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The following program is a PBS Wisconsin original production.

Andre Jacque:
We’re just looking to not have our ideas precluded from discussion.

Frederica Freyberg:
Tensions flare at the Capitol.

Tony Evers:
This is to release the money so that we can finally get this project going.

Frederica Freyberg:
As lawmakers take a big first step toward large scale prison reform.

Mary Felzkowski:
Our correction system is in a world of hurt right now. We need to move it forward.

Frederica Freyberg:
I’m Frederica Freyberg. Tonight on “Here & Now,” what’s on the table for plans to begin an overhaul of the state’s troubled and outdated prisons. Tariffs, labor shortages and increasing health care costs, the hits keep coming for Wisconsin farmers, but could there be some relief. And food banks brace for increased demand. It’s “Here & Now” for October 31.

Announcer:
Funding for “Here & Now” is provided by the Focus Fund for Journalism and Friends of PBS Wisconsin.

Frederica Freyberg:
A major overhaul of Wisconsin’s prison system got off the starting blocks this week, when the State Building Commission voted to approve $15 million to start the planning phase. As “Here & Now” reporter Steven Potter tells us, Governor Tony Evers’ six-year, $500 million plan is wide ranging and touches multiple institutions across the state.

Dora Drake:
We need to ensure that folks that are currently incarcerated need to have adequate conditions, at least. That’s the bare minimum.

Steven Potter:
In a proposal from Governor Tony Evers that’s supported by his fellow Democrats in the state Legislature, several significant upgrades and changes would be made to the state prison system.

Andre Jacque:
We’re the only path forward, and I certainly hope that we can still find a way forward is through bipartisan consensus.

Steven Potter:
Recently, Evers again urged the State Building Commission, which met earlier this week, to approve spending $15 million to set in motion what he calls a comprehensive correctional facilities plan. The governor first unveiled this plan, which he calls a “domino series of projects across six DOC facilities” during the state budget process earlier this year.

Tony Evers:
These steps are each a critical part, a crucial part of this comprehensive plan. And they have to happen together.

Steven Potter:
Primary among these changes is closing the Green Bay Correctional Institution, a 125-year-old facility, which has seen severe understaffing and overcrowding issues, as well as inmate violence and lengthy prisoner lockdowns. Another change would be to transform the Waupun Correctional Institution into a “vocational village that would create skills training and workforce readiness programs for inmates to help them land jobs after their release.” Other changes include converting the Stanley Correctional Institution into a larger capacity maximum security facility, and converting the John Burke Correctional Center, also in Waupun, into a female institution and adding hundreds of more beds there. The Evers’ plan also calls for adding more minimum-security beds to the Sanger B. Powers Correctional Center in Outagamie County, and to convert the long-troubled youth prisons of Lincoln Hills and Copper Lake in far northern Wisconsin into adult facilities.

Tony Evers:
There’s not an alternative to my plan that is safer, faster and cheaper. Period. Except for doing nothing.

Steven Potter:
State Senator Dora Drake, who represents parts of and some suburbs of northern Milwaukee, wants to see the funding for the plan move forward.

Dora Drake:
Put funding where it needs to go so we can close down some of our facilities that we know are severely outdated and it’s harmful for folks that are incarcerated and the workers. Provide a different system where we are providing vocational opportunities.

Steven Potter:
Separate and aside from this push for Governor Evers’ new prison plans, there is already major change underway for where the state houses minors convicted of serious crimes. And that’s through the construction of a brand-new youth prison for boys in Milwaukee, being built in Senator Drake’s district. With money already allocated, the new youth prison in Milwaukee is expected to cost $78 million. It will include educational, vocational, counseling and recreational programs aimed at lowering the recidivism rate for young people in the juvenile justice system.

Dora Drake:
It’s needed because our children need to be closer to home. If we’re serious about uplifting our young people, then all of us have a part to play in that. Point blank, period.

Steven Potter:
Drake points out that the state corrections system needs all of these changes, and even more adjustments to better help the majority of prisoners who will ultimately be released.

Dora Drake:
Whether you’re a child or an adult, you are coming home. And so what are we doing to ensure that you get the wraparound services to not only come back home and have a fair shot at being successful, but what can we be doing as a state in being proactive?

Steven Potter:
Reporting from Madison, I’m Steven Potter for “Here & Now.”

Frederica Freyberg:
Despite the unanimous consensus to approve funding for this initial planning phase, it was not without friction between Republican members of the commission and its chair, Democratic Governor Tony Evers, over how these funds will be used and who will have input in this forthcoming planning process.

Andre Jacque:
And again, I think the $15 million was put forward with the idea that there could be a collaborative process. That’s not in what was brought forward to the Building Commission.

Tony Evers:
We never got to this point because we never had a vote like this. This is important for the state of Wisconsin to understand that we are serious about this project. We will continue. You know, you have my word. I’m here for another year and several months. And you have my, my — my promise to you is that this is one step of many, and that step will include all the legislators that want to be involved. We’ve tried to do that in the past. What we have thus far didn’t come just from us. It came from other legislators. And so we’re hoping for that to happen going forward.

Frederica Freyberg:
State Senate President Mary Felzkowski is a Republican member of the Building Commission and, along with other Republicans, voted with reservations to fund the planning phase. We sat down with Senator Felzkowski at the Capitol following the vote. Thanks so much for doing this.

Mary Felzkowski:
It’s a pleasure.

Frederica Freyberg:
So the $15 million that the commission unanimously approved is meant to start the planning process. And Governor Evers said, “it’s important for the state to know we are serious about this project.” How serious are lawmakers taking this prison revamp project?

Mary Felzkowski:
So the state and the lawmakers have been very serious about this since, I think it was 2018 when we passed the closure of Lincoln Hills and moving forward with the SJOs.

And if you look at it, we’ve had numerous council studies around revamping corrections. We’ve had legislators from the Green Bay area trying to close the Green Bay Correctional Institute for years and do other types of reforms. So this has been a forefront for a lot of us for a lot of years.

Frederica Freyberg:
But what concerns do you have even ahead of this planning process?

Mary Felzkowski:
So I think, you know, corrections has been in disarray under many governors. And Governor Evers, when he first ran against Governor Walker — what is that? Eight years ago now? — ran on corrections reform and has done really nothing. He’s pushed for the closure of Lincoln Hills, but we’ve all been working towards a closure of Lincoln Hills. So that’s not something special that he’s been doing. And now all of a sudden, in 2025 budgetary cycle, he comes out with a proposal and he’s kind of like shoving it down our throats. And he didn’t include anybody in this proposal. Not his own legislative Democrats and he’s kind of given us a take it or leave it proposal. I don’t — I don’t think that’s how this should work. Now he wants $15 million to move forward with that plan. There was a press release that yesterday the governor doesn’t even — didn’t even seem like he remembered putting out two weeks ago, that said, you have to release this money. Don’t hold it up. Whatever.

Frederica Freyberg:
You took objection to that.

Mary Felzkowski:
Um hm. How is that a bipartisan move forward? And under his proposal, because right now, we have over 1100 medium security inmates that are housed in maximum security institutions. And because of that, they’re not receiving any programing to help them. They’re not where they need to be. Under this proposal, he’s releasing them into society in order to move forward with the building modifications that he wants to do. So you’re going to take 700 people that have had no programing and release them under a program earned release that normally they would go through programing, mental health programing and other things and just release them into society. How is that good for the safety of constituents to release people out into society? And if you look at some of the crimes that have been committed by these people, it’s not safe. It’s not well thought out. And the sad part about it, we don’t have to do that. We gave them alternatives yesterday where we could expand Jackson. We could expand Taycheedah, move people into those programs. Lincoln Hills can be converted. We can take over 500 inmates there, close Green Bay and expand on other areas. It’s just not — what he’s doing is not well thought out.

Frederica Freyberg:
In the meantime, though, he said to you that you have my promise. This is one step of many, and the next step will include all legislators that want to be involved. Are you confident in that promise?

Mary Felzkowski:
I’m not going to use the term confident, cautiously optimistic. Cautiously optimistic.

Frederica Freyberg:
Is there danger of partisan politics kind of derailing this whole effort to redo the correctional system in Wisconsin?

Mary Felzkowski:
That’s what’s been happening so far. I’m hoping that with the governor’s words yesterday, we get away from partisan politics and move towards doing what’s right for the citizens for once.

Frederica Freyberg:
In terms of those 700 inmates and their release, does that skirt in your mind toward kind of prison reform policy, or do you think it’s simply just to make the dominoes, as they’re called, work in this project?

Mary Felzkowski:
There was things in the governor’s proposal that I think every one of us could have gotten behind, because I think a lot — some of his ideas were positive. That’s why I think it would have been nice to include everyone. So this isn’t a — this doesn’t have to be a Democrat or a Republican idea. Prison reform across the United States has been very nonpartisan. We can all work towards the same ideas. But when you — when you give somebody a proposal and say, take it or leave it, here it is. This is what we’re moving forward with. And especially when it’s not even a good proposal, how do you think the other sides are going to react?

Frederica Freyberg:
Reiterate for me what the prongs of a good proposal would be in your mind?

Mary Felzkowski:
I think we do need policy change where we need to look at the programing as it’s out there. Former Assemblyman Mike Schram had the idea around — I’ll use Waupun, for example, of making that into more of an academy where medium and minimum security inmates could get programing education so that when they are entry into society, they are ready to go and they’re educated and more into a work environment so they can become productive members of society. One of the things that we see around prisoner reentry, if they can have a home, have a job, and become productive, they are much less likely to re-offend. They become productive, self-esteem, can take care of their families. That’s a winning message in the corrections reform. Those are ideas that have worked in other states. Those are some ideas that could have been brought to the table. I hope we can count on the governor being true to his word, and that he brings all people together, and that we can put a plan together, because our corrections system is in a world of hurt right now. We need to move it forward.

Frederica Freyberg:
In a sea of not great news, Wisconsin farmers could see a boost after President Donald Trump met with China this week. As a result of the talks, China promised to restart buying U.S. soybeans after halting such purchases in May. Wisconsin farmers waylaid by trade disputes could at least see a better market for soybeans, but they’re still facing trade trouble for beef, rising costs, and for the many farmers who, as small business owners, depend on Affordable Care Act health plans, hikes in premiums. We pick up now with Brad Olson, president of the Wisconsin Farm Bureau. And thanks a lot for being here.

Brad Olson:
Thank you for having me.

Frederica Freyberg:
So, all told, what kind of headwinds are Wisconsin farmers facing right now?

Brad Olson:
Well, just increasing costs, fertilizer, feed, all of those are increasing at a time when, when other than the price of fat cattle, everything is down. Corn are down, beans have been down. Milk is not good. So lots of — lots of headwinds out there. On the other hand, farmers have faced this in the past and are resilient.

Frederica Freyberg:
Are the input costs for things like fertilizer and feed having to do with trade?

Brad Olson:
Not so much. Certainly a little bit. I mean, if you, you know, from the potash side of things, 80% of our potash comes from Canada, so we certainly want good stable trade with Canada on that side to keep the potash prices normal.

Frederica Freyberg:
How welcome is the news that China will start buying soybeans again?

Brad Olson:
Oh, extremely welcome. I mean, a big deal not just in Wisconsin but across the nation to get China back, you know, maybe not this year, but the next two years of buying what they have in the past is exceptional good news for soybean farmers and all farmers across the nation.

Frederica Freyberg:
Is it expected that China will buy enough to kind of offset that country not buying since May?

Brad Olson:
Well, they’re going to buy roughly, you know, 12 million metric tons this year, which isn’t going to make up the whole difference. But at the end of the day, it’s going to make a big difference. And moving forward to ’26 and ’27 with that promise to buy back to the, you know, the same level that they had been is certainly going to help agriculture out in the long run here.

Frederica Freyberg:
What about beef producers in Wisconsin with President Trump’s plan to quadruple imports from Argentina. Is that a significant impact in this state?

Brad Olson:
I guess time will tell. You know, certainly it’s the first time that beef producers have been profitable in a number of years. So we’re certainly concerned and keeping an eye on that on a regular, very regular basis.

Frederica Freyberg:
As to this government shutdown and the fight over Affordable Care Act enhanced premiums or enhanced tax credits, how dependent are Wisconsin farmers on kind of marketplace plans?

Brad Olson:
Somewhat. Fortunately Wisconsin Farm Bureau is again this year going to try and get the Tennessee Health Plan passed here in Wisconsin, which would help farmers considerably that are in that in-between. Maybe don’t — are not eligible for the Affordable Health Care Act, but at the same point, can’t afford regular health care from, you know, companies across the state or the nation. So again, we’re working on trying to find that middle ground where we can — where we can help members out.

Frederica Freyberg:
And what does that health plan offered by the Farm Bureau do? I mean, what is that plan?

Brad Olson:
It’s just a health plan that — not necessarily insurance, but a plan that is typically, like I say, it isn’t for people who necessarily on the affordable health care, but also people who cannot necessarily afford it — it finds them, them people that are in between, right?

Frederica Freyberg:
And so that would require legislation from the state?

Brad Olson:
It would require legislation from the state and being signed by the governor. Fourteen other states around the nation have it.

Frederica Freyberg:
And what are those prospects for that happening?

Brad Olson:
A little better than 50/50, I think.

Frederica Freyberg:
Well, those aren’t bad odds, really. But…

Brad Olson:
No, no.

Frederica Freyberg:
Another kind of hot topic. The 2025 Farm Bill, the largest piece of which is SNAP, which we’re all talking about right now. How is work on that progressing?

Brad Olson:
Well, there again, we need not just for SNAP benefits, but everybody across the nation, farmers, everyone in day-to-day businesses. We need to get the federal government back up and going again. You know, you go to the airport, the TSA people aren’t necessarily being paid. We need those people to be paid. And hopefully here, hopefully this week we’ll see some movement and get the government open again and get those people paid, as well as get recipients of federal programs taken care of.

Frederica Freyberg:
You know, another issue that has been discussed in the ag world is labor and labor shortages. Is that something that Wisconsin farmers are increasingly struggling with?

Brad Olson:
Yeah, I think so. You know, it’s — agriculture is a labor-dependent business. And so it has always been that and we’ve just, you know, rural America, rural Wisconsin is shrinking. So we don’t have those neighbors and those other farm kids to necessarily fill those jobs.

Frederica Freyberg:
We leave it there. Brad Olson, thanks very much for your time.

Brad Olson:
Thank you very much.

Frederica Freyberg:
As of tomorrow, SNAP or FoodShare benefits are due to run out because of the government shutdown. Wisconsin gets about $115 million a month from the feds to help some 700,000 people be able to buy groceries. State Attorney General Josh Kaul signed on to a multi-state lawsuit to tap contingency funds in the USDA to cover SNAP into November.

Josh Kaul:
A government shutdown has never stopped states from distributing these critical benefits to those who need them. So this lawsuit is about protecting FoodShare funding and preventing Wisconsinites and millions of others from around the country, from losing access to what can be life sustaining food assistance as the government shutdown moves forward.

Frederica Freyberg:
Following a hearing in the lawsuit, the federal judge in Massachusetts indicated she would order the Trump administration to send SNAP funds to states. So the familiar uncertainty persists. But adding to the federal SNAP cliff, some 18,000 federal workers in Wisconsin are mostly going without a paycheck. Where to turn for help to feed the family in the midst of it. Food banks and pantries are girding for a rush on their services. We turn to Jackie Anderson, executive director of Feeding Wisconsin, a statewide network of food banks. And thanks very much for being here.

Jackie Anderson:
Thank you for having me.

Frederica Freyberg:
So what kind of trepidation do you have going forward with potential lapses or disruptions in FoodShare benefits?

Jackie Anderson:
We’re very concerned about having enough food because we know that people already, in preparation for not being able to receive their SNAP benefits in the month of November, they’re starting to stock up. So across the state, we’re really thinking about how can we ensure that everybody has the amount of food that they had until the government opens up again and SNAP benefits will go back on EBT cards.

Frederica Freyberg:
You’re saying with people kind of stocking up even ahead of any kind of cut of SNAP funding, that you’re having difficulties because the costs are going up?

Jackie Anderson:
Yeah, we’ve seen that some vendors, because they know that there is pressure to make sure that we have food on our shelves. There are some significant increases that we’re seeing in some parts of the state. So, you know, we’re really trying to encourage people to use their SNAP benefits in the month of November because there was some miscommunication saying that a person could not use their SNAP benefits throughout the month of November, and that is inaccurate. The confusion was around whether or not stores would accept their EBT cards in the month of November, and the message — and that because of messaging that hadn’t come from on the federal level. And so we needed to be clear that everybody can use their benefits. So let’s say you have a balance left over in October. You absolutely can use that in the month of November.

Frederica Freyberg:
How have food prices already taxed your services even ahead of all of this, the shutdown?

Jackie Anderson:
We know that — what numbers we were looking at were actually pre-COVID. So we know already because of inflation that people cannot keep food in their shelves like they had previously done. So we know — we knew already that we didn’t have enough food at the food bank and food pantry world to keep everybody fed. And now this is just increased what we need to do.

Frederica Freyberg:
As to the lawsuit to tap USDA contingency funds to cover SNAP through November, what’s your response to the administration saying they can’t do that?

Jackie Anderson:
Yeah, it’s frustrating because we know that there is funds on the federal level. We know that there’s funds at the state level as well. The funding is there. It’s just a matter of releasing it. And it is a political game at this point. And everybody needs to come together because people are going to go hungry. And that is not something that anyone should play around with. We need to really take advantage of the funds that are there and release them.

Frederica Freyberg:
It does seem like a policy choice, because there are some lawmakers who believe that the SNAP program is bloated or rife with abuse and fraud. What do you know about that?

Jackie Anderson:
It’s not. We see time and time again, and we know the vast majority of people who are using SNAP benefits absolutely are working more. They work 1 or 2 jobs. It’s not — it’s not fraud. It’s not fraud, waste and abuse. We know that people who need it are 700,000 people throughout the state of Wisconsin. Of them, a large percentage are senior citizens and families with children. It’s not people who are taking advantage of the system.

Frederica Freyberg:
Even with a court order, could recipients experience a lapse in FoodShare?

Jackie Anderson:
Absolutely. So even when, let’s say funding is released and it goes back on their EBT cards, we know that there will be a slight delay just to get everything up and running again. So we’re being really clear in the messaging around that, that even when the government opens up, it’s not going to be a miraculous, you know, addition on their EBT cards. It’s going to take a couple of days to get things up and running.

Frederica Freyberg:
So Feeding Wisconsin secures donations from retailers, food companies, local donors and ag producers. Have those donations kept pace with this demand?

Jackie Anderson:
It’s interesting. So our food banks collect a lot of donations. And what you just spoke about, I think where we’re seeing the biggest lapse right now is corporate donors. And that could be because of tariffs. Like there’s a lot of reasons why that’s happening. But on the whole, there is donations. So many people want to help out right now. We encourage anybody if they are interested in helping out, go straight to the food bank or the food pantries instead of doing individual food drives. That is where you can get the most for your money. Where they have purchasing power, they understand what their community needs.

Frederica Freyberg:
So for people who have never sought out food pantries, what should they know?

Jackie Anderson:
Yeah, they should know that our food pantries are welcoming and that they are there to help the community. They try to communicate what is available. Most, not most — all food banks and food pantries, they are — their times are listed on their websites and sometimes those change based on if it’s a mobile pantry. Also, expect long lines. We’re seeing right now, you know, where there used to be maybe an hour-long line. Now it’s 2 to 3 hours long, so expect a delay. If you could get there during the distribution hours early, that will help ensure that there’s enough food for you.

Frederica Freyberg:
Is it true that right now, there are many first-time users kind of of pantries?

Jackie Anderson:
Yeah, absolutely, especially in those military communities. We know that there are first timers. You know, anyone else who is a federal worker. If they’re not getting paid, we know that they’re going to be first timers as well as just people who are struggling too because of the cost of groceries right now. So, absolutely, the number of first timers is high.

Frederica Freyberg:
All right. Jackie Anderson, thanks very much.

Jackie Anderson:
Thank you.

Frederica Freyberg:
For more on this and other issues facing Wisconsin, visit our website at PBSWisconsin.org and then click on the news tab. That’s our program for tonight. I’m Frederica Freyberg.

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Funding for “Here & Now” is provided by the Focus Fund for Journalism and Friends of PBS Wisconsin.