Podcasts

Zac Schultz:
Good afternoon, and welcome to Milwaukee, host city for the 2024 Republican National Convention. This is a special presentation of Here & Now‘s 2024 election coverage. We are coming to you live from media row inside Panther Arena in downtown Milwaukee. I’m Zac Schultz, senior political reporter for Here & Now, and I am joined by our esteemed political pundits: Bill McCoshen, Scot Ross. Thank you, gentlemen, both for being here today.

Bill McCoshen:
Thanks for having us.

Scot Ross:
Great to be here.

Zac Schultz:
Well, first off, let’s start with the overall atmosphere. It’s hot, Milwaukee, but it’s a nice day, people are here. How do you feel at the beginning of this convention for the Republicans, Bill?

Bill McCoshen:
I’ll say it’s the most unified convention I’ve been to. This is my fifth convention, and people here are excited about the president. They’re excited about his pick for VP at some point this afternoon. We’ll get to that during the program, and they’re just excited to get rolling with the general election.

Zac Schultz:
Scot, what are your vibes as you’re walking in here today?

Scot Ross:
I mean, I’ve seen a lot of people with smiles, like Bill said. You know — it definitely, I was — I had to squeegee off by the time I got in here, because it is a sticky mess outside. But what I’ve noticed most is just kind of how different sort of the two parties are in terms of like their message, what they perceive as the facts, what they perceive as the truth, that sort of thing. Everybody’s been very nice, but I’m seeing and hearing things that just don’t compute sometimes.

Zac Schultz:
Well, we saw a landslide shift occur in the nation in just the last couple of days…

Bill McCoshen:
Yeah.

Zac Schultz:
…with the attempted assassination of former President Donald Trump in Butler, Pennsylvania. We’ve seen a lot of tone change and messages coming from both President Biden speaking from the White House, telling people to tamp down the rhetoric. We’ve heard it from Republicans. Bill, what do you think is the general fallout from what happened over the weekend going forward?

Bill McCoshen:
I’m hoping it’s positive, and I’ll take the current president and the former president at their word. They’ve been very gracious, both of them. It was a life-changing event, and we were millimeters away from an actual assassination, which not even an attempt has occurred in the United States of America for 43 years — 1981, Ronald Reagan, was the last time that a president was shot at. So it’s a troubling time, it’s a dark time, but I’m hoping that it brings people together, and allows us to focus on our differences on policy. This is not a civil war. These are policy debates and policy differences. It should never rise to the level of violence on either side, and I think the former First Lady, Melania Trump, had the best statement over the weekend, where she just called for calm. I think if I’m choreographing the president’s remarks, I know that he’s already ripped up his original speech for Thursday night. He’s going to talk about unity. That’s a win. I think if he gives a message of U.S. unity, world unity on Thursday night, people are going to leave here so fired up, it’ll be like no convention in history.

Zac Schultz:
Scot, how do you see the fallout playing out?

Scot Ross:
Well, this was an unacceptable event, and it took me back — I was 11 years old when Ronald Reagan, when John Hinckley attempted to assassinate Ronald Reagan. I was at home that day. I was sick. So I was hanging out watching TV, which is what you do. So I watched all of that unfold, and as this was going on, and I saw and heard, you know, it did take me back to that sort of ugliness about where we were, what happens, but where we don’t want to go back to. Now, I will say this. I am very proud to be a Democrat today, because I did hear so much legitimate concern for the president, for the gentleman who perished, for the injured, and that’s what we need. We need to have decency, and I’ll say this. I watched President Biden’s speech last night, and I think he’s the only one in the race who could deliver a message like that. Violence has no place in this country, period. No exceptions. We cannot allow violence to be normalized. I agree with that 100%. I’m sure Bill agrees with that 100%. I think the people agree with that 100%, but we’ve got to make sure that our elected officials aren’t stoking the fires. I’ve seen some of that, even with politicians in Wisconsin, and I don’t think it’s acceptable.

Bill McCoshen:
So we’re going to disagree on that a little bit. I thought President Biden’s remarks on Saturday night were very good. I thought his remarks yesterday morning were also very good. I think his remarks last night on national television were unfortunate, because they were too scripted. I think he’s better than that. I think they should’ve come from the heart. It should’ve been authentic. They should not have been on a prompter. He could’ve had a couple notes in front of him. Just tell America what you want us to do, right? He’s flubbed a few times last night reading off that prompter, so they clearly weren’t his words. So, yeah, generally speaking, I’m giving him credit, and I think he was good Saturday night and Sunday morning. Last night, I think it was a misstep on the president’s part.

Zac Schultz:
Do you believe that there’s a real tone change, Scot? I mean, can you trust when Donald Trump says, “I’m going to change my tone?”

Scot Ross:
It’s really hard to do it, because so far, the campaign has been about retribution and revenge for he and his wealthy donors, whereas, you know, Joe Biden gets up every day and he is trying to fight for the people of Wisconsin and the people of America. So I don’t. I think it’s going to be hard to say that, because, again, we’ve seen some of the biggest luminaries in the Republican Party — Marjorie Taylor Greene, Lauren Boebert, you know — attacking Biden, and blaming him for the assassination attempt. And in fact, our own congressman in western Wisconsin, Derrick Van Orden, you know, his response to it was to quote the NRA’s “Stand your ground,” and then he was on the radio earlier this morning and talking about that somehow “they” were behind this. It wasn’t a “they.” It was a lone nut-bag from Bethel Park, Pennsylvania — registered Republican, not that that matters — who was behind this. It wasn’t some sort of conspiracy, and to try and insert that into this debate at this time, especially today, when Republicans should be, you know, like Bill said, celebrating their unity, what they want to do for the country, I think it was unfortunate that we have continued to see, and hear, and read things like that.

Bill McCoshen:
Yeah, I think those are limited, and I would say this. My biggest concern is this investigation. How long is it going to take? I think it needs to be immediate, right? And I think the director of the Secret Service should be relieved of her duties. This was a massive security failure. How can someone get on a roof 150 yards from a major candidate for president? Makes no sense to me, and the fact yesterday there was some reporting that the sniper from the U.S. Secret Service actually had this guy in his scope for a couple minutes before the shooting started. Why didn’t he get the green light? Why didn’t he just execute and move forward? It doesn’t make sense that we would allow that to happen on Saturday. So I think we’re going to have to get to the bottom of that for both candidates, frankly.

Zac Schultz:
But when it comes to independents, Democrats, moderates, Republicans who may like what Trump may stand for policy-wise, but have moved away from him tone-wise, what will it take for them to trust what Trump says in terms of his new tone, his new unity message that he’ll actually follow through if he becomes president, when he’s been talking about being a dictator for day one?

Bill McCoshen:
I think Thursday night is a great opportunity for him to reset the tone going forward. I think there’s two major takeaways, Zac, from the last three weeks that are imagery that will last with voters all the way until November, the first being the debate where President Biden looked weak. That’s as far as I’ll go. I’ll be kind about it. And then Saturday, when Donald Trump was nearly assassinated, he gets up and he pumps his fist. He looks strong. And so, that’s the image that’s in voters’ minds right now — one weak candidate, one strong candidate — and I think that works to Trump’s benefit. And as we started the program, I mean, there’s new polling out today that shows Trump leading in all of the swing states. So I think Republicans here have a skip in their step, and there’s a long way to go. There’s 113 days to go. I don’t think anyone should take anything for granted. I agree with Scot. This is ultimately going to be a close race, including in Wisconsin, but I’d rather be in our position right now.

Zac Schultz:
When you saw the photo of Donald Trump pumping his fist with blood coming out of his mouth and in his ear, were your thoughts like, “Oh, you know, Democrats just lost the race,” or is this…

Scot Ross:
No, I didn’t think of that. I thought about the country first. I’m not going to lie, like I was, “What is going on here? How can this be happening?”

Bill McCoshen:
That’s…

Scot Ross:
So, I think that this has to, we have to, you know, we have a political campaign. It is, I still believe, despite the attempted assassination of Donald Trump, it still is a very serious contest for the direction of how the country is going to go, not just for now, but I think decades from now, and that is very serious. But we also have to note what happened. We’ve got to respect the fact that lives, a life was lost, and we need to make sure that…

Bill McCoshen:
Yeah.

Scot Ross:
We’re doing what has to happen to bring this country together, and now the problem is, as Bill knows, governance is supposed to be about bringing people together to solve problems. Campaigns have been about dividing people, cutting off, and I know…

Bill McCoshen:
Trying to rev up your base…

Scot Ross:
Exactly. How do you break it off?

Bill McCoshen:
Yeah.

Scot Ross:
And I guess we’ll see here in the state of Wisconsin, because I, at least from my perspective, I don’t think Donald Trump can be president without winning Wisconsin. I don’t think Joe Biden can be president without winning Wisconsin. So what’s going to happen over the next 113 days to make sure that you’re picking up those swing voters that you need? I think the message of the Republicans is going to be problematic for that, and we’ll see how the tone changes if they can soften their policy a little bit, which I, which again is a tall order given what we’re hearing about their policies.

Bill McCoshen:
I think last week, the announcement of the Agenda 47, which is the Republican platform that will be approved today by the delegates on the convention floor, set the standard. It’s simple, easy to understand. It focuses on the issues people care about, and it minimizes those that divide us, right, like abortion. So I think that was well-crafted, and it’s simple for any voter of any level of interest to pay attention to.

Zac Schultz:
So we’ll come back to the platform a little bit later, but I do have, staying on the tone of what’s changed since the weekend, even before that event, there were concerns about violence in Milwaukee during this week. Would there be white nationalists coming? Would Proud Boys be popping out of a U-Haul, and engaging with counter-protestors? After today, do you think there will be political violence this week in Milwaukee?

Bill McCoshen:
None, not from the right. I mean, you think about it, our candidate was nearly assassinated on Saturday night. No cities were lit on fire, like Kenosha or Minneapolis. No buildings were looted, like Oakland, California, or many other places across the country. That’s not how we act on our side. I don’t expect that. I think Donald Trump will make sure that that does not happen. But I have never, again, this is my fifth convention, I’ve never seen more law enforcement in my lifetime. So if there’s any benefit from Saturday night, and I want to…

Scot Ross:
Yeah.

Bill McCoshen:
…make sure I’m careful about it, this place is locked down.

Zac Schultz:
Do you expect any conflict between, not necessarily in the perimeter, but between protesters on the fringes?

Scot Ross:
I’m certainly hoping not. I mean, again, people are inflamed about a lot of different things, and unfortunately, we can’t forget what’s happened before Saturday, which is, we had a president in Donald Trump who, you know, with the Proud Boys, “Stand up,” and, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. We had notions of him, he and Republicans mocking when the Speaker, when Speaker Pelosi’s octogenarian husband was attacked with a hammer. They have, I think that they have some atonement, amends to do, to make sure that people believe that they really are not condoning violence, because there’s been a lot of terrible record, and there’s certainly record, there’s certainly rhetoric on the left, but not at the level of elected officials that we’ve seen it on the right, and I think that’s where the real challenge is.

Zac Schultz:
All right, we have breaking news. I’ve just been told that JD Vance is the pick for VP. First reactions?

Bill McCoshen:
Well, he’s the youngest one in the field, 39 years old. He’s a brand-new senator, he’s an author, he’s a military veteran, he’s a Harvard Law School graduate. [Editor’s note: JD Vance is a graduate of Yale Law School, not Harvard Law School] He is the rags to riches story. This guy grew up with an addicted mother, a single mother, and his grandmother basically raised him and his sister, and he is literally a rags to riches story who clawed for everything he got in his life, and I think that’s, I think that will resonate with America.

Zac Schultz:
Scot, what do you think of him?

Scot Ross:
Well, I think two things. One, he’s our first, I guess, Netflix candidate, because he had his little movie on Netflix.

Bill McCoshen:
I guess so.

Scot Ross:
And I guess the second thing is will it take till tonight before Democrats have videos up of JD Vance trashing Donald Trump over and over again as he did in 2016?

Zac Schultz:
Well, and the question has to be why does Trump need a new VP? Where’s Mike Pence? I mean, how much does that factor into why, do people actually care why he needs a new VP?

Bill McCoshen:
Well, I don’t think so, not on our side, and getting to — I went to the welcome party last night at Summerfest grounds, and I talked to several people who were not Donald Trump supporters who are now all in after Saturday night. So I don’t think they care that much who he picks. I would’ve had, my preference would’ve been someone like Glenn Youngkin. I think he adds more to the ticket. But the more I learn about JD Vance, I’m sure I’m going to be able to be as excited about him, and, again, I think he’s got the most compelling backstory. He is Americana, literally a rags to riches from Appalachia to Harvard Law School to the U.S. military to now the vice presidential candidate for the Republican Party.

Zac Schultz:
I mean, does it really matter which Republican it was? I mean, every single one of ’em is going to have a point in time where they were trashing Donald Trump, ’cause there really weren’t very many that hadn’t at this point, and now claim to be best friends with him.

Scot Ross:
Well, I mean, yes and no. I mean, I think the importance here is why we need a new vice presidential pick, and I think that that’s, I think that is important. I think the fact that what Mike Pence went through, and how Donald Trump, again with January 6th, tried to overturn the results of a democratically decided election in which five law enforcement officers ended up losing their lives, 140 law enforcement officers were injured, and we almost had a coup basically overturning a democratically decided election in which there was a gallows and people chanting, “Hang Mike Pence!” So, I think that’s really, really important to remember, because it’s such an ugly stain on our America, not just on our American politics, and it can never, ever, something like that, happen again. But, you know, the vice presidential debate, the vice presidential sweepstakes are always a lot of fun. It certainly was fun when Paul Ryan got his in 2012. It was the first time I ever saw Ryan roughed up by the media, and it was interesting. But I do think, again, it’s going to be, I think the reason that JD Vance is the nominee is because, one, he’s from Ohio, and it means that if he wins, the Republican governor gets to appoint the next successor. Two, I think because JD Vance was bought and created by Peter Thiel, the gazillionaire — I don’t even know if the word bigger than billionaire — gazillionaire venture capitalist out in California, who has staked his political campaign gravitas on getting candidates over the primary who then sometimes lose in the primaries. JD Vance is the one who didn’t. Now, he’s going to be Donald Trump’s vice presidential pick.

Bill McCoshen:
The advantage to Vance is of the two senators that were in the finals, he and Marco Rubio, he’s not impacted by the 25th Amendment, or the 12th Amendment, so he can continue to serve…

Scot Ross:
That’s a good point.

Bill McCoshen:
…until they are sworn in. So Mike DeWine, the governor of Ohio, would not have to appoint someone until January of next year.

Scot Ross:
I’m sorry, if I just may, what’s really going to be interesting, I think, in this is from where JD Vance is, you know, where Hillbilly Elegy and stuff is, southeastern Pennsylvania, which is right next to and shares media markets with southwestern Pennsylvania. [Editor’s note: JD Vance is fronm the city of Middletown in southwest Ohio, not southeast Pennsylvania.]

Bill McCoshen:
Yeah.

Scot Ross:
Which is a key place, and I only know that ’cause I grew up there, and it is a key place for Democrats to turn out the vote in Allegheny County, which is where Pittsburgh is, and then Republicans turning out the dark, dark red places, like where I grew up and the surrounding things, and it’ll be interesting to see how like, if there’s any kind of like, “Oh, this guy’s one of us, from over in Pennsylvania,” in that thing. Normally, it doesn’t happen ’cause of the Cleveland Browns, but it might happen because of JD Vance just a little bit. And again, just a little bit could make a difference in this election.

Bill McCoshen:
We got a Steelers-Browns reference in. I like that.

Zac Schultz:
Yeah, hey, excellent for Wisconsin. That’s exactly what our audience is looking for…

Bill McCoshen:
Hey, hey, hey, come on.

Zac Schultz:
Speaking of Mike Pence, did either of you see a statement from him since Saturday?

Bill McCoshen:
I did, yeah…

Zac Schultz:
Did he…

Bill McCoshen:
He put one out Saturday…

Zac Schultz:
All right, I missed it. I wanted to double-check.

Bill McCoshen:
Yup, he did.

Zac Schultz:
OK…

Bill McCoshen:
…from him and his wife Karen. He put it out, no offense to the president, the president was in church when this happened, so there was a delay, and then he had to get to a studio, but Pence had it out before President Biden.

Zac Schultz:
In terms of unifying Republicans, can Saturday night’s events actually bring some of those “Never Trump” Republicans back? I mean, can we expect Paul Ryan, or Mike Pence, or any of those other people, like all of the former cabinet members that have said Trump’s unfit to serve again, will that change their position? Will they become quiet?

Bill McCoshen:
I think they may actually become active Trump supporters. All you have to do is look at William Barr. He was not for Donald Trump in the primary process, and now, he’s defending him fairly regularly. So I wouldn’t be surprised to see others come around as well. It’s a binary choice. It is, you can have beef, or chicken, beef being Trump, or chicken being Biden, and that’s the choice America has. You can choose dessert first, but you’re not, you’re going to go to bed hungry. You’re not going to get that choice. So it’s really a binary choice, and I think Republicans writ large will come around and understand that.

Zac Schultz:
Do you think Paul Ryan’s coming back around?

Scot Ross:
I don’t think so, and I’m sort of programmed to, of having watched Paul Ryan for 25 years, that he always sort of worms out when it comes to doing the smart, or the, I’m sorry, not the smart, but the, you know, the conscience-saving thing. I think he’s gone, but I do want to point out this, because I think it is very interesting that we’re not going to have the former Republican President George Bush show up. We’re not going to have former, we’re certainly not going to have former VP Dick Cheney show up, because Trump’s still calling for tribunals for members of the January 6th Commission in the House of Representatives. So I think that’s, that’s a big deal, the fact that there’s no former president here when there is a Republican president alive. I know that next month when we go to, when we go to Chicago, I’m sure President Obama’s going be there rallying up the troops, but they’re not happening here for George Bush…

Bill McCoshen:
But for which candidate?

Scot Ross:
The thing for George, the thing for George Bush, the thing about George Bush, is that he is that old neocon, establishment, and they don’t have a real voice for that speaking at least the program that I’ve seen so far, and that’s, who’s talking to them?

Zac Schultz:
So today, I happened to go to the Heritage event, their policy day that was held just outside the secure perimeter. I happened to see Vivek Ramaswamy speak. He talked about Project 2025, which as I know is, prior to last weekend, was like the Democrats’ big talking point. Do you think that still resonates? Is that something that can still penetrate through the media consciousness right now?

Scot Ross:
Well, if I may, here’s a list of some of the things: end to no-fault divorce, a complete nationwide abortion ban, including IVF, and no exceptions in abortion, banning contraception, ending water protections, raising retirement age, cutting Social Security and Medicare, eliminating Department of Education, tax cuts for the rich, a Muslim ban, guns in the classrooms, and pardoning all the January 6th terrorist insurrectionists. That policy thing is a goldmine for Democrats to talk to the independent and the swing voters who are going to decide this election in the battleground states, for sure…

Bill McCoshen:
Except it’s not Trump’s, and Trump has disowned it multiple times already.

Scot Ross:
There are 240 people affiliated with, between Project ’25 and the Trump administration, and the Trump team, 240 people…

Bill McCoshen:
It’s not unlike any other interest group in D.C. They have their agenda. They’re hoping to get it passed. Trump has, his agenda is Agenda 47, which is the platform the Republicans are going to approve today, and that’s it.

Scot Ross:
But there’s overlap…

Bill McCoshen:
So every time your viewers hear about Project 2025, go ahead and look it up. I’ve never looked it up. I have no idea what’s in it. I don’t know a single Republican who has looked at it, but that’s not the Republican agenda.

Zac Schultz:
But it doesn’t matter whether it is, if it can be tied to him. I guess my bigger question…

Bill McCoshen:
I don’t think it can be…

Zac Schultz:
From the landscape today is can that actually be tied to Trump anymore, or can it penetrate through, I guess…

Bill McCoshen:
I didn’t think it could…

Zac Schultz:
…what we saw on television?

Bill McCoshen:
…be tied to him before Saturday night, and I think there’s even less of a chance that it can be tied to him now. He’s going to talk about his agenda on Thursday night, the things that are important to him, which he thinks are in alignment with voters in America, and that’s what people ought to take home is what he says.

Scot Ross:
I mean, in politics, perception is reality, and the Democrats are going to continue to bang this, and they should, because even if there’s like some places, this tiny little Venn diagram, where the Republic, where Trump’s agenda is outside of the Heritage — it’s small. The meat of this is blue and yellow making green, that’s for sure, and, I just want, page 451: “The only valid family is a working father married to a stay-at-home mother and their children.” Like this is like madness, you know? This is like 19th century stuff. This is not where America is. We are a much different country than, we’re a better country than that, and I think that hanging the agenda of Project 2025 around Trump’s neck in 2024 is a good move, because people are opposed to that agenda…

Bill McCoshen:
I feel pretty good about that. If Democrats’ best argument is some special interest group’s agenda to use against the president, I think we’re in pretty good shape.

Zac Schultz:
Part of why I bring this up is basically since Trump came down the escalator in 2015, he has defied every political death sentence that has been out there in terms of, “I cannot believe a candidate did that. He’ll have to drop out of the race. He’ll have to drop out of it.” Over and over and over again, he has defied gravity in the political realm, and been able to move the conversation onto the next thing, and I’m wondering if in this era, with social media, and how fast thing, and we just had a new VP pick come out today, how much will Saturday carry over 100 days from now, and how many more things will we be talking about in between there, and what will stick in voters’ minds?

Bill McCoshen:
There will be a lot. I mean, if we would’ve asked 60 days ago what are the four, or five things that will change this race, neither of us would’ve said a horrific debate performance, or an attempted assassination. It wouldn’t have made either of our lists. Yet they happen, right? So expect the unexpected, but I don’t foresee anything changing the trajectory of this race, unless Democrats replace Joe Biden. Then we’ll see.

Zac Schultz:
Do you think that there’s going to be enough things that the Butler, Pennsylvania rally is not going to be the dominant theme all the way through Election Day?

Scot Ross:
Yeah, I mean, again, I think the discussion about violence is going to continue, most notably because I fear that Trump will not stop with his inflections and suggestions of that, as he has throughout, again, since he came down the escalator in June 2015. But we’ll have three or four different races between now and then. Something will happen, and like you said, again, the normalization of some of this activity, or at least the perception that there’s so much, that’s why it drives liberals like me crazy when like Biden has one bad debate, so we have to get rid of him, and Trump says, you know, 16 things before I get up for breakfast that make me go, “Oh my God, where am I at?” You know, so…

Zac Schultz:
But he has been quiet recently. I mean, how much of that is, is that Trump waking up to realizing, “Hey, maybe I should, if I’m quiet, then the other guy will do it for me”?

Bill McCoshen:
Well, I think he and his team, I give Chris LaCivita, his campaign manager, and Susie Wiles, his deputy campaign manager, a heck of a lot of credit. I mean, Trump wasn’t known for his discipline in 2016 or 2020 as a candidate. This time, he’s been very disciplined all the way through the primary process and particularly after the debate. The old Trump would’ve sort of stepped on that story and thrown Joe Biden a lifeline. He didn’t. He let it, that story lasted two full weeks.

Zac Schultz:
Because Trump was silent.

Bill McCoshen:
Because Trump was silent, and it was devastating and destabilizing for the Biden campaign, and I don’t think they’ll recover.

Scot Ross:
I mean, I think he did in his performance before NATO and his hour-long taking of questions from reporters, aggressive questions from some of the most aggressive reporters in the business, you know? And so, I think that’s a non-issue. But what I will say is that from last Thursday, it’s been 154 days as of last Thursday where Trump stood before reporters and took questions. When is that going to end? Because, again, it’s that discipline. I mean, I totally get it, but once he gets in front of reporters, like it goes out the window for sure, because he gets defensive, he gets angry, he says terrible things, and that’s, you know, and so, we’re going to have to see. At some point, he’s going to have to do an interview with you all at some point, because he hasn’t in 160 days.

Zac Schultz:
When you mentioned the violent rhetoric, and we’ve heard a lot of rhetoric on, now, this is true of both sides. There have been Democrats saying that, you know, Trump is the next Hitler with Project 2025, and the dictator for a day, and we’ve heard Trump use violent rhetoric about, you know, “Proud Boys, stand by,” and…

Bill McCoshen:
Biden said, “Put him in the bullseye” — so I’m not blaming Biden for what happened Thursday night…

Zac Schultz:
But it’s been, it’s not just one party that’s used rhetoric that is inflammatory…

Bill McCoshen:
Correct.

Zac Schultz:
…in the last few years. The reason I bring this up is today I heard from both Newt Gingrich speaking to the Wisconsin delegation at the breakfast and from Ramaswamy at the Heritage Foundation, who both said we were within a couple inches of a possible civil war. Is that not inflammatory in and of itself to say that if the bullet had hit and killed Donald Trump that we would be in a civil war? I mean, is that a possibility, or is it even responsible to mention that as an alternative?

Bill McCoshen:
I would’ve preferred they not say it that way. I think America, I’m not sure how we would’ve recovered if the president had, former president had been assassinated. I mean, we are too young to know when that happened, 1963. So I’m hoping that we never see that in our lifetime, or in my children’s lifetime. That would have unbelievable consequences, and I don’t know what those are. I’m not going to speculate on what those may be. I wouldn’t have chosen those words, but I think, again, Trump survived literally by centimeters. He’s got an unbelievable opportunity to put some distance between him and Joe Biden on Thursday night.

Zac Schultz:
Are we that close, were we that close to civil war?

Scot Ross:
I think it was, if you looked at the internet for 10 appalling minutes after all the stuff happened, it was pretty clear that things are ugly at this point. This may turn it down a little bit. Let’s see what the Republicans offer here. If they offer a bold vision of positivity for the future of America, that might take it down a notch. If it is ugly, and nasty, and things we’ve seen in the past, I fear, because, again, like we don’t want, politics, there’s no place in politics, there’s no place in America for violence, and there’s certainly no place in politics for it. And yes, there is inflammatory rhetoric, and these are people, and it is people’s lives at stake for sure. Like the quality, if you’re a trans person in America, you should fear the fact that, of the things that Trump said. If you’re a woman who wants to have abortion rights, you know, you should fear what’s going on with the Republicans, because Trump got rid of Roe v. Wade as he, as he bragged. And so, I think that it’s really, really important. The stakes are high, but violence is never the answer. It’s not going to be the answer in this election, and hopefully, we’ve seen the last of it.

Zac Schultz:
So we have just a couple minutes left. Let’s try and end on a little of a positive up note after all of the necessary talk-

Scot Ross:
Lunch is here?

Bill McCoshen:
Yeah.

Zac Schultz:
What are you looking forward to? What’s a positive thing that will come about from this week, either for Milwaukee, the state, for Trump, for the delegates? What are you looking for?

Bill McCoshen:
I’m obviously most looking forward to Trump’s speech on Thursday night, but I’ll tell you my two sidelights. I can’t wait to hear what Ron DeSantis and Nikki Haley have to say. I think it was very smart of the Trump team to put those two in the speaking lineup. They were his strongest competitors in the primary. They bring different things to the table. I think they help unify the party. So I’m really looking forward to hear what Ron DeSantis and Nikki Haley have to say, and my guess is their message will be, “We got to get this done. The choice is, it’s a serious choice. We need to come together. We can’t sit home, because we don’t necessarily agree with everything our nominee does, or says.” But that’s what I’m looking for is what they have to say, and I think that’s going to happen tomorrow night.

Zac Schultz:
What are the positive, or bright notes you’re looking forward to this week?

Scot Ross:
Well, I’m looking to see the sort of rhetoric that comes out, on a policy tip, that convinces independent voters that they have to stick with the Democratic president. That’s the thing that I think is most important, see what they’re talking about up there in terms of the things that are going to make those voters who are going to decide this election, you know, whether or not it turns them off, or turns them on. I think it’s going to turn them off.

Zac Schultz:
In terms of Milwaukee, could this be a better platform in terms of showcasing this city to the country? I mean, the weather, the way the downtown looks, I mean, what’s your impression, having both of you being familiar with this city?

Bill McCoshen:
I’m proud of Milwaukee. I’m proud of Wisconsin. I’m glad it’s here. I wish the Democrats could have actually been here in person in 2020. I think it’s good for the city. I think it’ll help us attract other major events, like an NBA All-Star Game, or maybe an MLB All-Star Game a second time. We had one at Miller Park at the beginning. So I think it’s great for the city, it’s great for the state, and regardless of which jersey you wear, red, or blue, this is a green event.

Zac Schultz:
What do you think?

Scot Ross:
Oh, I agree, yeah, obviously, I agree. This has been a great showcase for Milwaukee. Hopefully, it continues to be a great showcase for Milwaukee, and, you know, go, Milwaukee.

Zac Schultz:
All right, well, we’ll leave it there today. Bill, Scot, thank you so much for your insights.

Bill McCoshen:
See you tomorrow.

Scot Ross:
Thank you.

Zac Schultz:
All right, and thank you for watching this special presentation of Here & Now‘s 2024 election coverage. Be sure to come back tomorrow. You’ll find us here each day this week, and tune into PBS’s evening convention coverage, where Here & Now will have another update on the day’s events. Finally, join us on Friday to wrap up the whole week, where we’ll hear from our guests yet again, and we’ll have a special one-hour presentation of Here & Now starting at 7:00. I’m Zac Schultz, have a great day, and we will see you here tomorrow. Thanks.