Frederica Freyberg:

The House-passed bill did not include provisions that would allow state governors to turn refugees away. Governor Scott Walker earlier this week said, The State of Wisconsin will not accept new Syrian refugees. Then in a letter to the U.S. Secretaries of State and Health and Human Services said, Our state will not facilitate the coordination or provision of benefits or services for individuals whose presence could pose a potential risk to our people. We will make all efforts to ensure that Syrian refugees are not resettled within the boundaries of our state. Our next guest is an expert on matters of immigration and the law. Clinical assistant professor Stacy Taeuber created the Immigrant Justice Center at the UW-Madison Law School. Thank you for being here.

Stacy Taeuber:

Thank you for having me.

Frederica Freyberg:

Can governors like our own declare the State of Wisconsin will not accept new Syrian refugees?

Stacy Taeuber:

They cannot. Just on basic constitutional grounds you cannot discriminate on the basis of someone’s nationality. You can't say we're going to take some refugees but not others. I think there’s really two basic legal things. There’s equal protection in the anti-discrimination rules. But then there’s also pre-emption. So immigration is a federal matter and states don’t get to decide matters of immigration.

Frederica Freyberg:

But what about the Governor’s resolve that our Department of Children and Families will not facilitate the coordination or provision of benefits or services for refugee resettlement. Can a governor do that?

Stacy Taeuber:

I think they can certainly try to make it difficult and it an unwelcoming place for Syrian refugees. I think they could still run into the same legal problems if you're discriminating against any individual or group of people on the basis of your national origin. That’s specifically prohibited. And that's not the kind of thing we allow under the constitution.

Frederica Freyberg:

What do you know about whether there are Syrian refugees kind of in the waiting to come to Wisconsin? Do you know of any families?

Stacy Taeuber:

I don’t know the specifics about you know the Syrian refugees waiting to be resettled. I mean we did hear just recently about the ones diverted from Indiana. And I think that’s unfortunate. And again I don’t think the states have any grounds to do that.

Frederica Freyberg:

What kinds of benefits and services would refugees get if allowed in states including Wisconsin?

Stacy Taeuber:

So refugees are guaranteed certain benefits as they begin their new life in the country. They get some job training, housing, certain stipend. I believe they get food assistance kind of just to get them on the feet and on their way to becoming a part of society.

Frederica Freyberg:

Tell us what you know about the security and background checks that do occur for refugees wanting entry into this country.

Stacy Taeuber:

So everyone has acknowledged that the screening process for refugees is by far the strictest screening there is in immigration. It’s far easier to come in other status than as a refugee. I mean it literally takes two, three, four years and during that time people are in refugee camps. So, we see these images of sort of the floods of immigrants or floods of refugees. They’re not simply getting on a plane and coming to the United States. They’re going to refugee camps and there’s a 13-level screening process they go through that involves international agencies to begin with and then multiple U.S. agencies screen these people. Fingerprints are taken. Background checks are done. Interviews are done. It’s a very, very, very thorough process. And frankly if you were wanting to come to the United States as a terrorist, there are — you know, are you going to choose to sit for three years in a refugee camp on the hope that you're going to deceive somebody and meanwhile you’re giving them all your information.

Frederica Freyberg:

And isn’t there an additional step for Syrian refugees specifically?

Stacy Taeuber:

Correct. Syrians, they've added an extra element of security to that whole process so it’s even more.

Frederica Freyberg:

How do you become a refugee? What is the designation for that?

Stacy Taeuber:

So, a refugee by law is somebody who has fled their country and who fears or has already suffered persecution on account of a protected ground. So it can be race, religion, nationality, political opinion or your membership in a social group. So if you’re persecuted for religious grounds that would qualify you as a refugee. There’s very specific criteria. It can’t just be a generalized fear. So in addition to several security checks you have to actually meet legal definitions that are pretty stringent.

Frederica Freyberg:

What do you say to people who believe that there are gaps in these security measures and background checks for these refugees?

Stacy Taeuber:

I frankly have no idea what they could be talking about. Again everybody that is involved in the process- international rescue committee is one of the major organizations that works in refugee settlement. They say the process is as thorough as it can possibly be and is an extremely secure and safe process.

Frederica Freyberg:

We leave it there. Stacy, thank you very much.

Stacy Taeuber:

Thank you.