretty even. But Biden had a nine-point lead the last time.

Charles Franklin:

Yeah. One of the things that shifted here is that he, Biden, had led against Trump in all but one of our polls this fall. Sometimes close, sometimes not so close. But now tied. Sanders has been just barely ahead of Trump in most and behind in one and that’s basically where he is right now. I think the bottom line, though, is that the November race is super close.

Frederica Freyberg:

Yep.

Charles Franklin:

All of these are inside the margin of error. It’s a long, long ways to November.

Frederica Freyberg:

All right. Charles Franklin, thanks very much.

Charles Franklin:

Thank you.

Frederica Freyberg:

This programming note. State Supreme Court candidates Daniel Kelly and Jill Karofsky will face off in a PBS Wisconsin/Wisconsin Public Radio debate on Friday night, March 27. WPR’s Shawn Johnson will join me to co-moderate the one-hour live event. That is 7 to 8 pm Friday night, March 27.

It’s the March madness of the presidential primary race. As we mentioned, Super Tuesday is next week. That’s when 14 states, including our neighbors in Minnesota, put well over 1,000 delegates on the line. It can be either a game-changer or a deal-breaker for Democrats running to be their party’s nominee for president. Our political panelists of course already know exactly what will happen and that’s why we invited Bill McCoshen and Scot Ross on the show tonight to take a look ahead to Super Tuesday. And thank you for being here.

Bill McCoshen:

Thanks for having us.

Scot Ross:

We’re supposed to be lowering expectations. That’s the first rule of politics so you’re bound to succeed.

Bill McCoshen:

Primaries are all about expectations. You gotta lower them.

Frederica Freyberg:

You first, Scot. Prediction on first South Carolina and then Super Tuesday.

Scot Ross:

I think Vice President Biden takes South Carolina. It think it will be tighter than we had expected it to be given that that was such a firewall for him. And then on Super Tuesday, again, like you said, 1300 delegates, 40% of them out. I think it’s not unrealistic that Senator Sanders takes 40% of those delegates. I think a couple things are going to happen after that. I think Pete and Amy are going to have to decide whether they can go on. I think it’s going to be a tough road for Elizabeth Warren if she doesn’t make some progress. Bloomberg can obviously spend all of his money until the end. So it’s going to be interesting to see what happens.

Frederica Freyberg:

Bill?

Bill McCoshen:

So primary is about expectations, right? Biden is expected to win tomorrow. But the size of the victory is going to matter. If he wins by two, three, four points, he might as well lose. He’s going to need a double-digit victory in South Carolina to hopefully get any momentum out of that but I think it’s ultimately going to be a pyrrhic victory for him. He went all in on South Carolina. He left New Hampshire early to get to South Carolina to begin this. I don’t see his path on Super Tuesday. There’s 14 states up. He’s not leading in any of them. If he gets a small bump on Saturday night, can that really catapult him onto Sunday or Super Tuesday? I don’t see it. I think this is Bernie’s race to lose.

Frederica Freyberg:

No withstanding all of that, do we foresee a brokered convention?

Bill McCoshen:

We may. I mean Michael Bloomberg has spent the most in the Super Tuesday states. That’s the first day he’s going to be on the ballot in any of these states. He’s spent tens of millions of dollars. Bernie Sanders has spent the second most. Amy Klobuchar, believe it or not, has spent the third most in the Super Tuesday states. Biden is four times less than Amy Klobuchar on those states. I’m with Scot. I don’t know how Amy or Elizabeth or even Pete go on after Tuesday. And frankly, if Biden doesn’t win half of those 14 states, I think he’s done too.

Frederica Freyberg:

Brokered though?

Scot Ross:

Absolutely not. I mean the Democrats will make the decision and whoever it is will go on to defeat Donald Trump. That’s the good news. All the leading Democrats can defeat Donald Trump because this election’s going to be a referendum on him.

Frederica Freyberg:

At this point, is it true that the Democrats really do not like Bernie Sanders?

Scot Ross:

No, I don’t think so. I think there are people who have hard feelings about 2016. But listen. This is a primary with a lot of people in it. I’ve been in primaries. Bill, you’ve worked on primaries. They can be nasty fights. The most important thing is do you come together at the end. I think all signals are Democrats will reunite at the end because they want to defeat Donald Trump.

Frederica Freyberg:

Do you think it’s real, Scot, that Bernie Sanders might pick Tammy Baldwin as his running mate?

Scot Ross:

I think it would be an excellent choice for whoever is the nominee to nominate Senator Baldwin. She hasn’t lost. Wisconsin is going to decide this election. And she’s a terrific, terrific politician and a terrific senator. It would be an absolute win for the ticket.

Bill McCoshen:

I don’t think it’s out of the question. I don’t. She fits the bill. She’s progressive. She’s done exceptionally well here in Wisconsin. This is going to be a crucial state. I think she has appeal in Minnesota, Iowa and Michigan. I wouldn’t rule her out as a possibility, that’s for sure.

Frederica Freyberg:

Is it true that the Republicans most fear Bloomberg?

Bill McCoshen:

I think they fear a centrist and that doesn’t appear to be the direction the Democrats are going unless they can find a way to coalesce either around Biden and save his campaign or around Bloomberg which was fatally hurt during the Nevada debate. That might turn out to be the biggest tactical mistake of any campaign this cycle, was putting him in a position to get slaughtered. I would have never done that.

Scot Ross:

And who prosecuted that? Elizabeth Warren.

Frederica Freyberg:

So what happened to Elizabeth Warren in all of this?

Scot Ross:

I think there are a lot of folks who are in financial industry who know that Elizabeth Warren could take them apart piece by piece if she is the president of the United States. She knows what she is doing. I think there’s a part of it. I also think sexism. I worked for several women who ran for statewide office only 15 years ago and sexism was rampant. I think that absolutely plays into it.

Frederica Freyberg:

You think that’s what it’s about with Elizabeth Warren?

Bill McCoshen:

I think she lacks authenticity. She hit her ceiling back in October when she was in the lead in lot of national polls. She’s progressively dropped since then. I don’t see a path for her and she’s not going to get any wins either tomorrow in South Carolina or on Super Tuesday.

Frederica Freyberg:

We will be watching. Thanks to both of you.

Bill McCoshen:

You bet.

Scot Ross:

Thank you.

Frederica Freyberg:

That is our program for tonight. I’m Frederica Freyberg. Have a great weekend.

Announcer:

For more “Here & Now” 2020 coverage, go to PBSwisconsin.org and click on news. Funding is provided by the Focus Fund for Journalism and Friends of PBS Wisconsin.