FREDERICA FREYBERG:

SEVERAL MADISON CHURCH-BASED AND SOCIAL SERVICES PROFESSIONALS SPENT MANY HOURS IN THE SHERMAN PARK NEIGHBORHOOD IN MILWAUKEE THIS WEEK. ONE OF THEM HAPPENED TO ALSO GROW UP IN THAT AREA. HE NOW LEADS THE MADISON-BASED TEEN ADVOCACY GROUP “BREAKING BARRIERS MENTORING.” MINISTER CALIPH MUAB’EL IS HERE. THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

SO GROWING UP IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD, THE SCENE OF THIS KIND OF VIOLENT PROTEST OVER THE POLICE SHOOTING, WHAT WAS THAT LIKE FOR YOU?

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

IT WAS ALMOST SURREAL, BUT I UNDERSTAND THE FRUSTRATIONS OF THE PEOPLE. AND THE FRUSTRATIONS WITH NOT BEING HEARD, WITH BEING UNDER-RESOURCED AND IMPOVERISHED. AND THE COMMUNITIES BEING DECIMATED BY POVERTY AND THE LACK OF JOBS. AND NOT ENOUGH RESOURCES BEING FUNNELED INTO THE COMMUNITY. SO WHEN YOU HAVE THE POLICE BRUTALITY AND THE RESPONSE FROM LAW ENFORCEMENT ON TOP OF THAT, THAT APPEARS TO BE IN A VOLATILE MANNER AND YOU’RE MURDERING PEOPLE UNJUSTIFIABLY IN THEIR MINDS, THAT JUST ADDS TO THE FRUSTRATION.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

HOW DOES YOUR BACKGROUND EQUIP YOU TO UNDERSTAND THESE ISSUES?

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

WHERE I COME FROM, I COME FROM THOSE THINGS. I COME FROM VIOLENCE. I COME FROM GANG INFESTATIONS. I COME FROM BROKEN HOME. I COME FROM ALL OF THOSE THINGS THAT IS EXISTING STILL VERY MUCH TODAY IN COMMUNITIES. AND SO HAVING THE KEEN INSIGHT INTO THOSE THINGS ALLOWED ME TO UNDERSTAND THINGS ON A DEEPER LEVEL.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHAT WERE YOU DOING IN MILWAUKEE SPECIFICALLY THIS WEEK AS PROTESTS OVER THE OFFICER-INVOLVED SHOOTING ESCALATED OR THREATENED TO?

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

WELL, I ACTUALLY WAS IN MILWAUKEE THE DAY THAT IT STARTED, BECAUSE I HAD TO DO A SPEECH DOWN THERE. AND THE NEXT DAY, WHICH WAS SUNDAY, I RECEIVED A CALL FROM MICHAEL JOHNSON SAYING, “HEY, WE NEED TO GET DOWN TO MILWAUKEE.”

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

BOYS AND GIRLS CLUBS OF DANE COUNTY.

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

YEAH. HE SAID WE NEED TO GET DOWN THERE. I HAD A PHOTO SHOOT I WAS SUPPOSED TO GO TO. I SAID, “OKAY, I’LL SEE IF THEY CAN GET ME IN AND OUT” AND WE ALL HEADED DOWN TO MILWAUKEE. AND ONCE I KNEW WE WERE GOING, I CONTACTED A LOT OF THE LEADERS OF THAT COMMUNITY DOWN THERE AND THEY WAS WAITING ON US.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

AND YOU WALKED THE NEIGHBORHOODS TALKING WITH PEOPLE?

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

YEAH. WE WALKED THE NEIGHBORHOOD WITH ABOUT, I DON’T KNOW, MAYBE 150 MOORS FROM THE MOORISH SCIENCE TEMPLE OF AMERICA. AND A LOT OF THE YOUTH LEADERS DOWN THERE THAT WE MENTOR, MAYBE 50 TO 60 OF THEM. AND THEY WERE STILL COMING OUT IN DROVES. OUR GOAL WAS TO ESSENTIALLY INFORM THE COMMUNITY ABOUT WHAT MARTIAL LAW WAS. TO PREVENT ANY FURTHER VIOLENCE OR VIOLENT ACT PERPETRATED AGAINST OUR PEOPLE. AND TO JUST BRING THEM A MESSAGE OF PEACE AND LET THEM KNOW THAT WE’RE HERE. WE’RE TOGETHER. AND TO SEE SO MANY BLACK MEN AND WOMEN WALKING DOWN THE STREET AT ONE TIME IN DROVES. THAT REALLY IMPACTED THE COMMUNITY BECAUSE THE RESPONSES WE GOT WAS, “IT’S A NEW DAY.” AND THAT MADE US FEEL PRETTY RELEVANT AT THAT MOMENT.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

NOW, THE KIND OF STREET VIOLENCE REACTION TO THIS OFFICER-INVOLVED SHOOTING SEEMS TO HAVE DIFFUSED KIND OF AT WEEK’S END, BUT ARE THESE TENSIONS AND ANGER SIMMERING BENEATH THE SURFACE IN THAT CITY STILL?

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

WELL, IT’S A LOT OF MISINFORMATION IN REFERENCE TO WHAT HAPPENED WITH THE YOUNG MAN THAT WAS GUNNED DOWN BY POLICE. AND IT’S JUST A LOT OF FACTS COMING OUT THAT CONTINUES TO EXACERBATE THE SITUATION. AND THE REASON WHY GROUND ZERO WAS BURNED DOWN, BECAUSE PRIOR TO THIS PARTICULAR SHOOTING THERE WAS ANOTHER OFFICER-INVOLVED SHOOTING THERE IN SHERMAN PARK. AND SO THEY BURNED DOWN THAT GAS STATION AND ALL OF THE COMPONENTS THERE. AND ALSO THAT AREA THAT THE YOUNG GUY WAS GUNNED DOWN AS WELL.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

AND SO YOU WERE THERE WITH PEOPLE TO TRY TO KEEP THE PEACE. WHAT IS YOUR REACTION TO THE IDEA OF, YOU KNOW, BURNING BUSINESSES DOWN IN RESPONSE?

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

I BELIEVE FIGHTING FIRE WITH FIRE. CREATE AN EXPLOSION. BUT I THINK IF YOU FIGHT FIRE WITH WATER, IT EXTINGUISH IT. SO I UNDERSTAND — LIKE I SAID, I UNDERSTAND THE FRUSTRATIONS. AND I UNDERSTAND WHERE THEY’RE COMING FROM. BUT WHEN YOU HAVE A COMMUNITY OF PEOPLE WHO LACK THE ABILITY TO EXPRESS THEMSELVES BECAUSE OF SO MANY THINGS. VARIOUS THINGS SYSTEMATICALLY ESPECIALLY, HITTING THEM ONE AFTER ANOTHER, ONE AFTER ANOTHER, ONE AFTER ANOTHER, THEN THIS IS THE EXPLOSIVE RESPONSE THAT YOU GET. BUT I DON’T BELIEVE IN HURTING OR HARMING ANYONE. BLOWING UP THINGS. I DON’T BELIEVE IN THOSE THINGS. THOSE ARE NOT THINGS THAT REPRESENTS MY VALUE. WE BELIEVE IN TEACHING LOVE INSTEAD OF HATE. AND THAT’S WHY THE MOORS WERE THERE TO PROMOTE THAT. LOVE INSTEAD OF HATE. THINK LOGICALLY. DON’T ACT OFF EMOTIONS. LISTEN. AND YOU LEARN A LOT BY JUST DOING THOSE THINGS.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

DO YOU AND THE PEOPLE THAT YOU CAME TO MILWAUKEE WITH AND WORKED IN MILWAUKEE WITH EXPECT TO STAY ON THE GROUND THERE?

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

YES. I’VE BEEN THERE ACTUALLY ALL WEEK. I MISSED ONE WEEK — I MISSED ONE DAY OUT OF THIS WEEK. I THINK THAT WAS WEDNESDAY. BUT I’VE BEEN THERE EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THIS WEEK.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

AND YOU THINK THAT THAT PRESENCE IS VALUABLE FOR PEOPLE?

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

YES. WE COME THERE, WE BRING THE SPIRIT. WE BRING THE SPIRIT OF HOPE. WE BRING A SPIRIT OF JOY. AND EVERY TIME I COME, THE MOORS ARE THERE TO BRING THAT SAME SPIRIT AND PUSH THAT SAME INITIATIVE. AND THEY’RE OUT THERE EVERY DAY, EVERY SINGLE DAY. BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, MY CONCERN WAS FOR THE YOUTH IN THAT COMMUNITY. AND WE HAVE THE YOUTH OUT THERE TAKING INITIATIVE AND TAKING CONTROL OF THE SITUATIONS OUT THERE IN THE STREETS. OF COURSE, YOU CAN’T REACH EVERYBODY. AND SO THERE ARE STILL — THERE’S STILL POCKETS OF VIOLENCE THAT’S HAPPENING THROUGHOUT THE CITY, BUT FOR THE MOST PART WE’RE REACHING COMMON GROUND, NOT WITH LAW ENFORCEMENT. I DON’T THINK THAT THEY’RE — I THINK THAT THEY’RE A LONG WAY FROM REACHING COMMON GROUND WITH LAW ENFORCEMENT BECAUSE OF THE SYSTEMIC BARRIERS AND THE VARIOUS ISSUES THAT FUELS THEIR FRUSTRATION. BUT I DO THINK THAT AS A PEOPLE WE’RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW WE CAN HELP AND LIBERATE OURSELVES AND OUR CONDITIONS AND CIRCUMSTANCE.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

ALL RIGHT. WE NEED TO LEAVE IT THERE, MINISTER CALIPH MUAB’EL . THANKS VERY MUCH.

CALIPH MUAB’EL:

THANK YOU.

FREDERICA FREYBERG:

WHEN THE MINISTER REFERS TO MOORS, HE SPEAKS OF THE MOOR SCIENCE TEMPLE OF AMERICA, A RELIGIOUS ORGANIZATION WHICH DESCRIBES ITSELF AS DEDICATED TO PEACE AND JUSTICE.