Ask This Old House

Kevin

Today on "Ask This Old House"...

Jenn

I'll show you the perfect garden for crafting your own cocktails. You could add this to iced tea, you could put them in daiquiris, you could put them in margaritas, and you could put them in gimlets.

Kevin

Okay. Another use for herb gardens, and a pretty good one, in this case.

Richard

This radiator jumped back a half an inch when the valve was disconnected. I'll show you how we bring it all together. We're gonna use the power of a lever. So as we pull down here, it should draw the bottom of the radiator up to the face of the unit. If we can get it just enough to make the first two or three threads, we can tighten it up and we're there.

Ryan

Perfect.

Mark

And this fireplace is sloppy, poorly done, and I don't even think that's the right material. But I'm gonna make it look like it belongs here.

Kevin

Hi, there. I'm Kevin O'Connor. And welcome back to "Ask This Old House," where our team is standing by, ready to answer questions about your house. So make sure you keep your e-mails and your letters coming. Hey,

Richard. Richard

Good morning, sir.

Kevin

What are you working on today?

Richard

My task today is to help a homeowner with a leaking radiator.

Kevin

Wow. Those old radiators aren't going away, are they?

Richard

No, they're still around.

Kevin

Alright. Alright. Hey, Jenn. How are you?

Jenn

Good, how are you?

Kevin

I'm doing alright. Wow, herbs, huh? Boy, you love your herb gardens, don't you?

Jenn

Well, this is different, though.

Kevin

Why?

Jenn

This one is a themed herb garden.

Kevin

And what is the theme?

Jenn

The theme is cocktail gardens.

Oh. Jenn

It's really just great to have a purpose for your garden.

Alright. Jenn

I think it'll help you learn about the plants. It'll help you utilize them and use them.

Kevin

Makes a lot of sense. So, mint, I get.

Jenn

Yep.

Kevin

Mint juleps, mojitos, right?

Jenn

Right. And you could take this. The reason why this is in a container, 'cause it starts to get crazy in a garden.

Mm-hmm. Jenn

So here, you could use a stem. You could use the leaf.

Yep. Jenn

And you could put it in many different types of drinks.

Kevin

This is an obvious choice, right? If you told me you were gonna do cocktail herbs, I would think of mint. But what are some of these others?

Jenn

Over here, I have slower-growing herbs. And so I'm gonna jam them all into one pot. And you could, say, this keep this on your deck, and it's just accessible. You're sitting there, have a drink, crush it, put it in your drink.

Kevin

Alright. This one is rosemary. I would think that maybe you would take a little piece off, and you'd put it on a piece of pork and on the grill. You're gonna put this in my drink?

Jenn

There are so many different recipes out there. You can go to any culinary website.

Kevin

Sage?

Smells good. Jenn

Mm-hmm.

Kevin

Smells a lot like the basil.

Jenn

I'm gonna put that in the background, 'cause

that's gonna get tall. Kevin

Okay.

Jenn

So why don't you go right in there.

Kevin

Verbena lemon -- never heard of it.

Jenn

Oh, it's a fantas-- I mean, smell --

Kevin

Do I eat it?

Jenn

You could eat it, yep.

Kevin

Yeah? That thing tastes like it has been dunked in lemon juice. That's amazing.

Jenn

You could add this to iced tea, as well. You could put them in daiquiris, you could put them in margaritas, and you could put them in gimlets.

Kevin

Okay. Another use for herb gardens, and a pretty good one, in this case.

Jenn

So, gardens with a purpose -- I think they'll make you focus on taking care. And then you'll really know, learn how the plant grows.

Kevin

Good. Good information. And you know what?

It's 5

00 somewhere.

Laughs

It is 5

00 somewhere.

Ryan

Richard, thank you so much for coming.

We really appreciate it. Richard

Well, it's nice to be back in the old hood. I was born just up the street. This place was built -- This whole neighborhood was built around the teens and the '20s. It's a great spot.

Ryan

Yeah. This house actually was 1923.

Richard

I love what you've done. You've kept all the old wood, left it exposed.

It looks great. Ryan

Thanks.

Richard

This is a nice piece.

Ryan

Yeah. I built this myself for Thanksgiving two years ago.

Richard

You did?

Ryan

Yeah.

Richard

You know, Tommy and Norm would be

really proud of you. Ryan

I hope so. In here's the radiator we were talking about.

Richard

Alright. Alright. Nice sun-room, and cold sun-room.

Ryan

Yeah. That little space heater's actually been trying to cover for this radiator

since we had the problem. Richard

How's it doing?

Ryan

Not so great.

Richard

Alright, so what happened?

Ryan

So, we had a leaking radiator valve in my daughter's room and here in the office. And I thought while my wife was in the hospital actually having my daughter, before she came home, I'd swap these out so that the heat would be all sorted out. I did hers, and it went great, perfectly.

Seemed simple enough. Ryan

Yeah, right. And I figured while I was doing that one, I could do this one, as well. But when I went to loosen the valve from the radiator itself, the supply line actually sprung away from the radiator.

Richard

You can almost see how much it pulled that way.

Ryan

Exactly. And I've tried to cover that distance, and you can see where it needs to be relative to where it is. And I've tried everything since then. I've tried wedges in the basement. I've tried pulling them together with straps. And I cannot get this not to leak. I threw a cap on it, and we've had no heat in the office ever since.

Richard

Good thing you had the cap.

Ryan

Yeah, good thing is right.

Richard

Alright. Well, this is a hot-water radiator. Every single one of these radiators are filled with water. It's very common in this area, in this neighborhood, for this vintage of house. What we're gonna do is turn off the heating system, drain the radiator again, and then I'm sure we can fix it.

Ryan

Great.

Richard

First, I shut the power off to the boiler. Then I shut off the cold-water feed going into the boiler and add a hose so I can drain the system. It's really important to vent each radiator to break the vacuum. Alright. Every radiator in a hot-water system has a radiator valve like you've got right here.

Ryan

Right.

Richard

So this is the standard here. It's got two parts to it. One is the valve itself, and that's designed to be able to shut down the radiator or affect the flow to balance it a little bit. But it really is a balancing valve. It's never gonna hold positively tight. And if there's a leak in the radiator, it's not gonna stop the leak. You're gonna have to do what you did. So, there's two parts to it. One is the valve itself. And also, there's a part called the spud. Now, that's the part that presents a union. You know, this will be the part that goes into the radiator. And here's the valve, but you need a nut like this to be able to bring and mate those two pieces together. And that's why it's called a union. Now, it's gonna tie into the radiator itself. If you look here, there's a thing called a bushing. Even though it's covered with paint, the radiator itself has a two-inch thread. And a bushing looks like this unpainted, so it has a thread on the outside and a thread in the inside. And they come in every different size and combination. So if we had to, we could go all the way back to a two-inch bushing and we could adapt as we need to. But I think we're gonna be fine just leaving that one in, and now we're gonna make this spud go in. But this is really tricky to get into the radiator, because if you used a regular wrench you'd deface the threads. So if you look here, see the two tabs right there.

Yeah. Richard

And there's a special wrench called a spud wrench, and look what happens. You probably know about this valve.

Ryan

That's right. I bought one for my daughter's room.

Richard

So now with that, we can now tighten that thread into the radiator without defacing the threads. So now, I'm gonna start by pulling out your plug and taking off the cap.

Ryan

Great.

Richard

It's a little easier when it's only been in for a week or two.

Ryan

Yeah. The first one wasn't that easy.

We actually had to cut it out. Richard

Yeah. Sometimes they can be a bear if they've been in there for 100 years. Alright. So now, let's just -- I got a little rag here. There might be a little bit of water in the bottom. Not too much, okay. So there's the plug. And now for this, I'm gonna use two wrenches 'cause I don't want anything to happen to that pipe thread down inside the floor. And when I go onto the pipe itself, I want to be sure I have a three-corner bite. I want to have a piece of the pipe touching here, here, and here so I don't let this thing get out of round. So you'll see right here, and I just snug it right there. And now, with another wrench. And then I pull counterclockwise. Lefty loosey. Good. Now I can use a smaller wrench. Okay. Now, many times, to put a new spud in, we have to break both sides of the radiator and move the radiator out of the way in order to have enough space for the spud wrench with the valve. But with no valve here, I think we're gonna be okay. So these connections are going into the O-works. So I really want to have a good, tight thread seal. Many people might use Teflon tape. What I like is to use sort of a tried-and-true method for me, which is pipe dope that goes around. What I like to use is this. It's called single-strand wicking. And with that, I will actually put some of this in each thread.

Ryan

I've never heard of that before.

Richard

It acts as a filler. I mean, it's -- we've been doing it for 100 years. And I'm not worried about the new connection. I'm worried about that -- you know, is there any pitting on that old one. And this'll help to fill any gaps and avoid leaks.

Ryan

That's great.

Richard

Alright, so we're ready to go. So now, let's get it caught. And you don't want to cross these threads.

No. Richard

You get one shot at it. So I want to start it by hand 'cause I don't want to cross these threads. They're brass threads, and they could get marred and crossed. And once I have it caught, which there it is, put the spud in. Just tighten it up. And I use a wrench to just snug-up the last bit. Now we have to do the same thing to the pipe before we put the valve on. And again, we want to be careful of the threads, we don't cross them. Now that's caught. And again, I have to use that wrench to hold that pipe. I don't want to do any stress on that 100-year-old thread that's down underneath the floor.

Ryan

Right.

Richard

Alright. So now we see the gap you've been trying to deal with,

right here. Ryan

Right.

Richard

Now, we could just muscle this thing and push this pipe over, but if we did that it would make this pipe potentially bend a little bit, which would make this face no longer plumb to the opposing side.

Ryan

I think that was my problem the first time.

Richard

Okay. So we're gonna try to outsmart this thing, alright? I looked down below. There's play on both of these pipes, so I'm gonna use the power of leverage. So you're gonna take a wedge right here. I want you to bang that down against the pipe on that side.

Okay. Richard

Thereby, we're gonna draw the pipe this way, the radiator this way, but also I'm gonna use these straps to come around here. And then with the two-by right here, we're gonna use the power of a lever. So as we pull down here, it should draw the bottom of the radiator up to the face of the unit. So that's gonna make it. But you see this, where it's just a little bit high on the pipe.

Ryan

Yeah.

Richard

So we're gonna use another lever. So why don't you take this as a fulcrum, back a little bit, and a lever. And just lift this up, right when I say so. And then when we get it up there, I want you to try to catch the nut on those threads, alright?

Ryan

Alright.

Richard

'Cause I'm gonna hold it up. So, ready? You lift, lift, not too much.

You're too high. Ryan

Yep.

Richard

We need the radiator up slightly -- the radiator up just a nail.

Ryan

Like right there?

Richard

Yep. Yeah, baby!

Yahtzee. Richard

Okay. So now, let's get a wrench on that -- three-corner bite. Okay. So, this is the last of the radiators to vent. You can hear the air coming out. It's getting close. I can hear the gurgle. Ooh. Alright. So there it is. So now, all the radiators are now filled with water. Air came up through the vent, and you're ready to go. I have the burner on. In a little while, this office is gonna be roasty-toasty.

Ryan

I cannot wait, Richard. Thank you so much.

Richard

Alright. Thanks for helping. Good luck with your new daughter.

Ryan

Thank you. I really appreciate it.

Mark

Hi,

Lara. Lara

Hey, Mark.

Mark

I love this neighborhood. I've actually worked on a number of houses around here -- a lot of Dutch colonials, a lot of colonials.

Yeah. Mark

Interior, exterior are kind of similar, but always different.

Lara

Yeah. So, ours is from 1929. We really wanted an old house. And a lot of it was redone, and we thought, "Oh, great. It's all done." And then as we lived here for a time, we've realized, oh, it was flipped, and not flipped so well. So come on inside. I'll show you around.

Mark

Alright.

Lara

So, here's the living room.

Mark

Oh, very nice. Nice crown molding.

Lara

Thank you. And the fireplace -- the telltale sign that a flipper was here.

Mark

Yeah, I kind of picked up on that. Uh, just to break down what you have, you have the block mantel.

Yep. Mark

Which is just a chunk of wood, cleaned up, thrown on top of the masonry.

Okay. Mark

Below that,

we have that stone veneer. Lara

Uh-huh.

Mark

Alright. Below that, we have a gas fireplace,

which a lot of people like. Lara

Yeah.

Mark

You throw a switch, you have a flame.

Lara

It's a nice touch. That's what we really

liked about the place. Mark

Right.

Lara

And then, sitting on this couch, looking at the mantel, I noticed this is really done poorly.

Mark

Something's up,

yeah. Lara

Yeah.

Mark

Well, a few things, anyway.

Lara

Mm-hmm.

Mark

Just to start in the face...

Yep. Mark

...you can see that these are not individual pieces. They're actually blocks that are weaved in together.

Lara

Okay.

Mark

And when I can see that weave, it's probably not a good job.

That's the first thing. Lara

Okay.

Mark

But another thing, again, if you look at this corner, they actually sell corner pieces which would give you the illusion that you have a full stone going back into the wall.

Mm-hmm. Mark

What they have done is they tried to make it a 45, but you can see they stick out like tabs. And again, they'll give you that inconsistent, unclean look that we're not trying for. And now that we're down low, Lara, look at this.

Ugh. Mark

See how they tried to mate the stone to the mantel?

Lara

Yeah. It just looks so messy.

Mark

Did a very sloppy job.

Lara

So, if you look here, you can actually see the red brick underneath. And I was wondering if it was possible to clean that up and just get it back to the original.

Mark

Unfortunately, no. Once they applied this stone with that thin-set mortar, takes a grab and leaves a lot of residue on it.

Lara

Mm-hmm.

Mark

So we'll take a lot of it down, but we're not gonna be able to clean that brick.

Okay. Mark

But we do have what they call a thin-brick veneer.

Okay. Mark

And that will give you

the appearance of a brick. Lara

Yep.

Mark

Okay? And we're gonna bring it up eight inches on each side, eight inches across, and that will mimic exactly what you had back here in 1920.

Lara

And then after, we can add the wooden mantel around -- the more traditional look?

Mark

That's right. I'm not a carpenter, but I'm gonna leave the brick in such a manner that they'll be able just to bring the mantel in and tack it to the wall and be done.

Lara

Awesome.

Mark

Alright, Lara. So,

this is the fun part. Lara

Okay.

It's called demo. Lara

Alright.

Mark

What we're gonna do is we're gonna look for a little wedge, okay, to see if we can fit our tool in.

Okay. Mark

We're gonna pound that and see if we can get an opening, or create an opening for ourselves.

Okay. Mark

And that way, we'll be able to get a bigger chisel in with a big hammer, and just clean it up as we go.

Sounds good. Mark

There you go. You're working it.

Lara

Whoo!

Mark

That's it. So now that you have an opening, you should be able to pop everything right out. Okay, one little trick, Lara, is now that you've made this indentation right here, I would take the sledgehammer and just bust that whole thing up as much as possible. And then, as you're working the chisel through, it'll come out easier. There you go. Yeah. Alright, you got it. I like the way you're trying to pull back on that chisel now. You can see it pop off the wall. Yeah,

there you go. Lara

Whoo!

Mark

Alright, now we're cooking.

Lara

Alright.

Mark

That's it. You're finding the gaps. That's it.

Lara

Alright. What's next?

Mark

Alright. So, what I was just doing is checking to make sure

that the unit was level. Lara

Yep.

It is. Lara

Okay.

Mark

And as talked about before, we took that veneer off. We really didn't know what the condition was gonna be.

Lara

Right, right, right.

Mark

So now we have a good look at it. But you can see, it's almost what we thought. Some of that thin-set is still on the brick.

It's not gonna come off. Lara

Okay.

Mark

So what we're gonna have to do with this

is cover it again. Lara

Okay.

Mark

So what we're gonna use is a thin-brick veneer.

Okay. Mark

This is actually a brick that's been cut thinly, like that. And we're gonna just bring it up the leg, bring it across,

and up the other leg as well. Lara

Okay.

Mark

So you can see, pretty good look.

Yeah. Mark

It looks exactly like the brick behind it. The next thing we're gonna want to do, which is probably the most important, is gonna be layout. And what I'm gonna use to help me with that is a brick rule. One one side, it's a normal ruler. But on the other side, it's a series of numbers with increments that are gonna help me with the spacing. So I'm just going from edge to edge. And that's my layout. I'm gonna follow the number two all the way across. That will give me the correct spacing that I need. We're using a thin-set, just like a tiler would. It prevents the brick from sagging because it has a fast setup time. And there's also an adhesive in it that helps stick the brick to the wall. When laying tile, because the surface that you're laying on is flat, a notched trowel is very handy. Here, I decided to back-butter each brick because the brick behind it is inconsistently laid, and there are holes in the joints. People think that veneering is a material. It's actually a technique. It can be brick. It can be plaster. It can be stone. So if you're looking for this material in the store, it's not thin-brick veneer. It's just thin brick. As I back-butter these into place, I do wiggle the brick just to make sure it fills in all the voids. And then I take the level and make sure I'm level and plumb. Now we're ready to fill in the joints. And I'm just gonna use a regular type N mortar, and use the same technique that I would if I were repointing a wall.

Lara

So you don't have to do it in a straight shot. You can do it little bit by little bit.

Mark

No, exactly. You just want to make sure the joint is full, so the edge and the edge want to ride each brick.

Lara

Okay. I see what you're saying.

Mark

Yeah. So try that one and that one. Perfect.

There you go. Lara

Except that I got that.

Mark

Well, we'll go over and fix that. And now, I'm gonna concentrate on the first half of that joiner...

like that. Lara

Okay.

Mark

And now, I can go... basically where I want. You see me stuff it in?

Lara

Uh-huh.

Mark

Boom. Go to the top, make sure I stuff it. Coming back around, next brick. Fill that void. When I feel like I'm full, again, I'm working my way in. Yeah. Great, stuff it in. Make sure you push it with the joiner. Great. Now watch this. I'm just gonna push in, and then ride up. I know I'm full, so when I come down I'm coming into something full.

It's looking really good. Mark

Alright. We're -- We're about halfway there.

Yeah. Mark

We still have to wait three or four weeks, because when the carpenter comes in to do the mantel and the new surround, he's gonna bang it around a bit. So we wait three or four weeks, this stuff sets up. It's gonna look like -- After the mantel, it's gonna look like it's been here since 1929.

Sounds good. Mark

Alright.

Lara

Thank you so much,

Mark. Mark

Oh, you're welcome.

Kevin

Boy, looking good. That's a nice transformation.

Mark

Yeah. She was happy.

Kevin

So, I like the brick rule, although I'll be honest -- I don't quite understand it.

Mark

Well, every trade has a trick.

You know that. Kevin

Yeah.

Mark

And this is the mason's little trick. On one side, you can see it looks like a regular ruler.

Kevin

So, we're inches and all the little increments.

Mark

Inches, yeah. Quarter-inch, half-inch, sure. Uh, opening -- typical opening for a fireplace is 26 inches high. If I just lay brick after brick, I don't know if I'd get there. This brick rule, if I throw it around you can see all these different numbers here.

Kevin

Yeah. So, that's all Greek to me. Those are just hash marks. What do those mean? How are you using it?

Mark

So, all I do is I place it up against my opening.

Mm-hmm. Mark

And you can see the increments going from one to ten.

Kevin

Yep,

right here. Mark

Right.

Kevin

So, that one lands on a -- it looks like a four.

Mark

That's a four, and it climbs all the way up as such.

Kevin

Four, four, four. Cool.

Mark

And through that plan, I'm eventually gonna hit my height.

But if you go over here -- Kevin

You are at a -- It looks like a seven, seven, seven, seven. So this is the difference between a seven joint

and a four joint. Mark

That's right. So that gives me the ability to adjust my height as I go.

Kevin

So, Mark, you were trying to hit 26. But when you flip it around, I notice that it doesn't really land right on a four.

Right. Kevin

It's a little off. So if you play the fours, you're gonna miss that mark.

Mark

But I do have an opportunity to adjust that,

and that's at my bottom course. Kevin

Oh.

Mark

So this first joint can go up or down, according to what I need to finish at.

Kevin

Perfect. And are you marking it once, or are you adjusting all along the way?

Mark

I usually mark everything up once, story-pole -- story-pole style. But, uh, sometimes bricks are irregular. So I do take the opportunity as I go halfway up to re-measure.

Kevin

So you can jump from, say, a four to a three, and the eye probably won't pick it up?

Mark

The eye will not pick that up, right.

Kevin

Beautiful. Next to the three, I'm seeing a red six.

Mark

A red six -- That six is gonna indicate the amount of courses that we need to get to where we're going.

Of course it does. Mark

So, again, great tool.

Kevin

So now you can estimate how many brick you need to finish the job.

Mark

That's right, so you're not taking off extra brick from the stage at the end of the day.

Kevin

Good information, Mark. And, uh, hm, thanks.

Mark

Oh, well, hey. Alright.

Laughs

Mark

Kevin

Next time on "Ask This Old House"...

Man

You don't feel it on a summer day like today, but in the winter, my hands get dry. I get a zap from the static when I touch the outlet.

Richard

Up here in the mountains, the air can get a bit dry. I'm heading to Park City, Utah, to help a house get a little more comfortable.

Jenn

These containers look great every summer, but they don't last through the winter. I've got some ideas to fix that.

Kevin

And did you know that where you live affects how you pay for electricity? I'll walk you through the different types of billing and give you some advice on how to save money.