FREDERICA FREYBERG:

ADVOCATES FOR LOW-INCOME RECIPIENTS OF FOODSHARE ARE CONCERNED THE PROPOSALS OUT OF THE CAPITOL WILL LEAVE DESERVING PEOPLE HUNGRY. SHERRIE TUSSLER IS EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE HUNGER TASK FORCE IN MILWAUKEE, AND THANKS VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US.

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

GLAD TO BE HERE.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WELL, SO WHEN COUPLED WITH PROPOSALS TO DRUG TEST RECIPIENTS OF FOODSHARE AND WORK REQUIREMENTS TO RECEIVE BENEFITS, WHAT’S YOUR REACTION TO THESE LATEST PIECES OF LEGISLATION?

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

ALL THE LEGISLATION IS GOING TO REDUCE THE FOODSTAMP ROLLS, BUT IT REALLY ISN’T GOING TO HELP ALLEVIATE HUNGER OR EMPLOY PEOPLE. SO OUR CONCERN IS THAT IT REALLY ISN’T HELPING OUR COMMUNITIES HERE IN WISCONSIN AND THAT THE LEGISLATION IS IMPROPERLY INFORMED.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

NOW, ON ONE OF THE BILLS THAT WAS PASSED THIS PAST WEEK IN MADISON, IT REQUIRES A PHOTO ON THE QUEST CARD THAT FOOD SHARE RECIPIENTS USE AT THE GROCERY STORE. YOU TAKE ISSUE WITH THAT. WHY?

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

WELL, TO BEGIN WITH, I’M A TAXPAYER AND IT COSTS $7.4 MILLION TO TAKE EVERYBODY’S PICTURE AND PUT THEIR PICTURE ON THE CARD ITSELF. THE INTENT IS TO REDUCE FRAUD, BUT THE PROBLEM IS IT WON’T REDUCE ANY FRAUD. THE LEGISLATION ITSELF REMOVED THE REQUIREMENT TO CHECK THE PHOTO ID, WHICH WAS ORIGINALLY IN THE LEGISLATION, AND THE FOODSTAMP CARD ITSELF ISN’T SOMETHING THAT PEOPLE GIVE TO OTHER PEOPLE. IT’S LIKE YOUR DEBIT CARD OR YOUR CREDIT CARD. IT HAS A PIN. AND SO HAVING A PHOTO ON YOUR DEBIT OR CREDIT CARD ISN’T NECESSARY, NOR SHOULD IT BE FOR A FOODSTAMP CARD. AND WITHOUT CHECKING IT AT THE GROCERY STORE LEVEL OR UNDERSTANDING THAT IT REQUIRES A PIN TO USE, YOU COULD UNDERSTAND THAT THERE’S NO NEED TO HAVE YOUR PHOTO ON IT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

ON THE FOODSHARE CARD REPLACEMENT MEASURE, WHAT IS, THOUGH, THE POSSIBLE EXPLANATION FOR SOMEONE REPLACING THEIR CARD MORE THAN FOUR TIMES A YEAR? A 2012 AUDIT SHOWED SOME RECIPIENTS WERE GETTING TEN OR MORE REPLACEMENT CARDS, AND SO THE PREMISE IS THAT THESE PEOPLE ARE TRADING IN THESE CARDS, SELLING THEM OR OTHERWISE, YOU KNOW, COMMITTING FRAUD.

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

THE CARD IS ASSOCIATED WITH YOU AND IT HAS A PIN. AND SO I CAN’T TRADE MY CARD WITHOUT GIVING OUT MY PIN AND THEREFORE GIVING OUT MY ABILITY TO USE IT NEXT MONTH. AND SO IF SOMEONE’S REQUESTING MULTIPLE REPLACEMENT CARDS, IT’S PROBABLY BECAUSE THEY’RE HOMELESS, THEY HAVE A COGNITIVE IMPAIRMENT OR A SERIOUS MENTAL ILLNESS.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

NOW, YOU ALSO CITE CONCERNS ABOUT A 2013 BUDGET PROVISION THAT REQUIRES ABLE-BODIED ADULTS TO WORK OR DO JOB TRAINING FOR 20 HOURS A WEEK TO QUALIFY FOR FOODSHARE BEYOND THREE MONTHS, AND YOU’VE BEEN TRACKING THAT. WHAT HAVE YOU FOUND?

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

WE FOUND SO FAR USING THE DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH SERVICES’ DATA FROM THE STATE OF WISCONSIN THAT HERE IN MILWAUKEE COUNTY, 55% OF THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN ENROLLED IN THE EMPLOYMENT AND TRAINING PROGRAM HAVE HAD THEIR FOODSTAMP CASE CLOSED FOR THE NEXT THREE YEARS, AND ONLY 7% OF THE PEOPLE HAVE RECEIVED EMPLOYMENT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WELL, SO WHY CAN’T THESE ABLE-BODIED RECIPIENTS COMPLY WITH THE WORKER TRAINING REQUIREMENT?

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

I THINK SOME OF THE CHALLENGES ARE WHETHER OR NOT THERE IS EITHER WORK OR TRAINING PROVIDED. THEY’RE ACTUALLY JUST TOLD TO GO GET A JOB AND THEN THEY ARE TOLD TO REPORT THEIR EFFORTS TO GET A JOB. IF THEY COULD GET A JOB, THEY PROBABLY WOULD HAVE ONE ALREADY. WE HAVE HIGH LEVELS OF UNEMPLOYMENT IN MANY NEIGHBORHOODS HERE IN THE CITY OF MILWAUKEE AS WE DO IN RURAL AREAS ACROSS THE STATE OF WISCONSIN. TELLING SOMEONE TO GET A JOB DOESN’T HELP THEM GET A JOB. HELPING THEM GET A JOB, HELPING THEM GET THE TRAINING THEY NEED TO QUALIFY FOR FULL TIME EMPLOYMENT, THAT’S WHAT GETS THEM THE JOB. AND THE JOB TRAINING ORGANIZATIONS ARE NOT PROVIDING THOSE SERVICES.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

AND SO YOU HAVE INTERACTION WITH THESE PEOPLE, SOME OF THEM. WHAT HAVE YOU HEARD FROM THEM ABOUT THE RESTRICTIONS AND REQUIREMENTS THAT THEY’RE BEING FACED WITH?

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

PEOPLE FEEL THAT THEY ARE BEING PUT UNDULY THROUGH REQUIREMENTS THAT OTHER PEOPLE WOULD NOT HAVE TO BE PUT THROUGH TO EAT EVERY SINGLE DAY. PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED THAT THE WORK IS FORCED WORK AND THAT THE WORK DOESN’T PAY. PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED THAT THEY CAN’T EAT ANYMORE AND THEY’RE STANDING IN LINES AT SOUP KITCHENS AND HOMELESS SHELTERS ACROSS THE CITY.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE THE LEGISLATORS IN MADISON WHO ARE FASHIONING THIS LEGISLATION TO KNOW ABOUT WHAT IT’S LIKE ON THE GROUND?

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

I THINK THAT THEY SHOULD UNDERSTAND THAT THEY’RE CREATING HUNGER IN MILWAUKEE. THEY’RE CREATING HUNGER IN WISCONSIN. AND IN WISCONSIN WE HAVE ENOUGH FOOD FOR EVERYONE. WE ACTUALLY GROW FOOD AND SEND IT TO OTHER PLACES. AND SO IT DOESN’T MAKE SENSE THAT WE WOULD MAKE SOME PEOPLE HUNGRY BECAUSE THEY CAN’T FIND A JOB. AND HUNGER CLEARLY IS NOT GOING TO MOTIVATE YOU TO GET EMPLOYED.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT ABOUT THE ADMITTEDLY, I THINK, COMPARED TO THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT’S BEING SPENT ON THESE BENEFITS, THERE IS SOME FRAUD. WHAT ABOUT THAT? YOU THINK THAT’S JUST THE KIND OF COST OF DOING BUSINESS?

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

THE FRAUD THAT IS PRESENT IS .07% OF THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF FOODSTAMP BENEFITS ISSUED IN THE STATE. AND OUR OWN LEGISLATIVE AUDIT BUREAU REPORTED ON THAT MORE THAN THREE YEARS TO THE LEGISLATURE. THEY UNDERSTAND WHAT THE LEVEL OF FRAUD IS. IT’S JUST THAT THEY’RE LOOKING FOR SOMETHING THAT DOESN’T EXIST BECAUSE THEY WANT TO BELIEVE THAT POOR PEOPLE ARE DOING HARM TO OTHER PEOPLE BY ACCEPTING HELP FROM GOVERNMENT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

ALL RIGHT. WE NEED TO LEAVE IT THERE. SHERRIE TUSSLER, THANKS VERY MUCH.

SHERRIE TUSSLER:

THANK YOU.