A NATIONAL EXPERT IN COMMUNITY POLICING, FORMER MADISON POLICE CHIEF NOBLE WRAY IS LEADING THE FEDERAL POLICING PRACTICES AND ACCOUNTABILITY INITIATIVE NATIONWIDE. HE JOINS US NOW FROM WASHINGTON. AND CHIEF WRAY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

NOBLE WRAY:

THANK YOU.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

TELL US WHAT IS THE GOAL OF THIS INITIATIVE NATIONWIDE?

NOBLE WRAY:

THE GOAL OF THIS INITIATIVE NATIONWIDE IS THIS, VERY SHORT. THE OFFICE OF COMMUNITY-ORIENTED POLICING IS STILL RESPONSIBLE FOR MOVING FORWARD THE MISSION OF COMMUNITY-ORIENTED POLICING. THIS INITIATIVE REALLY FOCUSES ON REFORMS AND ORGANIZATIONAL TRANSFORMATION BY USING SOME OF THE BEST PRACTICES IN THE FIELD, BRINGING IN EXPERTS AND WORKING WITH DEPARTMENTS TO BUILD TRUST AND TO REFORM BASED UPON THOSE BEST PRACTICES IN THE FIELD.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHY IS YOUR OFFICE WORKING IN MILWAUKEE RIGHT NOW?

NOBLE WRAY:

WITH THIS COLLABORATIVE REFORM, WE WERE CALLED IN. IT IS A VOLUNTARY PROCESS. ALTHOUGH VOLUNTARY, THERE ARE CERTAIN THINGS THAT WE DO ASK. WE DO ASK FOR FULL COOPERATION OF THE POLICE DEPARTMENT, POLICE CHIEF, THE LEADERSHIP. IT WORKS WELL WHEN WE HAVE LOCAL GOVERNMENT THAT IS SUPPORTIVE AND A VERY INVOLVED AND ENGAGED COMMUNITY. BY WAY OF EXAMPLE, WE HELD A LISTENING SESSION IN MILWAUKEE REGARDING THE START OF THE COLLABORATIVE REFORM TO SEEK INPUT. AND WE HAVE THE LARGEST NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT SHOWED UP FOR THAT. WE HAD ABOUT 700, 800 PEOPLE SHOW UP AT A COMMUNITY MEETING IN MILWAUKEE.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

SO WE SAW IN A PREVIOUS VIDEO CLIP AT THE FIRST COMMUNITY MEETING IN MILWAUKEE, IS THAT THE ONE YOU ARE REFERENCING WHERE THOSE HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE SHOWED UP?

NOBLE WRAY:

YES, THAT IS THE ONE I WAS REFERRING TO.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHEN WE WERE THERE, WE SAW A LOT OF ANGER AGAINST THE POLICE DEPARTMENT BEING EXPRESSED AND COMMENTS ON THE PART OF THE PEOPLE FROM THE CITY THERE. WHAT DOES JUSTICE DO WITH THOSE COMMENTS?

NOBLE WRAY:

WELL, IT’S NOT UNCOMMON TO — FOR COMMUNITY MEMBERS TO EXPRESS HOW THEY FEEL. THE CONCERNS THAT THEY HAVE WITH THEIR DEPARTMENT. WHAT WE DO AND THE REASON WHY WE INTENTIONALLY HAVE THAT MEETING IS TO GET INPUT FROM THE COMMUNITY. AND IT HELPS US TO INFORM THE PROCESS ITSELF. AT SOME POINT IN TIME, THAT INFORMATION WILL BE PART OF A SET OF FINDINGS AND RECOMMENDATIONS THAT WE WILL PROVIDE TO NOT ONLY THE DEPARTMENT, BUT THE COMMUNITY IN A VERY TRANSPARENT WAY. SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT WERE RAISED THERE WERE ISSUES LIKE CONCERNS ABOUT SEARCH AND STOPS. AS WELL AS THINGS LIKE, YOU KNOW, REALLY WHAT DO THEY EXPECT FROM THE POLICING IN TERMS OF BUILDING TRUST, COMMUNITY POLICING, USE OF FORCE. THERE ARE A WHOLE HOST OF ISSUES THAT WERE DISCUSSED THERE. THAT WILL BE PART OF OUR VERY DETAILED AND COMPREHENSIVE ASSESSMENT THAT WILL BE GIVEN BACK TO THE DEPARTMENT AND THE COMMUNITY IN SET OF FINDINGS AND RECOMMENDATIONS.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

I KNOW THAT REBUILDING TRUST BETWEEN CITIZENS AND POLICE DEPARTMENTS IS THE AIM. WHAT CAN YOU TELL ME ABOUT WHETHER YOU THINK THIS MIGHT BE A HEAVIER LIFT IN MILWAUKEE THAN IN OTHER CITIES WHERE THIS PROCESS IS ALSO ON GOING? I DON’T KNOW IF HAVING MORE PEOPLE THERE THAT YOU’VE HAD AT OTHER COMMUNITY SESSIONS SAYS ANYTHING ABOUT MILWAUKEE. IS IT A HEAVIER LIFT?

NOBLE WRAY:

WELL, CLEARLY IT IS PROBABLY HEAVIER FROM THE STANDPOINT THAT MILWAUKEE IS A MAJOR CITY. WE DO HAVE OTHER MAJOR CITIES AS PART OF THIS COLLABORATIVE REFORM PROCESS- PHILADELPHIA, SAN FRANCISCO. SO IT DOES REQUIRE MORE WORK ON THE GROUND. MILWAUKEE HAS A LONG HISTORY OF CHALLENGES THAT IT HAS FACED BETWEEN THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN COMMUNITY IN PARTICULAR AND ITS DEPARTMENT. BUT WE THINK THAT IF YOU HAVE GOOD SOLID LEADERSHIP, YOU HAVE CITIZEN PARTICIPATION LOOKING AND MAKING SURE THAT THEY ARE STAYING INVOLVED IN THE PROCESS, WE LIKE TO SAY TO THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE THE COURT OF PUBLIC OPINION WILL HOLD ITS DEPARTMENT ACCOUNTABLE. THAT’S WHY WHEN WE RELEASE A SERIES [OF REPORTS] ON MILWAUKEE, THE ASSESSMENT AND THEN A PROGRESS REPORT AND THEN ANOTHER REPORT AFTER APPROXIMATELY TWO YEARS, ALL OF THIS WILL BE MADE PUBLIC. AND BECAUSE WE’VE IDENTIFIED ISSUES THAT BOTH INSIDE THE DEPARTMENT AND OUTSIDE OF THE DEPARTMENT REALLY THINKS ARE IMPORTANT AND KEY ISSUES AND THEY WILL BE — EVERYONE TO BE ABLE TO SEE, WE THINK THAT THIS PROCESS WILL WORK IN MILWAUKEE. IT HAS WORKED. WE’VE SEEN PROMISING RESULTS IN OTHER CITIES. AND SO WE THINK THIS WAS SUITABLE FOR MILWAUKEE AT THIS TIME.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

CAN YOU YET TELL US ANYTHING THAT YOU’VE IDENTIFIED IN MILWAUKEE?

NOBLE WRAY:

YES, SOME OF THE GOALS AND OBJECTIVES THAT WE’LL BE LOOKING AT. WE’LL BE LOOKING AT EVERYTHING FROM RECRUITMENT, HIRING, TO THEIR OPERATIONAL APPROACH TO COMMUNITY-ORIENTED POLICING. THEIR PHILOSOPHICAL APPROACH TO COMMUNITY-ORIENTED POLICING. AS I MENTIONED BEFORE, THEIR PEDESTRIAN AND TRAFFIC STOPS. USE OF FORCE, WHICH WAS A MAJOR ISSUE AT THOSE COMMUNITY MEETINGS. HOW PEOPLE FELT ABOUT HOW THEY WERE TREATED ON THE STREET AND HOW THEIR INTERACTIONS THERE. WE’LL BE LOOKING AT ROUGHLY ABOUT FIVE KEY AREAS – AND SUPERVISORY ACCOUNTABILITY WAS ONE OF THOSE OTHER ONES – FIVE KEY AREAS WITH A LIST OF GOALS AND OBJECTIVES THAT WILL GROW OUT OF THOSE FIVE KEY AREAS.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

ARE YOU SEEING BUY-IN ON THE PART OF BOTH THE POLICE DEPARTMENT AND THE COMMUNITY IN MILWAUKEE?

NOBLE WRAY:

YES. WE’RE SEEING BUY-IN. HOWEVER, THIS IS A LONG PROCESS. IT’S NOT GOING TO BE THE KIND OF BUY-IN WHERE PEOPLE ARE JUST GOING TO JUMP UP AND SAY, “OH GREAT. THIS IS COLLABORATIVE REFORM. THIS IS EVERYTHING WE NEED.” WE NEED FOR PEOPLE TO BE SKEPTICAL OF THE PROCESS. KICK THE TIRES AND MAKE SURE WE’RE RESPONDING IN A MANNER AS THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE THAT WHAT THEY’RE LOOKING FOR. PEOPLE WANT RESULTS. THEY DON’T WANT US JUST TO COME THERE AND NOT REALLY DO A REAL CLEAR, THOROUGH ASSESSMENT IN THIS PARTICULAR CITY. NOW, WE’VE RECEIVED COOPERATION FROM THE POLICE DEPARTMENT. THAT IS REQUIRED. WE’VE RECEIVED SUPPORT FROM POLICE AND FIRE COMMISSION AS WELL AS THE MAYOR’S OFFICE. BY VIRTUE OF THE FACT THAT WE’VE GOT PEOPLE THAT ARE MONITORING THIS PROCESS OUTSIDE OF THE DEPARTMENT. COMMUNITY MEMBERS, LOCAL GROUPS, THAT IS DEFINITELY WHAT WE NEED. PART OF BUILDING TRUST IS NOT ONLY TO BE TRANSPARENT BUT ALSO GIVE PEOPLE A VOICE BOTH INSIDE THAT DEPARTMENT AND OUTSIDE THAT DEPARTMENT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT ROLE DOES TRUST BETWEEN CITIZENS AND POLICE PLAY WHEN IT COMES TO STEMMING GUN VIOLENCE, FOR EXAMPLE, IN MILWAUKEE?

NOBLE WRAY:

IT’S A VERY IMPORTANT ROLE. YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAVE TRUST, IF YOU — IF CITIZENS FEEL COMFORTABLE PROVIDING INFORMATION. IF CITIZENS FEEL COMFORTABLE NOT ONLY PROVIDING INFORMATION BUT THERE IS A STRONG RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THAT DEPARTMENT AND THE COMMUNITY ITSELF, YOU WILL CO-PRODUCE SAFETY. YOU WILL GET INFORMATION AT THE HOMICIDE SCENES OR THE SHOTS FIRED SCENES. THEY WILL CALL YOU LATER ON IF THEY KNOW THE NAME OF AN OFFICER OR THAT DISTRICT CAPTAIN. THAT IS HOW WE SOLVE CRIMES. BUT NOT ONLY THAT. WHEN CITIZENS BELIEVE THEIR DEPARTMENT IS POLICING AND PROVIDING SAFETY WITH THEM, THEY WILL DO THINGS THAT YOU MAY NOT EVEN KNOW THAT HELP TO PREVENT AND RESIST VIOLENT CRIMES FROM OCCURRING.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WE NEED TO LEAVE IT THERE. FORMER MADISON POLICE CHIEF NOW WITH THE U.S. DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE NOBLE WRAY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

NOBLE WRAY:

THANK YOU.