FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHEREAS REPRESENTATIVE CRAIG DESCRIBED MINORITY LEADER BARCA AS BEING “A FAN OF INSPECTORS GENERAL WORKING INSIDE AGENCIES,” REPRESENTATIVE BARCA’S OFFICE TELLS US HE WOULD BE OPEN TO THEM AS LONG AS THEY WERE OUTSIDE OF POLITICAL INFLUENCE AND THE AUDIT BUREAU WAS NOT ELIMINATED. IT DIDN’T TAKE LONG AFTER THE CIRCULATION OF THIS BILL FOR DEMOCRATS IN THE LEGISLATURE TO COME TO THE LAB’S DEFENSE. CITIZEN WATCHDOG GROUPS CAME OFF THE CHAIN TO DEFEND THE BUREAU AS WELL. JAY HECK IS THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF COMMON CAUSE IN WISCONSIN. AND, JAY, THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

JAY HECK:
THANKS FOR HAVING ME, FRED.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:
SO WHAT IS YOUR REACTION TO THE PROPOSAL TO JETTISON THE LEGISLATIVE AUDIT BUREAU?

JAY HECK:
WELL, COMING AT THE TIME THAT IT DID, RIGHT AFTER THE AUDIT BUREAU RELEASED YET ANOTHER SCATHING EVALUATION OF WISCONSIN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, I MEAN, THE TIMING SUGGESTS THAT THIS IS A REACTION. THEY DON’T LIKE THE MESSAGE BEING SENT. I KNOW REPRESENTATIVE CRAIG SAYS THAT THAT’S NOT THE CASE, BUT THE PROBLEM IS THAT THE LEGISLATIVE AUDIT BUREAU, WHICH HAS BEEN AROUND FOR 50 YEARS, HAS ALWAYS HAD A REPUTATION AS BEING NONPARTISAN, SCRUPULOUSLY FAIR. AND THAT’S IN PART BECAUSE OF THE COMPOSITION OF THE LEGISLATIVE AUDIT BUREAU ITSELF AND THE JOINT LEGISLATIVE AUDIT COMMITTEE THAT OVERSEES IT. AND HE WANTS TO DO AWAY WITH ALL THAT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:
AS YOU SAY REPRESENTATIVE CRAIG SAYS THAT THE WEDC AUDIT WAS NOT THE MOTIVATION FOR THIS BILL. HE SAYS THAT HE THINKS THAT AUDITS OUGHT BE MORE, “IN KIND OF REAL TIME,” YOU KNOW, THAT IT TAKES A LONG TIME FOR THESE AUDITS TO COME OUT AND BY THAT TIME, YOU KNOW, THE AGENCIES HAVE ALREADY KIND OF BEEN DOING ALL THE THINGS THEY’VE BEEN DOING THAT MAYBE THE AUDIT BUREAU FINDS WRONG.

JAY HECK:
SO WHAT HE SUGGESTS THEN IS WE GET RID OF A NONPARTISAN ENTITY THAT’S CHARGED WITH LOOKING INTO ALL STATE AGENCY OPERATIONS AND REPLACE IT WITH INSPECTORS GENERAL, WHO WOULD BE PARTISAN APPOINTMENTS. THEY WOULD BE MADE BY THE LEGISLATIVE ORGANIZATION COMMITTEE, AND THEN THEY WOULD SERVE IN EACH AGENCY. DOES ANYONE SUGGEST– DOES ANYONE SERIOUSLY BELIEVE THAT THESE POLITICAL APPOINTMENTS WOULD HAVE AN OBJECTIVE VIEW? I THINK WHAT THEY’RE TRYING TO DO INSTEAD OR WHAT THEY WOULD DO INSTEAD IS THEY WOULD TRY TO MINIMIZE ANY DAMAGE POLITICALLY THAT COULD BE DONE TO THE ADMINISTRATION THAT EMPLOYS THEM.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:
REPRESENTATIVE CRAIG ON THAT POINT SAYS THAT THEY WOULD BE APPOINTED, YES, BUT THEIR TERMS WOULD SPAN SIX YEARS SO THEY WOULDN’T BE JUST ONE ADMINISTRATION.

JAY HECK:
BUT THEY’RE STILL POLITICAL APPOINTEES. THAT’S THE WHOLE POINT. IT’S PARTOF – I THINK – A BIGGER PLAN AND PATTERN THAT WE’RE SEEING UNDER THIS ADMINISTRATION AND THIS LEGISLATURE TO REPLACE THESE NONPARTISAN ENTITIES, THESE WATCHDOG GOVERNMENT AGENCIES THAT LOOK INTO PROBLEMS IN THE AGENCIES AND THEN ISSUE REPORTS THAT THE PARTISANS DON’T LIKE. AND SO THEY DON’T LIKE THE WEDC REPORT BECAUSE IT REFLECTS BADLY ON GOVERNOR WALKER. THEY DON’T LIKE WHAT THE GOVERNMENT ACCOUNTABILITY DOES, SO THEY’RE TRYING TO UNDERMINE THAT. REPRESENTATIVE CRAIG IS THE AUTHOR OF LEGISLATION TO DO AWAY WITH THE JOHN DOE INVESTIGATION PROCESS, WHICH PROSECUTORS HAVE UTILIZED AND UNCOVERED AND CONVICTED SIX PEOPLE IN THE MILWAUKEE COUNTY EXECUTIVE’S OFFICE WHEN SCOTT WALKER WAS GOVERNOR — I MEAN COUNTY EXECUTIVE. SO THE MESSAGE SEEMS TO BE MORE WE DON’T LIKE THE MESSAGE, WE WANT TO CONTROL THE MESSAGE, AND WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PEOPLE THAT WE HAVE DOING THE INVESTIGATING COMPLY WITH THEIR PARTISAN MASTERS.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:
ON THE OTHER HAND, THE MAJORITY DOES SEEM INTENT ON FERRETING OUT WASTE, FRAUD AND ABUSE. THERE’S ALWAYS KIND OF A LOT OF TALK ABOUT THAT.

JAY HECK:
WELL, IT’S IN THE EYES OF THE BEHOLDER. OBVIOUSLY, THE LEGISLATIVE AUDIT BUREAU CAME UP WITH A LONG LIST OF WASTE, FRAUD AND ABUSE IN WEDC. SO, YOU KNOW, IF YOU WANT TO BUTTRESS WHAT THE LEGISLATIVE AUDIT BUREAU DOES AND IF YOU WANT TO STRENGTHEN IT, THAT’S FINE. BUT YOU DON’T DO IT BY REPLACING IT WITH PARTISAN APPOINTMENTS THAT ARE THEN EMBEDDED IN THE AGENCIES AND REPORTING TO THE PARTISAN SECRETARIES OF THOSE DEPARTMENTS AND ULTIMATELY TO THE GOVERNOR AND THE MAJORITY PARTY IN THE STATE LEGISLATURE. THAT’S — I DON’T THINK THE PEOPLE OF WISCONSIN ARE GOING TO BUY THAT. AND IT WOULD BE — IT WOULD INDICATE TO ME THAT THIS IS — THEY’RE TRYING TO END ALL NONPARTISAN, OBJECTIVE INVESTIGATION OF THE OPERATIONS OF STATE GOVERNMENT. AND THAT’S JUST OUTRAGEOUS.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:
JAY HECK, THANKS VERY MUCH.

JAY HECK:
THANK YOU.