By the River with Holly Jackson

Host> Seasoned librarian and author Terah Harris uses her love for reading to connect with others.

>> My love for reading comes from my mother who probably reads about 200 books a year.

<Wow.> She's retired now, so she'll probably read a lot more than that.

<Oh, my gosh.> But I watched my mother read for fun, for comfort, and when I was in school, you know, I thought, Ugh, I'm never gonna read.

You know, we had to read, had reading, because you have to.

We had to read and I thought, she's reading because she wants to.

And that she first instilled in me that that was possible.

Host> Her book, "One Summer in Savannah" tells a story of family, redemption and unconditional love in the sweltering summer heat of Savannah.

>> You know, conception after a sexual assault is rarely covered in fiction.

When I was doing research to try to find some comparables to it, I had a difficult time.

And I'm a collection development librarian, and I had a difficult time finding books that I could say that this was similar to.

I only found two that was somewhat similar, and it was a Francine Rivers book called "The Atonement Child," and it deals with a woman who conceived the child after sexual assault.

And then "We Were the Mulvaneys" by Joyce Carol Oates, and it tells the beautiful story of a family and how their family dynamics was altered after the daughter was sexually assaulted.

And that's like the Jacob side of the book.

So the, there's two, those two books kind of mesh into one, and that's what's "One Summer in Savannah" is, Host> Terah talks with me about her deep love for books and libraries.

>> I'm Deputy Director of the Dothan Houston County Library System, and it's a library system that consists of three branches and a bookmobile, so somewhat large for the little teeny tiny town in Alabama where it's from.

And so my day-to-day job is I'm in charge of the day-to-day operations of the job, like customer service, making sure that the patrons are being helped.

But the part that I love the most is I'm also responsible for the collection development.

So it's my job, I get to buy books.

>> I'm Holly Jackson.

Join us as we bring you powerful stories from both new and established Southern authors as we sit by the river.

Narrator> Major funding for "By The River" is provided by the ETV Endowment of South Carolina.

For more than 40 years, the ETV Endowment of South Carolina has been a partner of South Carolina ETV, and South Carolina Public Radio.

>> Hi, I am Holly Jackson.

Thank you so much for joining us here on "By the River."

If you're new here, I'd like you to know that "By the River" is a show that goes beyond the book.

We're not a book review.

We know you can find that part easily, but what we want you to do is get to know the author and what led them to the story that they told.

We have such a great lineup this season.

We hope you've enjoyed some so far.

But today we're gonna talk with author Terah Harris, and I'm really excited about this for so many reasons.

And one especially is that you're a library, you work in a library, and so you're constantly surrounded by books.

>> Constantly.

Holly> Let's go ahead and get right to that part.

Tell me about your job, your day job and being surrounded by books and what led you to decide to start writing yourself.

>> Okay.

So my, I could say my day job, because writing is my night job, day job, is I'm deputy director of the Dothan Houston County Library System.

And it's a library system that can consists of three branches in a bookmobile, so somewhat large for the little teeny tiny town in Alabama where it's from.

And so my day-to-day job is I'm in charge of the day-to-day operations of the job, like customer service, making sure that the patrons are being helped.

But the part that I love the most is I'm also responsible for the collection development.

So it's my job.

I get to buy books.

<Oh, cool.> And I love that I am responsible for purchasing all the digital and print, adult print books for the library.

So that is the, the best part of my job.

I get to buy books all day.

Holly> Right.

There are some people I'm sure who are like, I need to get in her good side, because I want more of this.

>> Yes, absolutely.

<Yeah.> And that kinda led me to being able to write a book like "One Summer in Savannah."

I spent a lot of time talking to my patrons and them talking to me, and they're telling me the things that they want because I wanna make sure that I stock the shelves of things that they want.

I don't wanna have a bunch of books that, you know, no one checks out.

<Sure.> And so I spent a lot of time talking to them because people read in seasons and changes, but one of the things that identified was that they love their tried and true authors, you know, those popular authors, they love them.

But one thing I was starting to notice was that they were really open to trying something new and different and diverse and those stories that they've never really read before.

And I knew, I said to myself, if I ever was gonna write a book, I want to write something that would be kind of difficult to find on the shelf that we already had.

And so I kind of waited for that idea to inspire me, but they taught me that, my patrons taught me that at the library, so, you know, my job and my day job, my night job, they kind of go hand in hand.

So I appreciated that.

>> Sure.

So whenever you, I feel like working in a library is one of those, those professions where you kind of have a calling in a sense, because you probably have some sort of love for reading or desire to let spread the, the message that others should read.

<Absolutely.> So kind where did, where did you get that nudge to choose that profession?

And just kind of talk about when it led to you finally kind of getting that final affirmation of, I'm gonna do this, >> I'm gonna do this.

So my, I was a freelance writer for a long time.

After college I started freelancing writing, I was traveling the world updating guidebook and writing freelance articles for the travels that I did.

And so then I settled down, I got married, my husband basically parked me in Alabama and I noticed that my local library at the time was hiring.

So I said I could do that.

I love books.

I could do that.

I read a lot.

My love for reading comes from my mother who probably reads about 200 books a year.

<Wow.> She's retired now, so she'll probably read a lot more than that.

<Oh, my gosh.> But I watched my mother read for fun, for comfort, and when I was in school, you know, I thought, Oh, I'm never gonna read.

You know, we had to, because - Holly> You have to, it's an assignment.

Terah> And I thought, she's reading because she wants to.

And that she first instilled in me that that was possible.

And so she just said, we have to find the right books for you to want to read.

Because everything we were reading was these classics and they're great books, but they were not things that really particularly interest me.

So I get my love from my reading from my mother who helped me cultivate and learn what I wanted to read.

So when a library job came available, I thought, I can be around books.

This is, this is a very good thing.

And I started doing that and it was a part-time job that just, I just loved, I love being around people.

You definitely have to have a call to work in, in, in library world because you meet different people at all facets of their life.

<Right.> And so we are, we always say you have to have a call to serve because you meet people and you help people, you know, you help the people apply for social security, you help the people to find, you know, housing.

You know, you help the people be able to get on assistance if they need it.

You help the kids find the books and the stuff that they need for their papers.

So you definitely have to have a call to serve.

So once I got in there, I was like, oh, this is it.

This is what I wanna do, and I can still freelance and write at the same time.

They went very well together and I really much appreciated that.

Holly> I'm so glad you shared those services that the library provides because I think a lot of people who have not had to use those services don't realize that that's where people go.

And a lot of times people are coming in there at a real turning point or crisis in their life.

Terah> That's right.

Holly> And you really have to be a guide for them.

Terah> Yeah.

We tell people when people say, "Oh, you know, I don't need the library."

And I say, "That's not true."

Library is so much more than about books.

Like, it is about books.

But we do now so much more services than about books.

When I was a kid, all you could do in a library is check out a book.

But now you can walk into a library and don't look at a book and don't touch the book.

You know, libraries have changed based on the needs of the people that we serve, that's what we say.

So as computers got more and more popular, guess what?

Libraries had to get computers.

We, at my library, we are notaries.

There's 10 of us that are notaries.

Banks are not notarizing papers anymore.

We are, there's 12 of us that are passport assistant agents.

You know, we are certified passport agents, so we help people apply to get their passports, and - Holly> That's, I didn't know that.

Okay.

>> And that's something that a lot of people, when they say, "Oh, I don't, you know, the library's not for me."

I'll say, "Well, do you need to update your passport or get a passport?"

And they're like, "Yes, I do."

"Do you need to have some papers notarized?"

"Yes, I do."

There's so many different things.

That's because people still have this kind of antiquated idea of what libraries are, and that's what we are always trying to tell our story.

And to say, look into what we have.

You never know what we are gonna have that may be able to help you.

>> Thank you for the shout out to the libraries.

I love that.

Glad we gave them a plug.

All right.

So "One Summer in Savannah."

This is number one of three now.

<Yes.> Three.

You're, you're working on number three right now.

<Right.> But once you started going, you really went off to town, didn't you?

<Yes.

Yes.> Tell me about that process and just kind of how quickly, once you started it, it really started coming to you.

>> Well, publishing is weird.

I always like to tell people that how weird publishing is, just because the lead time for publishing is so far in advance.

And so while waiting for "One Summer in Savannah" to come out, I wrote another whole book.

And so now that "One Summer in Savannah" is out, I have another book coming out in May of 2024, but I'm already writing the third one because of the lead time.

And so I always tell people, you know, it's really strange when people say - >> It is strange because as we, as the reader are celebrating a book, you're like, oh yeah, that was so last year for me.

Or whatever, you know, because you're in a different phase - <Yeah.> - in the process.

But what were the challenges for you in that first book?

Let's talk about those.

>> Okay.

The challenges is, it's a very difficult topic.

You know, conception after a sexual assault is rarely covered in fiction.

When I was doing research to try to find some comparables to it, I had a difficult time.

And I'm a collection development librarian, and I had a difficult time finding books that I could say that this was similar to.

I only found two that was somewhat similar.

And it was a Francine Rivers book called "The Atonement Child."

And it deals with a woman who conceived the child after sexual assault.

And then "We Were the Mulvaneys" by Joyce Carol Oates.

And it tells the beautiful story of a family and how their family dynamics was altered after the daughter was sexually assaulted.

And that's like the Jacobs side of the book.

So there's two, those two books kind of mesh into one, and that's what "One Summer in Savannah" is.

But to write about such a personal topic like that, such a difficult topic like that is, was very difficult for me, especially since it's loosely based on someone really close to me.

And it's her story of forgiveness.

And there were two pieces of inspiration for "One Summer in Savannah" I like to tell people, and one is ironic why we're in South Carolina now because a huge portion of that inspiration came from the South Carolina church shooting.

And I remember watching it on TV and days after that event, I remember reading and seeing that the survivors, they forgave the shooter.

<Yes.> And I thought to myself, who, <Wow.> I don't know anything.

There goes my definition of forgiveness.

I don't know anything about forgiveness because like so many people, I assumed that there were acts and crimes and behaviors that it was okay not to forgive, but they taught me the opposite of that.

And so they defined, they helped me define my own definition of forgiveness.

And I knew I wanted to write a book that challenged readers' definition of forgiveness the way mine was challenged.

And then, so I had a theme, but I didn't have a story.

So until someone very close to me shared something with me that I never knew that she had conceived a child through sexual assault, and she said these words, she says, and she practiced the act of forgiveness every day.

And when she said the word forgiveness, it tied it to the theme that I wanted to write about.

And so I shared her story.

This is a very loosely based idea of her story.

>> And I imagine you had this conversation with her and tell me about that and her reading the book, and does it kind of help with that healing and moving on process for her?

>> Absolutely.

Well, it's good to tell in general.

She was more want to tell the story in general because there are so many Sarah's in the world, and sexual as conception after sexual assault is an even darker side of sexual assault that people rarely talk about.

And that's the point, that's the what we wanna highlight and talk about that this is, this is something that happens to people and just kind of shine a light on that.

>> Wow.

All right.

So this was number one.

Tell me about two and three how they fall.

>> Number two is all the books that I write are loosely based on real life true events, just because I like to highlight these things that are happening to people that no one really talks about.

And so I was inspired by these two brothers in North Carolina who went to jail for seven years fighting for their ancestral land.

They would not leave their ancestral land.

And the article that I originally read was talking about all these different legal, legal laws that corporations and governments use to acquire land from people.

And I never knew about any of this.

I never knew that any of this happened.

I mean, I'd heard of imminent domain, that's a, that's the most popular one, right?

But there are other legal laws and different things.

And so I just kind of deep dived into that and said, this is something that we need to learn more about, that we need to bring some awareness to.

And so I created a fictional story of these four siblings who after their, and after their father dies, return home to save their ancestral land.

And then I say, and themselves, because it's a family drama.

So they're all, they all have their own issues.

And so they have their fighting their own personal issues, but they also are fighting to save their ancestral land.

>> What I love is this pattern I'm seeing between, with, with one and two of your books, that you've been emotionally impacted by a major news event - <Yeah.

Yeah> - and couldn't let it go and said, I'm gonna, this is gonna inspire me in this next story that I write.

>> Yeah.

I, I like that, I feel like that helps my process.

I'm, I'm an emotional person.

And in order to spend the time to write a book, you know, writing a book is, it's not easy.

<Right.> It requires discipline and you definitely have to be drawn to it and something that you have to be passionate about.

And these first two books that I've written are things that I just was, that I was just very called, I feel like I was called to do and to tell that story.

>> Tell me about, since we're talking emotions, that feeling of whenever the words are out, what is that feeling like for you to kind of like that deep breath moment that these words are out and now you can move on to something else in your world?

>> I feel, I always feel, I always tell my husband I feel loose.

Like when I finish writings, a page or a chapter, I always just kind of shake because I felt like it just unloaded myself.

I, I'm a, I have a weird process.

I don't see scenes when I write.

Like a lot of writers, they'll say, I, I saw this scene in my head and I just wrote what I saw.

I hear voices and my husband says, "Stop telling people that you hear voices," but I - >> Well, I think people who write can identify with that.

>> Yes, and I just feel like my character, I like to say, so my character's talking to me.

<Right.> They're speaking to me.

And so I just kind of write what they tell me.

And then once I feel like, and then they won't leave me alone.

So if I'm driving on the road or if I'm at work and until it's down, it just kind of gnaws at me and gnaws at me.

So I think that's whenever I finally get it down, that's the shaking thing that I do.

I feel lighter that the words are out on the page.

>> A real actually a physical, a physical feeling.

>> Yes.

Yes.

>> Now you said they're talking to you.

Are you talking back to them, and what's your husband, Is your husband like, "Okay, we've gone too far.

We've gone too far with this."?

>> I will say, especially like when I feel like they wake me up or they keep me up, I'll say, "Okay, that's enough."

<Right.

Yeah.> >> You know, like, not full fledged conversations with him, but I'll just say, "Okay, I've got it down.

That's enough.

I'm going to bed."

>> Now are you still writing by hand?

>> I still write by hand.

>> Okay.

We gotta talk a little bit about that because we talk on the show for years now, he, the legendary Pat Conroy is brought up and one of his things is that he had all these legal pads.

<Yeah.> Or he, he wrote.

And that amazed me.

But that was years ago, and I really haven't heard that story before or, or since then, until you, so there is somebody who's still using notepad and pen.

And what makes you decide to do that?

Why do you like that versus a computer which probably would cut your time a little bit?

>> Yes.

It's, I, I use pencils.

<Okay.> I am even more antiquated.

Like I'm, <Yes, you are.> pencils and a notebook.

I just feel like there's a connection.

>> So you're not using the feather in the little thing of ink.

>> Not yet, I haven't gone back that far yet.

I just feel like there's a connection, you know, from the mind and the hand.

Like you, you're not breaking that connection.

And I, when I first started writing, I thought I was following all these other writers rules and they say, don't edit as you go along and you know, type it up.

And I was trying to follow all of those and I just felt stuck.

But I would notice when I would just grab my notebook and a pencil and just started writing that the words just flow better and it just worked for me.

And finally I stopped fighting what I felt like everyone else was telling me to do.

<Right.> And just to create my own process.

And so I just would grab these notebooks and just, I would just write long hand.

And it does take longer because I have to write it out and then I have to type it up.

But it just, it works for me.

And that, that process is, is is the best.

And I shock so many people because I'll show, I show them my notebook and there's just pages of just handwritten and I use every space of the, of the paper.

It just works so much better for me.

>> Okay.

So based off your style and the habits that you have and the emotions that you have, I can't imagine you being able to shut it off during the day and making this a nighttime thing.

Are you able to do that?

And if so, how?

Because you've called it your night job, but is it really your all-the-time job?

>> It is my all-the-time job because my characters speak to me.

So it doesn't matter if I'm in a board meeting, you know, so I have these little pieces of paper.

<Okay.> If I don't have my notebook on me, which having that notebook makes it, people say, "How do you work a full-time job and write," because I hand write, my notebook comes with me, it is always with me.

And paper is always accessible and there's a pen or a pencil there.

So that's what makes it easier versus somebody that has to type it.

>> Right, that's true.

>> So, if I'm in a board meeting or if I'm somewhere and if something comes to me, I'll just take it and I'll just write it on little pieces of paper.

I use little pieces of scrap paper and then like old recycle paper, we recycle at the library.

So I'll just write on the back of an old something we printed that we didn't want and I'll just jot it down there.

And then I get home and I have all these little pieces of paper and it's like a puzzle.

It really is, because I don't write in order.

I write scattered.

So I'm literally just kind of putting it all together.

>> Oh, my gosh, so then you're grabbing all these papers out of your purse and stuff.

<I am.> Where does this flow?

How does this go together?

<Yes.

Yeah.> This is really fascinating.

So with all that you've told me, I'm like, it, I don't, I don't ever wanna overuse this and, and take the depth out of it by about, whenever I say it being a calling.

But it really feels to me like that is what it is for you.

<Yes.> So do you ever ask yourself like, why did it come now and why didn't I start earlier or anything like that?

>> It did start earlier.

I ran from it, I feel like from, for a really long time.

I remember writing my first story when I was in sixth grade.

My sixth grade teacher, her name is Julie Cook.

And she encouraged, she was the first teacher that encouraged me to write.

And when all the other kids were at recess and I'd write, and she would let me write.

And I loved that she let me do that.

And she was the first person that said, stay, stick with it and would just let me write these stories.

But then I grew up in an era where it was, how, how are you gonna make money?

<Right.> Okay, you wanna write, but how are you gonna, how are you gonna support yourself?

And so it was, okay, I can, that was like a hobby, you know, you can do that as a hobby, but you need to go find a job and do something else.

And so it was, okay, well I have to do that.

And then I started, as I got older, I realized that, okay, you can write and do other things too.

Like that's when I started freelancing.

It wasn't at the time enough to like pay all the bills, but it was still me using that calling and being able to call to and do it.

And then eventually on my own, I discovered, oh, there's freelance writers.

There are people that are making a living doing a different type of, you know, work.

I grew up when newspapers were at the height and they were starting to slowly decline.

So I thought I was gonna be a newspaper, you know, reporter.

But newspapers were starting to decline.

And it was, okay, what am I gonna do now?

But then as I got older, I started discovering all these different, you know, professions that are tied to writing.

So I did that instead.

And I still had knew that I eventually wanted to write a book and just kind of ran from it because it was, it was writing a book.

It's like, yeah.

So all these pages.

>> Yeah, huge undertaking, sure.

>> It was a huge undertaking.

And finally I just said, you know what, I'm gonna do it.

It's February of 2020.

I was on a girls' trip in Paris.

And so I started this book and I ended this book in Paris, which is, I found to be very unique.

And I started in February, 2020.

Just, I remember we were sitting waiting for, at the airport and we were leaving and I just started writing.

>> So you were with these, these ladies.

<Yeah.> Y'all were on this trip all together.

And that's whenever you pinned the first words in the book.

>> That's right.

I had, I had by then had already had the theme, already had this story, but I was so afraid.

I was like, what are you waiting on?

You have everything that you've been waiting on.

Why have you not started?

And that's when I feel like Sarah started speaking to me.

Jacob started speaking to me.

And so that's when I just started writing.

>> I love these conversations with yourself.

How you, you are your own motivational speaker.

Terah> That's right.

That's right.

>> And you keep yourself on task.

You get it done.

Terah> That's right.

>> Let's kind of back up a little bit.

I, I do wanna know about the choice of setting it in Savannah since as we're sitting here in Beaufort, South Carolina.

Terah> That's right.

Holly> Not far from Savannah.

Terah> That's right.

That's right.

Holly> So let's talk about that setting.

>> I tell people everything in my book is intentional.

I wait for inspiration.

And I know some people say, "Don't wait for inspiration, just go ahead and get started."

But I wait for the right things to come out.

And I was online and I was scrolling and I saw this cottage and it's in Hird Island, which is right outside of, you know, Savannah.

And it was for sale and it was just beautiful, just kind of old fishing cottage.

And I thought, that's where Jacob's gonna live.

He just immediately started speaking to me about this cottage and he said this is gonna be his, this was his father's cottage.

This is where he spent a lot of his time.

And it just came to me right then.

(snaps fingers) I had no idea that I was gonna set this book in Savannah.

Holly> Wow.

Terah> It just kind of, Holly> And this is all came from a random, you don't even know what you were searching for.

This just landed, 'cause sometimes I'm on the internet and I'm like, how did I get here?

>> How did you get here?

(laughs) >> Sometimes I'll even back up on my, you know, I'm like, what did I start with, you know?

>> Yeah.

And that's exactly what happened.

So I said, where is this?

I had no idea where it was.

And it was in Georgia.

And I said, okay, so he's gonna live here, so that means I have to base everything else around it.

And it was like 40 miles, 40 miles south of Savannah.

I said, oh, where?

There we go.

We're in Savannah.

>> Okay.

Let's talk about, time's running out, but I do wanna talk about your research process because I know that you are not afraid of traveling.

How many countries?

>> Gosh, I, it's 40, it's 40 plus now.

But yeah, I've somewhat lost out.

>> That's incredible.

Okay.

So tell me about your research process and you know, just getting to know the area that in which you write about.

>> Yeah, the biggest thing for Savannah, there's really outside of like Hird Island, there's really no, and the beach that we highlight, there's really no like Savannah like places highlighted.

But what I was really trying to focus on is the South.

<Right.> You know, like is Southern fiction the South, the heat, you know, how it, how things just kind of felt.

Holly> Culture, traditions.

>> Yeah.

Tradition, culture, all of that.

We mentioned 'cause of you a couple of times.

There's magnolias on the, you know, on the cover just to set it more in the South, you know, and then have that, that tides like that.

That's one of the things that Pat Conroy did so very well, was that you felt that I, I mean I grew up in the Midwest.

And I remember reading like "The Prince of Tides" and I just felt like, wow, I feel like I'm in South Carolina and that's that feeling, you know, of being in the South.

So that's the research I had to do.

But I live in Alabama, so as far as the heat and some of these things, that's just kind of native to that whole area.

>> Yeah.

You got that part.

>> Yeah.

Yeah.

>> Well, this has really been a cool conversation.

I really enjoy talking to you and I, I love the, the calling part.

I love that.

Like I said, you're, you're your own, like, cheerleader and that you can feel whenever you're maybe afraid.

And so then you talk yourself into what you know that you're supposed to do.

>> That's right.

That's right.

>> And it's just, it's really inspirational.

So thank you for sharing that part.

Terah> Thank you so much.

Holly> I appreciate it.

Holly> And thank you everybody for joining us right here on "By The River."

Don't we have a lot of fun and learn so much?

I really appreciate you tagging along.

I'm Holly Jackson, your host, and we'll see you right back here next time on "By The River."

Narrator> Major funding for "By The River" is provided by the ETV Endowment of South Carolina.

For more than 40 years, the ETV Endowment of South Carolina has been a partner of South Carolina ETV and South Carolina Public Radio.